Can I make a VIR thread?

and if anyone is willing to comment has anyone tried taking the "new line" in the section before the pit entry?

I went there recently and have gotten an addiction to the course.

 

Would this "new line" be the one where you do it right and go fast, or the one where you lift and hit the inside wall?

While discussing "new lines" at VIR, in total seriousness here, has anyone ever tried the "Rim Shot" around Oak Tree and made it work?

 

Is this for a specific event or just the track in general?

 

I would like to talk about the track in general.

Do you guys use the gator in T4 help rotate the car?

And whats the right line for oak tree? I have only done the Full course once when it was above freezing and my instructor had never been to the track before.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by vbspec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Do you guys use the gator in T4 help rotate the car?
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T4 a.k.a. Left Hook. I like that section. It feels pretty sweet when you nail it or it feels like complete *** if you don't. T4 is a late turn in to set you up for T5. From my experience with it, you will wanna go past the point that you "think" you should turn in. It's a late apex. If you turn in too early, you end up on the inside going into T5, which is where you do not wanna be. You run out of room in a hurry there. Turn in late. T4 has a little inside berm to it that you can "hook" if you hit it right. If you do, then you will end up on the outside going into T5 which is where you want to be. Sets you up and makes T5a and all the way up to T6a so much easier.

I wanna thank "Hooch'n" for teaching me that section.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by vbspec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I would like to talk about the track in general.

Do you guys use the gator in T4 help rotate the car?

And whats the right line for oak tree? I have only done the Full course once when it was above freezing and my instructor had never been to the track before.</TD></TR></TABLE>

well from what I learned oak tree is a late apex. i finally got it right one sassion and realized there was a open space in that tire barrier

 

T5 gator for rotation, yes, T4 for rotation = bad idea, if possible even. I don't like turning in late for T4 either. The "traditional" student line is to turn in late, then keep the car tight up against the left side of the track before turning in for T5. I don't see much reason to do that, and was much faster with an earlier turn-in and shooting for the T5 gator. Then I would hit that gator just as I'm turning the steering wheel, and would rotate just right to be set up for T6. You do have to get the timing right, but once you do, man, that became my favorite corner. Dave Martin helped me get that, I wouldn't have figured it out on my own FWIW, I think both of my students preferred this line as well, and definitely caught people coming into T6.

Oak Tree- I'm still working on this one myself, but what I have so far is this: Coming up the hill for T11 into the braking zone, finish braking and shoot straight for the left curbing before that last turn of Oak Tree (onto the back straight). [Do NOT meander all the way around that turn, following the left side, it is ******* slow] Go all the way to the curbing, then turn in hard, apexing at the right-side gator just by the flag station there. You have to point yourself right and turn-in at the appropriate time, or else you have a good chance of going off (turning in too early or too late). I don't have a good marker for that off the top of my head. I'm interested in hearing suggestions from some more experienced people on that one.

Any other turn questions? I'm interested in a T3 discussion, mostly for a good turn-in marker. How about T16?


Modified by Stinkycheezmonky at 11:29 AM 9/10/2007

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Stinkycheezmonky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">T5 gator for rotation, yes, T4 for rotation = bad idea, if possible even. I don't like turning in late for T4 either. The "traditional" student line is to turn in late, then keep the car tight up against the right side of the track before turning in for T5. I don't see much reason to do that, and was much faster with an earlier turn-in and shooting for the T5 gator. Then I would hit that gator just as I'm turning the steering wheel, and would rotate just right to be set up for T6. You do have to get the timing right, but once you do, man, that became my favorite corner. Dave Martin helped me get that, I wouldn't have figured it out on my own FWIW, I think both of my students preferred this line as well, and definitely caught people coming into T6.

Oak Tree- I'm still working on this one myself, but what I have so far is this: Coming up the hill for T11 into the braking zone, finish braking and shoot straight for the left curbing before that last turn of Oak Tree (onto the back straight). [Do NOT meander all the way around that turn, following the left side, it is ******* slow] Go all the way to the curbing, then turn in hard, apexing at the right-side gator just by the flag station there. You have to point yourself right and turn-in at the appropriate time, or else you have a good chance of going off (turning in too early or too late). I don't have a good marker for that off the top of my head. I'm interested in hearing suggestions from some more experienced people on that one.

