this one looks simple! looks pretty good. i wonder how much.

http://www.isaacdirect.com

 

$895 for that? You can pick up a HANS for that much.

 

a hans doesnt have to drill into your helmet either does it? I dont know if I like the idea of drilling my helmet... I pay some serious bucks for these things.


[Modified by BDiddy, 12:12 AM 9/20/2002]

 

Yes... there are special tabs that the HANS clips into. I think I remember seeing that OMP helmets all come with them now. I'm sure other manufacturers will follow.

 

I actually heard about this a while back as a competitive option to the HANS device (although at the time he was saying it would be in the thousands of dollars). If its the same one, it uses a magneto (?? thought that was the term he used) shock design that mounts from your helmet to your shoulder harnesses. If this is the one, the only concern I have is how easy it is to swap out between drivers in a co-driver situation and how easy it is to release (assume this one is a no-brainer but the first question, he wasn't sure). The guy that told me about it was extremely impressed by the numbers he saw on it - again, if its the same product.

Edit: On the must one drill the helmet question; I think you get over that pretty quickly - you have to drill into it and even cut up some interior bits to install a radio - it doesn't comprimise the helmet. On the HANS device, you don't drill it AFAIK, you send it to them and they do it for you.


[Modified by phat-S, 12:34 AM 9/20/2002]

 

My Bell SR-Pro has one tab, exactly like the one in the picture above. Is that for a HANS device? I would think you'd want a tab on each side so that you wouldn't twist your neck...??

 

I think what you are talking about is the D-ring. Those have been there for years, way before HANS/Hutchins/etc. It was always my understanding that it was for the helmet strap. Basically it clips to that ring and the fabric side (made out of the same material as the belts and nets) loops around the armpit/shoulder. I always had a problem with that explanation/design, since it only made sense for someone doing counter-clockwise ovals.


[Modified by XrcR6, 9:38 PM 9/19/2002]

 

$895 for that? Hmmm.

Works as well as a HANS, is more comfortable than a HANS, doesn't have to be worn like a HANS, can't loosen like a HANS, you don't have to send your helmet someplace like a HANS, and it's cheaper than a HANS.

You're right. This product sucks. No one's gonna buy it.

 

Anyone see the no BS waiver?

http://www.isaacdirect.com/html/order.html

WARNING!
THIS IS A WAIVER OF RIGHTS

You have at least one warm brain cell and therefore know that any kind of racing
is dangerous. After all, the idea is to go as fast as possible and then stop. How
you stop is something we have no control over.

Safety products are like birth control. Whatever you do, do something, because
anything is better than nothing. An Isaac™ product is better than nothing, but if
you hit something hard enough fast enough, you are going to get hurt. You
might die. In fact, if you hit something really hard really fast, you will die and
there is nothing we can do about it. You are responsible for your safety, not us.
If you don't like it, don't race.

Once we ship the product, it is out of our control. You have to take care of it. If it
doesn't look right, or feel right, or act right, don't use it. Send it back to us. If
you crash, don't use it again. Send it back to us. Help us make it a better
product.

Read the instructions. Use the product according to the instructions. Don't
modify it. And don't drill holes in the helmet while you are wearing the helmet. If
someone else wants to use the product, it's your job to make sure they use it
correctly, not ours.

If you can sign your name below you have at least one warm brain cell, so
here's the deal: We will sell you an Isaac™ product if you promise not to sue us.
That's it, pure and simple. Keep in mind that "you" means you, your family,
friends, heirs, estate, successors, assigns and anyone else who comes along,
including someone you may be buying it for. "Us" means just that: the company,
its employees, managers, officers, directors, affiliates,
partners/shareholders/members, agents, representatives, etc. In other words,
you guys won't sue us guys. We could drag this part out for pages, but you are
racers, not namby-pamby whiners who sit up late at night watching TV
commercials that have some lawyer telling you to call 1-800-SUETHEM.

