i tried the search button but i couldnt find anything. What all do you need to do to your motor to redline as high as 10,000 or 11,000 RPM's? just out of curiosity... if anyone could clue me in on what you need to do, that would be tight. thanks

 

i know springs, valves, retainers.... but i just wanted to learn more about how it works and all that

 

crazy strong rods

 

what's the point........

 

wow talk about blowing a motor!

 

unless ur making power its pointless unless u want ur mtr to break something

 

Something with an un-Godly short stroke.

...Just save up a poop-load of money and buy an F1 or motorcycle motor.

 

if you dont answer his posted question to some degree, then why post? he said he was curious and wanted more knowlege on how it works, he didn't say he was going out and doing it.

 

aside from all the smart *** answeres you got, its actually very possible to spin that high. You definetly need valvetrain that will handle those rev's and not let a valve float on you. Bottom end wise yes you will definetly need faith!lol and strong rods that something doesnt let go but that can be helped out by a tighter bearing clearance....and for all the jack asses that say its not possible then check any of the NA drag cars and see where they spin to and you'll definetly know that 11k is cake. Just dont think to be spinning that high for lengthly periods of time, only good for a few runs and thats it.

 

Titanium valves will go along way, so will roller rockers or the new aluminium vtec killers. Titanium rods will help alot with making power up there, or freeing up power up there. If you can make power to 12K, you will have one fast car. Good porting will help with that as well. Has anyone actually gone out and tried to make power up to 11-12K? If you haven't tried how can you claim it's not possible? Many things are "impossible". ("Everything thats possible will be done, things that are impossible, just takes a bit longer")

I think you would actually want a looser bearing clearance at the bottom if I remember correctly.

I agree that you can't carry on spinning 11 or 12K for a long time however you should be able to do it many many times if you do it in a responsible way. <- now and then when needed.

My opinion.

EDIT: I Assume we are talking about B16's here, not sure if it's a good idea in a longer stroke motor.

 

Everytime your engine rotates once each piston has changed direction twice. So if you do the math, 4 pistons rotating 11,000 per minute comes out to like 88,000 times your pistons will change direction in one minute, or 1466 times per second.

With this said the weight of the pistons is critical!!! Everytime you have some mass in the engine changing direction you can assign a mass value. Therefore every gram you take off the pistons will save you 1466 grams every second you stay at 11,000 RPM.

So you need a really strong rod and a really light piston configuration.

-Peace

 

for those of you who said it would be dumb or pointless... idk where your getting your info from. your toruqe gains will be so much more if you can get your car to redline that high... i raced(i was in a 2g DSM AWD turbo, modded ) a civic coupe... the car red lined at 11,5 and off the line and up to about 60 we didnt have much on the guy, and his set up was all motor. it just seems like something cool to do, thanks for the input guys... ill let you know how it turns out

 

I doubt he was actually turning it to 11.5, sounds like bench racing BS to me.

 

I thought that the Spoon race motor spins to liek 16k?

 

I know of two motors spinning to 12 and making power to 11.5k of course these are full drag motors but it is possible...they are two top names in the industry as well and all on 2.0L at that. Anyone who believed that Spoon gemic is silly...

 

short stroke

titanium rods

good r/s ratio

fuel that wont be out run by the piston before its burned at a high RPM

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by drobinson &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Something with an un-Godly short stroke.

...Just save up a poop-load of money and buy an F1 or motorcycle motor. </TD></TR></TABLE>

D.Rob... you did not just say buy an F1 motor. If any of us had money for one... we'd be driving it at our test track right now. Not sure of the stroke of an F1 motor though but it's a 3.0L V10. Our Honda B-Series motors don't exactly have the valvetrain of an F1 engine either. We still have valves to do the dirty work of letting air and fuel into the chamber at that ungodly rate.

SO... in conclusion... I think it would be freaking amazing if an independent like yourself could build a motor to go to 11,000 rpm. If you don't have patience to build it several times to find the right combination or deep pockets to do this, don't look into it much.

 

f1 motors the new ones can rev to 18k but the stroke on these motors are super short.
if you can make power past 10k more power to ya. i hope you have a big bank account or something

 

it seems like to me one of the weaknesses would be the rocker assembly in the B series. shoot, why not stay VTEC and use the SPOON rockers while we have deep pockets... get some Ti rods, lighten the valvetrain, go with a lighter piston, open the bearing clearances a bit, how much I could only speculate and have that head ported by a champ, throw on some ITBs. you would definately benefit from shorter gearing... something like a 4.93 with all ATS cross gears at the least... proper fueling... tuning would be fun... get a sick RM cam I dont even know how big they get, I havent put a race motor together in my life. haha... im lucky if my motor is still making 175 at the tire

 

sort of OT, but i believe some, if not all F1 cars use pnuematic valves in place of conventional metal springs, due to the extremely high revs (19000rpm).

 

No, they use a little nitrogen chamber that acts as a spring, so only the valvesprings are replaced, the valves are titanium, and the cams are hollow, but they are still pretty much conventional. Strokes are around 45mm, with R/S ratio's of 2:1 or more. Endurance motors usually have high R/S ratio motors. F1 might only run for 2-3 hours or so, but to beat it like that for 2-3 hours (next year many more) takes some hardcore engineering, so if a 12Krpm honda motor only lasts 10 passes or whatever, we need to look at "why" they aren't lasting long enough.

 

Sorry if my previous reply came off rude, I'm simply asking the question of "Why?"

Why try to make a motor like that and spend way too much money, instead of building a motor that makes more power at a lower RPM. Lower RPM's make for more longevity, or so I always thought.

...I mean, I like my B16 spinning to 9k, but I'd like it even more if it made more power at say 7800 RPM.

Just my two cents.

 

i drive a spoon motor to 16k daily..... common problem of over heating and the pistons seizing up in the cylinders. Nothing i cant fix wtih a hammer and some duct tape...... when it starts shooting white smoke and fire that means its going real fast.

The goal is to rev less and make more power. Or you could be the coolest kid in school and blow your motor because you rev to useless heights.
Buy an old corolla, you could rev like you want

those of you talking about 2.0l drag cars, your comparing apples to oranges. 11k cannot be reached easily and is not a good idea for a street car. The pistons speeds, the heat, the tuning. You would just be setting your self up for a very small margin for error. Even temp change could = desaster... sounds like a good idea to me..

 

simple rule of thumb is the lower the displacement the higher rpm's you want to make the same power, the reason F1 motors make power up at 19krpm is to make more of it.

Same principal applies to your small B16. Also the more rpm's you pull the longer the powerband gets, this is crucial for road/track racing.

 

honda CBR