Any other turn questions? I'm interested in a T3 discussion, mostly for a good turn-in marker. How about T16? </TD></TR></TABLE>

yeah My instructor was trying to tell me (and as well as the cheif in the classroom session) that T4 was all late apex . I was kinda treating it in between such. I was late apexing, but I was in the middle of the track before t5 and not all the way right or left


the line you said for oak tree was what my instructor showed me, was kinda annoying at first, but when i saw that it really worked it was pretty cool

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Stinkycheezmonky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">T5 gator for rotation, yes, T4 for rotation = bad idea, if possible even. I don't like turning in late for T4 either. The "traditional" student line is to turn in late, then keep the car tight up against the right ???? side of the track before turning in for T5. I don't see much reason to do that, and was much faster with an earlier turn-in and shooting for the T5 gator. Then I would hit that gator just as I'm turning the steering wheel, and would rotate just right to be set up for T6. You do have to get the timing right, but once you do, man, that became my favorite corner. Dave Martin helped me get that, I wouldn't have figured it out on my own FWIW, I think both of my students preferred this line as well, and definitely caught people coming into T6.
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I have been turning in a little earlier than the school line putting my left front on the gator at the apex. Then just as the car settles after the bump (the car is track left at this point) I start my turn in for T5. and its flat from there..

 

Whoops, that was a typo, should've been LEFT side of the track. Ideally, you want to really have the gas down hard before turning in for T5. Using the T5 gator as your means of rotation allows you to get on it a little earlier and really build up speed there. Just to throw this out there, my laptimes were ~2:22-23, in basically an H2 LP car.

 

VIR rules!

As with any track, there are a few tricks here and there. A lot depends on your setup and driving style too. I'm running a different line now in certain corners then I was when I only had 160whp, which was different from when I only had 90whp.

I've got tons of VIR video's. Here's my favorite so far:
http://dwhrf.com/don/videos/VI...6.wmv

 

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Stinkycheezmonky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Any other turn questions? I'm interested in a T3 discussion, mostly for a good turn-in marker. How about T16?
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In T3, I setup mid-track through 2a, then aim for the tech shed on throttle to the outside right of the track. I do a light brake to settle and then turn in and aim my oil pan for the gators on T3. If I miss the gators, I'm in the dirt. If I hit it right, my left side tires will catch and I slide through till the right side gators catch me on the straight.

I've been playing around with shifting to 4th through 2a and keeping it till T4 or shifting to 4th through 2a and then downshifting going into T3. Trying to stay in 3rd, I'm bouncing the rev limiter from T2a all the way to T3. Trying to downshift though going into T3 makes it a very busy corner.

For T16, I shortshift to 4th and basically sacrifice that corner and start my run for the front straight at 17.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by cafcwest &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
While discussing "new lines" at VIR, in total seriousness here, has anyone ever tried the "Rim Shot" around Oak Tree and made it work?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

I've never drove VIR in my CRX, but in my other car I started with the rim shot and ended up going in mid track trail braking a little to rotate the car (my track car has big rotation issues, not a Honda) This will get me out to the edge of the track and give me a straigh to do the final bit of braking to set the front end and make the last part of the turn kinda like a right hand version of turn 4

 

Don, for T16, where do you do your braking? The "student/instructor" line I was always shown was to brake in a straight line before 16, then turn in. The alternative that turned out to be faster for me was to stay on the gas, turn in, then brake right as I'm coming to the curbing on the left side of T16.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Stinkycheezmonky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Don, for T16, where do you do your braking? The "student/instructor" line I was always shown was to brake in a straight line before 16, then turn in. The alternative that turned out to be faster for me was to stay on the gas, turn in, then brake right as I'm coming to the curbing on the left side of T16.</TD></TR></TABLE>I just watched some of videos to be sure. I've been braking and short-shifting right before turning in. Then basically coasting to the apex of T16, touch the gators with my left tire till the car settles, then easing on the throttle going into 17.
I think I understand what your doing, but I would feel uneasy braking and hitting the curbing at the same time. I think/guess it would have a tendency to throw out the rear of my car if done too late.

