Just recently I've have been seeing lots of old model cars that back in the days were the ****. I started to wonder, the cars that are made today are by far huge improvments of its older models (functionallitly wise). Like for example:

DC2 to DC5
RX-7 to RX8
300 ZX (TT) to 350Z

but doesn't It seems that the old models have more pontential, than the newer models. I mean in all aspects.

Just a topic that has been in my mind for a while, and wanted to share

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by liquidscor00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">... the cars that are made today are by far huge improvments of its older models (functionallitly wise)... </TD></TR></TABLE>

you really think so?

One could argue that many of these so-called "modern" cars are nothing more than watered down versions of their purer ancestors.

DC-5 - yeah, it's got an amazing motor, but the suspension just isn't what it used to be

350Z - overweight pig compared to the original Z car, and underpowered compared to the twin turbo model

RX-8 vs FD - ummmm, no comparison. The FD Rx-7 was a hardcore near supercar, with no design compromises. The RX8 is a four door GT tourer, that doesn't have near the power and agility of it's predecessor.


Face it, modern cars are good, but might not be the "huge improvement" that you think they are...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Philly_NBP_R &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">350Z - overweight pig compared to the original Z car, and underpowered compared to the twin turbo model</TD></TR></TABLE>

I suggest you go drive a 350z and a 300Z TT.... the 350 is down 10-15hp, but its got a fantastic powerband and handles much better than the 300Z.

 

more tuning will be available as the newer models gain in age. more aftermarket support.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
and handles much better than the 300Z.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I thought that it felt like an overweight pig. It weighs more than a C5 Vette...and feels like it. I also didn't think that the 300Z's felt all that great either...

 

DC5 is head and shoulders above the DC2 (non type-R) when it comes to chassis refinement, interior and powertrain. However, the suspension does leave something to be desired.

I guarantee that if the DC5 would have had the suspension setup that the TSX or TL has, 75% of the DC2 owners would have unloaded their cars in 2002.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I suggest you go drive a 350z and a 300Z TT.... the 350 is down 10-15hp, but its got a fantastic powerband and handles much better than the 300Z.</TD></TR></TABLE>

That...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PY 01-0972 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">more tuning will be available as the newer models gain in age. more aftermarket support.</TD></TR></TABLE>

and that.

The old 300ZX was a pig too, you realize. Of the cars listed there, the 350Z is the most capable, and probably the one that "stuck to its roots" the most.

 

I agree, I've seen most of these cars against each other and the older models are just more lenient. My friend has a 300ZX TT and he went against a SC 350Z, he took the 350 by a car and a half. Its true that the RX-7 could easily be called a supercar. The new RX-8 just doesn't have what its big bro had. It's a shame, but like someone said, with more age more possibilities will open. One hopes to guess.

Lets take the DC2 overall with the DC5. I would always prefer the DC2 over the DC5, the cockpit feels like a race car. The overall experience with the DC2 is more gratifying. Also the DC2 has had lots of different hybird (LSVtec, CRVtec, B20Turbo, H22 swaps)

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by sscguy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The old 300ZX was a pig too, you realize. Of the cars listed there, the 350Z is the most capable, and probably the one that "stuck to its roots" the most. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I was going to mention that the Z32 was a pig too... as for potential.. those cars are all very different. It's hard to say which stuck to it's roots more. The 350 weighs way too much, period. Aside from not having a 4 door model, the RSX carries the same function that the integra always has, an affordable, economic civic with an Acura emblem.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by liquidscor00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

but doesn't It seems that the old models have more pontential, than the newer models. I mean in all aspects.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

maybe it just seems like there is more potential because people have already disected (sp?) the older cars and we know what they can do... and as far as the newer cars, just haven't experimented enough yet...just my .02cents

 

It's weird how the car manufacturers work. It's like the old Porsche 962 protoype's. If they kept going with it, I couldn't imagine how racing would be. Now they went to slower prototypes such as the Daytona Prototype. I guess it just goes up and down in the car business. They hit the top with a sick car, and then they start all over again. In my opinion, that's how it looks like.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM Factor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It's weird how the car manufacturers work. It's like the old Porsche 962 protoype's. </TD></TR></TABLE>

You're thinking of the 917 prototypes.

And drivers were getting killed.

 

No..the 962's.. If you want to talk about safety, that's in a hole different ballpark. Basically many of the older models, such as the 333sp's the old 787B's had much more power than most of the prototypes driven today. Even street cars.

 

The 962's never pushed the envelope like the 917's did. The 917's were the ones pushing over 1,000 hp (no one really knows, the dynos couldnt read them) and nearly killed mark donohue.