That's about it. If you sign below you guys agree not to sue us guys, you guys
agree to use the product like you're supposed to, and you guys understand and
agree that the product has no warranties, expressed or implied. If you don't
sign below, we guys aren't going to sell it to you guys. Sorry, but that's the way
it has to be.


I HAVE READ THE ABOVE AND AGREE WITH ALL OF IT, ESPECIALLY THE
NAMBY-PAMBY PART.

 

Does it only attach to one side of the helmet? If so, what implications does that have with regards to the driver's head twisting?

 

Very cool, this IS the product I heard about before. For all interested, there is a very informative discussion going on at IT.com on this product and Gregg (he explains his background in this thread below far better than I could) is answering a ton of questions and concerns.

http://forums.improvedtouring.com/it...ML/000507.html

I, for one, am very excited about this product and as I said above have heard some very good information about it (after reading the IT.com discussion, apparently I was confused between the one shown and the higher end product using the magneto shocks - it matters not to me, this is something I am extremely interested in and am very excited to see on the market now).

 

Show me head-to-head comparison data to back this up. I will second a sentiment expressed above regarding the fact that this device only mounts to one side. I cannot for a second believe that there will be no negative effects of this arrangement. There is no concievable way that unit, with no solid mount could possibly keep the head from twisting/pivoting around the device. Will this movement be enough to cause problems? Maybe, maybe not.
Have you tried both? Do you know anyone who has tried both?
How is this a benefit?
But the shock can blow out rendering it useless.
This is my single biggest gripe about the HANS.
Go ahead and price out the HANS device. They start at around $825 for a basic sedan model (which most if not all involved with this discussion drive). Last time I checked $825 was cheaper than $895.
Can you go ahead and point me to the quote where I said it sucked please?


Drew - Who doesn't believe in jizzing all over a new safety product BEFORE it has been effectively tested against the existing units that are known to work in their intended purposes

 

FWIW, the product info repeatedly refers to the device in the plural. For example:

"Mounting instructions and all mounting hardware are provided to attach the mounts to the helmet."

It just makes sense that you would attach two of the devices, one to each side of the helmet. There are, after all, two shoulder straps in a racing harness. I would suggest contacting the manufacturer to clarify this point before making assumptions. I would, but I ain't hardcore enough to care. (Not yet, anyway. )


[Modified by itr01-0851, 11:49 AM 9/20/2002]

 

Yeah, I would assume the only reason to install this on One side of the helmet would be if you are asking for a broken neck. My hutchin's, if attached to only one side would surely break my neck (twisting my head) in an accident. That's why there's one on each side of the helmet. One side came loose during a race once, and I just detached the other side... figured the result if an accident happened would be better. Possible over-extension is better than definite, immediate peril due to a snapped neck. I hope nobody would only attach one side of the device, thinking it would be safe.

 

Drew,

>Works as well as a HANS. Show me head-to-head comparison data to back this up.

Go to the product comparison chart on the site. It's available via the Product Info page off the home page. Head-to-head comparison, same crash lab, same crash sled, same "g" load impact.

>I will second a sentiment expressed above regarding the fact that this device only mounts to one side.

You gotta be kidding. Only a moron would do that. We're not geniuses, but we're not that stupid.

> is more comfortable than a HANS. Have you tried both?

No. I've tried most everything but the HANS.

>Do you know anyone who has tried both?

Yes.

>doesn't have to be worn like a HAN. SHow is this a benefit?

It isn't, if you want to make a fashion statement.

>can't loosen like a HANS. But the shock can blow out rendering it useless.

If you blow out the shocks you are already dead. On our first test we purposely mounted one shock with a weak connection and the other with a stronger connection. The weak connection broke, the head swung around, and the entire load (nearly one ton) went to a single shock. It still works fine, although I wouldn't use it again because the seals are probably shot.

>you don't have to send your helmet someplace like a HANS. This is my single biggest gripe about the HANS.