Now coming in T14, I stay on the gas till my butt puckers, then turn-in and brake using the hill, aiming straight for the apex of T14a (I think most people call this the 'race line'). If I scrub enough speed, I will turn out to the right side some to sweep into T14a. If not, I hit the apex square, kill the corner and work on setting up 16. To non-VIR veterans, if you hit 16 just right, it sets up 17 to 17a to the straight. If you blow 16, then your hard pressed to hit 17 and 17a just right.
If I fudge up T14, by aiming for the apex, I know I still have a track-width of asphalt after it to recover.
Oscar uses that turn as a launch ramp for Z06's. I would not recommend his line.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mrlegoman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I've been playing around with shifting to 4th through 2a and keeping it till T4 or shifting to 4th through 2a and then downshifting going into T3. Trying to stay in 3rd, I'm bouncing the rev limiter from T2a all the way to T3. Trying to downshift though going into T3 makes it a very busy corner.

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that's a problem i'm having.before,i would just clip the rev limiter before braking for T3.now that i'm faster,i would be all over the limiter through 2a,so i have to shift to 4th gear.for whatever reason,it really makes me uncomfortable having to downshift back to 3rd while braking/setting up for 3.maybe it's because i haven't always done it,maybe it's because going off at the entry of 3 is almost always going to be bad ...anyway,i used to always nail 3,setting me up perfect for 4.now with the additional downshift i rarely get 3 right,compromising my speed on the short straight to 4.i think the lack of a consistent marker into three maybe contributes to that.
if i had maybe 1000 more revs,i'd be fine.
chris

also,this thread would be a good opportunity to give a reference for what an average lap time for various level cars would be.

 

Chris and Don, how long time-wise are you in the next higher gear coming into T3? I'm at a similar point, and I also feel really uncomfortable downshifting before turning in for T3, so I just hold the gas right below the rev limiter. I may not be accelerating necessarily, but it eliminates an upshift and a downshift, and I don't think wastes too much time compared to whatever I could accelerate to in 4th.

Don, you're right for my way of 16. I try to be at the very end of my braking before I hit the curbing on the left, to give you an idea. And my line through 14 and 14a are just like yours, right down to how I screw it up sometimes

Chris, for laptimes, I think H1 times are ~2:11-12, and ITA times are 2:17-18. Those are the records I'm talking about, not averages. Don can chime in on his laptimes, I know they're pretty darn quick as well.

 

Best VIR video EVER!

http://www.project-seven.goof....R.wmv

 

^^^ LMAO.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Stinkycheezmonky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Chris and Don, how long time-wise are you in the next higher gear coming into T3? I'm at a similar point, and I also feel really uncomfortable downshifting before turning in for T3, so I just hold the gas right below the rev limiter. I may not be accelerating necessarily, but it eliminates an upshift and a downshift, and I don't think wastes too much time compared to whatever I could accelerate to in 4th.

Don, you're right for my way of 16. I try to be at the very end of my braking before I hit the curbing on the left, to give you an idea. And my line through 14 and 14a are just like yours, right down to how I screw it up sometimes

Chris, for laptimes, I think H1 times are ~2:11-12, and ITA times are 2:17-18. Those are the records I'm talking about, not averages. Don can chime in on his laptimes, I know they're pretty darn quick as well.</TD></TR></TABLE>
i believe i'm shifting to 4th right at 2a(i'll have to watch some video to confirm),so i'm in 4th a considerable time.i've tried holding 3rd until i turn in to 3,but i think it does lose a lot of time.i tried it with cars that i'm normally comparable to in lap times behind or in front of me,and i lost a lot of time to them compared to shifting to 4th.
BUT,this is in my car with a 7k limiter,GSR tranny and 205/50-15 tires.i think my top speed in 3rd is a good bit lower than ya'lls.
chris