Yes they had more power - the top Le Mans cars now are limited to 600-700 hp for driver safety - to be honest, I dont think they really need more. 333 and 787 street cars? wtf?

 

forget those newbies, where the hell is the SUPRA?

 

You know your history on 917's you wanna cookie! I'm just talking about how it goes up and down in the car business. They make a fast car one year and a slow car the next. Im not talking about safety.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The 962's never pushed the envelope like the 917's did. The 917's were the ones pushing over 1,000 hp (no one really knows, the dynos couldnt read them) and nearly killed mark donohue.

Yes they had more power - the top Le Mans cars now are limited to 600-700 hp for driver safety - to be honest, I dont think they really need more. 333 and 787 street cars? wtf?</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by liquidscor00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
DC2 to DC5
RX-7 to RX8
300 ZX (TT) to 350Z </TD></TR></TABLE>

Pass the crack.
DC5 sucks. Struts.. . no thanks.
The RX7 is a classic. Badass car. But the RX8 is a piece of 4 door slow ****.
350Z... it weighs 900lbs more than an ITR. Thats like having 6 of your friends piled into your car. F that.

I think every once in awhile car makers make a real car. But most everything else sucks.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Todd00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I guarantee that if the DC5 would have had the suspension setup that the TSX or TL has, 75% of the DC2 owners would have unloaded their cars in 2002.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well said..... I don't think I could have put it any better myself.

Honda/Acura is listening tho.... I mean or they wouldn't have made all the improvements for the '05 model....

But it's still a "band-aid over a piece of crap"

RA who laffed till he nearly farted after hearing the above quoted term when bringing his car (Civic) to the bodyshop....

 

dc5
rx-8
350z

dc2
rx-7
300zx

designers these days are like a herd of sheep everyone just wants to fit in;ie. keep their job; ie. not get eaten by a wolf. for *********

 

Nissan stuck the same motor in just pig they have on the market now

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Philly_NBP_R &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

you really think so?

One could argue that many of these so-called "modern" cars are nothing more than watered down versions of their purer ancestors.

DC-5 - yeah, it's got an amazing motor, but the suspension just isn't what it used to be</TD></TR></TABLE>

100% agree with you.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM Factor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You know your history on 917's you wanna cookie! I'm just talking about how it goes up and down in the car business. They make a fast car one year and a slow car the next. Im not talking about safety.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

No, cars got progressively faster and faster through the 70's and 80's... there were very few rules restrictions.

Things didnt slow down until the 80's, and have been been kept in check since then for the most part in terms of HP - but they are still going faster, but with much better safety equipment. Looking back on it, those cars in Lemans being run by amateurs in today's standards, going 250mph - was nothing short of insane.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nightrider &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">forget those newbies, where the hell is the SUPRA? </TD></TR></TABLE>

2 years or less, my friend... but ye, i blieve that the reason why theyre not making the muscle cars as fast as they used to is cuz of environmental issues.. pollution n sht. and the US market is gettin mad **** about smog.. californians would know but we desire more HP, and damn right, we'll pollute the air! haha

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JinDIESEL &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

2 years or less, my friend... but ye, i blieve that the reason why theyre not making the muscle cars as fast as they used to is cuz of environmental issues.. pollution n sht. and the US market is gettin mad **** about smog.. californians would know but we desire more HP, and damn right, we'll pollute the air! haha</TD></TR></TABLE>

Waking and baking again?

New Mustang
Chrysler 300C
New Vette
Viper
Dodge Magnum
Pontiac GTO
Sti
EVO8/MR

Are definitely muscle car status as compared to our cars either out of the box or with minimal work.

And if you're blinded by EPA and environmental issues how can you explain all the SUV's and PU's and Soccer mom land tanks that are out there and keep being sold and bought.

It's not environmental issues. That's B.S.

It's market segments and which piece of the pie each company cares to own. Honda makes **** loads more money with the Accord than the NSX. That's not the environment, that's economics.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">No, cars got progressively faster and faster through the 70's and 80's... there were very few rules restrictions.

Things didnt slow down until the 80's, and have been been kept in check since then for the most part in terms of HP - but they are still going faster, but with much better safety equipment. Looking back on it, those cars in Lemans being run by amateurs in today's standards, going 250mph - was nothing short of insane.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I was just reading something in european car about the Goodwood Festival of Speed. Jacques Villeneuve was driving a Ferrari 312 T3 from the '78 Canadian GP, and said, "This is the one and only time I'm going to drive it. It feels incredibly fragile. There's nothing here (grabbing the side panels). I guess I'm used to driving safe racing cars." This coming from a pro... It's not a Porsche, but the idea is the same.