Agreed

>and it's cheaper than a HANS. Go ahead and price out the HANS device. They start at around $825 for a basic sedan model (which most if not all involved with this discussion drive). Last time I checked $825 was cheaper than $895.

Ya got me there, Drew. This is news to us. Just before our last test we checked their web site and the cheapest thing offered was $975. They must have heard about us.

>This product sucks. No one's gonna buy it. Can you go ahead and point me to the quote where I said it sucked please?

You didn't say it sucked, I did.

Lighten up, Drew. I'm just having a little fun.

Gregg

 

I am not saying the product is a bad one - I just want to see it get some real world use first.


In terms of the price - I looked again and it was $875 . . . for a child size. My mistake. The economy model is still $975.


Drew - Who will be in the market for some form of head and neck protection soon and will review all options (including this one) prior to purchasing


Any possible ECHC discounts? How about a product donation to the "Drew needs a head and neck restraint but can't afford one" fund?

 

Drew,

>I am not saying the product is a bad one - I just want to see it get some real world use first.

I understand. It's a good idea to approach this cautiously. We just competed testing in July, so it will be a while before the word gets out.

>In terms of the price - I looked again and it was $875 . . . for a child size. My mistake. The economy model is still $975.

Ah. That makes sense.

>Drew - Who will be in the market for some form of head and neck protection soon and will review all options (including this one) prior to purchasing

Thanks for keeping us in mind.

>Any possible ECHC discounts? How about a product donation to the "Drew needs a head and neck restraint but can't afford one" fund?

I don't know about a complete donation. Hey, how about a serious discount to the first X number of buyers? Marketing may go for it as a promotional expense.

Gregg

 

Gary,

We thought the Waiver would be a hit. You can't let the lawyers have all the fun!

Gregg

 

That idea may work but I think before a lot of us plunk down the $$$s we would need to see one firsthand and maybe even strap into one to see what it feels like.

Any chance of having something for us to see at VIR?

 

Interesting device. But what happens if your head happens to be turned so that one of the dampers is already at or near the limit of its travel? Then it would act as a solid connection to the harness, which might significantly change its effectiveness in an impact.

 

What about the Hutchins's one?

 

And don't drill holes in the helmet while you are wearing the helmet. - That's some funny stuff.

 

>>Hey, how about a serious discount to the first X number of buyers? Marketing may go for it as a promotional expense.

>That idea may work but I think before a lot of us plunk down the $$$s we would need to see one firsthand and maybe even strap into one to see what it feels like.

>Any chance of having something for us to see at VIR?

Good point. We have given some thought to putting a crew on the road to demo the system at various tracks. The problem is that you can't be everywhere at once, but it might help the word get out. By the way, we have had calls from racing publications claiming they want to do articles or editorials on the system, so you should be hearing about it soon from established, racing media sources, not just some yahoo in a chat room. (That would be me.)

What about this: Money back guarantee. As long as you don't turn the product into subatomic particles by hitting something at light speed, you get the $ back.

Gregg

 

Gregg, will you be at the ARRC with this product?

 

Adam,

No, unfortunately. We would like to get everywhere with it, but that's not possible. Parts will be in in a week or so, and we are busy getting everything ready to ship.

Keep an eye on the web site. Racers, like you, are generally excited about the product but haven't read anything about it in the racing press or personally know anyone yet who uses it. So right now it's just chat room buzz. That's understandable: we only completed testing two months ago and these things take time to gel.

We'll update the site with links to articles (rumor has it that one will be out in a matter of weeks, but you didn't hear it here) and are thinking about putting a demo team on the road. That means staffing, building the IsaacMobile (could be fun, full harness required!) and a thousand other details, all of which take time.

I'll tell you what. Since you live in the middle of stock car land, and we will probably be in town to talk to those guys at some time, I'll make a point of looking you up and bringing a system for you to check out.

Gregg