What do you think is the best way on a tri Y header to arange the pipes into the collector. If the cilinders were numberd:
1,2,3,4.... Would you do 1,2 & 3,4 .......1,4 & 2,3......1,3 & 2,4...... Please help me out thanks. DID I miss one?

 

Depends on the firing order. Look in an exhaust design book or contact Burns Stainless or Headers By Ed for a header design.

 

Check this out .A few years ago A guy said he had a header that made good power for a B- motor .So I went over to his shop and watch him dyno this header.It was a SMSP 4-2-1 (That was very nice looking) but it was 1-2,3-4 not 1-4,2-3.I thought that was different.So I made a header that I could change the 2 into 1 collector to go ether
way.And dynoed it both ways .And it didn't change not one H.P.So I put a 4 into 1
merge collector with a megaphone on it, and it went up almost 5 H.P. This was on a stock B-16.

 

LOL thats cool. Thanks for the info

 

Randy of course has his opinions and we have ours. This is not intended to start an argument or a debate .

On a properly designed tri Y header you need to pair the cylinders that have a 180 degree firing separation hence 1-4 3-2.

Why do you think people go through so much trouble on making a set of 180 degree (pairing cylidners from opposing banks) headers on a v8.

What im saying is that unpaired cylinders may work fine with an incorrect header design but with the proper design and paired cylinders you are going to yield more hp

 

I read that somewhere. It is supposed to constantly keep each collector firing helping out with the vacume. I got curios when I started looking at headers and they are all diff.

 

we only recommend doing it one way for it to function properly with our design

 

and that is the way you stated earlier?

 

Casey yes I do have my own opinion .And I do have facts .The way this got started with me is.This guy came by our shop to dyno his racecar .Its one of those formula cars with a 1000cc motor cycle engine in it .He said he just got a factory kawasaki header that they spent millions of hours on and nothing made more power.So I got up on the dyno and looked at it .And it was hooked up1-2,3-4
so Iasked him about and he called the people he got it from .They said he had it wrong so we switched it and dynoed again .Exactly the same HP .It looked like a carbon copy.So I took a 4into 1 merge collector and welded a megaphone on it .and tried that.On his primaries and it went up between 1/2 and 1 HP all the way up never lost .So that's when I did the B-16 tri y deal.Have you ever tried switching them for the heck of it? Try it you might be surprised and 180s sound
badass but they dont make as much power as a conventional 4 into 1 The biggest reason is 42 " is as short as you can get them.Same thing with 8 into 1

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by eLusive ek4 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
On a properly designed tri Y header you need to pair the cylinders that have a 180 degree firing separation hence
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The seperation is 180 degrees CRANK rotation, so once #2 fires, how far does the crank rotate before #1 fires????? #3 fires, how far does the crank rotate before #4 fires??????

180 degrees

Firing order 1-3-4-2-1-3-4-2-1-3-4-2

So #2 and #1 get paired, along with #3 and #4..........

Weird thing, both Dave @ SMSP and John at @ Hytech, they agree one this.

The MASS market off the shelf headers that pair the 1-4 and 3-2 do slow to delay the pulses since the street car see lower rpm's. The minor torque boost in was the customer wants, seat of the pants feel.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mista Bone &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

The seperation is 180 degrees CRANK rotation, so once #2 fires, how far does the crank rotate before #1 fires????? #3 fires, how far does the crank rotate before #4 fires??????

180 degrees

Firing order 1-3-4-2-1-3-4-2-1-3-4-2

So #2 and #1 get paired, along with #3 and #4..........

Weird thing, both Dave @ SMSP and John at @ Hytech, they agree one this.

The MASS market off the shelf headers that pair the 1-4 and 3-2 do slow to delay the pulses since the street car see lower rpm's. The minor torque boost in was the customer wants, seat of the pants feel.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hmmm funny thing is i have seen jon pair cylinders a # of different ways.

Pairing cylinders doesnt deal with rpm and slowing pulses the length is going to dictate how long it takes the pulse to travel down the tube along with diameter and other variables.

Not to be a dick but i dont think your jon or dave so let them speak up, just like randy did i value everyones opinion and there way of doing things if it work is really cool.

firing order is

1-3-4-2

Im sorry my mistake of whats written above i meant 360 firing separation, andf cylinders fire 180 degrees apart

cylinder 1 = 180

Cylinder 3 = 180

Cylinder 4 = 180 Pair 1-4 360 degrees apart

Cylinder 2 = 180 pair cylinders 2-3 360 Degrees apart.

With pairing the cylinders 1-2 and 3-4 you can get an odd fire motor similar to a v8

I'm not saying it cant be done thise way all i was saying is we prefer the other

like i said we have ours that works correctlly with our design

 

some good info

 

from my understanding of it, pairing 1 and 3 would result in a heartbeat like rhythm. boom.boom................boom.boom................

Whereas pairing 1/4 and 3/2 would produce a constant beat
boom.......booom.......boom.......boom.......

the mighty TODA header utilizes the 1/4 3/2 design. With equal length primaries seems like cylinder 1 would be helping cylinder 4 just as much as vice versa.

 

what rpm band are the headers tuned for???????

Your boom...boom.....................................bo om...boom tuning is correct on the 1-2 amd 3-4 tuning.

the 1-2 "boom...boom" pulse as it hit the 2-1 collector with help scavenge the 3-4 pipes at higher (above 4000) rpms........

Then the 3-4 "boom...boom" will scavenge the 1-2 pipes.

 

That makes sense. My motor revs to like 9,000.00

 

well then it will be a very short tri Y if you like i can design you up a nice ehader that you can then build yourself

 

I would Love that as an Xmas present. But i HAVE NO $$$$$

 

???

 

both pairings's are "right"...............depending on what RPM band your tuning for........

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mista Bone &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">both pairings's are "right"...............depending on what RPM band your tuning for........

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how do you figure an odd fire pairing is right how are you going to size the collector outlet in comparison