How to handle changing surfaces
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 500
Likes: 0
From: Tucson, AZ
How to handle changing surfaces
I raced at a track that had really loose asphalt and one corner was concrete. In some corners there was also dirt. I had a real hard time keeping traction on the dirt and concrete. I know how to fix the traction issue on the concrete, just not the dirt. It's right at an apex so it was unavoidable. Any suggestions?
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 500
Likes: 0
From: Tucson, AZ
LOL. it's at Pinal Airpark, north of Marana, Arizona. It's a 1.2 mile course that is used to train CIA agents and the like how to drive. The Arizona Porshe club frequently uses it, and Arizona-Border Region SCCA Solo2 was up there yesterday and next month.
The long light green area is the concrete, and the 2 small light green areas were the jumps - but we had offset gates so we went over them real slow. #14 is where the dirt was.
http://azbrscca.org/pinal_011804.html
The long light green area is the concrete, and the 2 small light green areas were the jumps - but we had offset gates so we went over them real slow. #14 is where the dirt was.
http://azbrscca.org/pinal_011804.html
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 3,402
Likes: 0
From: Pacific Northwest, USA
Re: (MrIllegalX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MrIllegalX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> and the 2 small light green areas were the jumps - </TD></TR></TABLE>
Jumps!? Cool!
If it's just some dirt on the track surface, drive over it and be aware. If the track is coming apart to the point where dirt is coming up, stay off line there.
$.02
Jumps!? Cool!
If it's just some dirt on the track surface, drive over it and be aware. If the track is coming apart to the point where dirt is coming up, stay off line there.
$.02
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,882
Likes: 0
From: Future Site of the Runoffs, USA
Re: (MrIllegalX)
a couple things-
how much dirt is there? is it just the inside tire that runs over the dirt when you take the traditional racing line, or is it both? if it is just the inside tire, that looks like it might be a slow enough corner to just go through it like normal. you might spin an inside wheel for a fraction of a second, or slide just a bit, but it might be better than adjusting your line.
are you sure you're on the correct line? if it's just a little dirt on the track, everybody else running through that same spot should clear it off pretty quickly. if it's just a little dirt and it's there all day, either you or everybody else is likely off line.
if it's a bunch of dirt and is on line, i would just stay wide and take a later apex, it'll help you setup for the next corner anyway. which might mean you have to comprimise (sp?) the corner before and take a later than usual apex. which is fine because the corner before is after the main straight, so you'll want to brake as late as possible to carry as much of that speed as long as possible.
it'll just be a trial and error thing mainly. this is where experience is key; making line adjustments in the middle of a race/session and being able to FEEL which way is faster.
how much dirt is there? is it just the inside tire that runs over the dirt when you take the traditional racing line, or is it both? if it is just the inside tire, that looks like it might be a slow enough corner to just go through it like normal. you might spin an inside wheel for a fraction of a second, or slide just a bit, but it might be better than adjusting your line.
are you sure you're on the correct line? if it's just a little dirt on the track, everybody else running through that same spot should clear it off pretty quickly. if it's just a little dirt and it's there all day, either you or everybody else is likely off line.
if it's a bunch of dirt and is on line, i would just stay wide and take a later apex, it'll help you setup for the next corner anyway. which might mean you have to comprimise (sp?) the corner before and take a later than usual apex. which is fine because the corner before is after the main straight, so you'll want to brake as late as possible to carry as much of that speed as long as possible.
it'll just be a trial and error thing mainly. this is where experience is key; making line adjustments in the middle of a race/session and being able to FEEL which way is faster.
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,138
Likes: 0
From: Pac NW
Re: (MrIllegalX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MrIllegalX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The long light green area is the concrete, and the 2 small light green areas were the jumps - </TD></TR></TABLE>
Jumps??! Most all of the sanctioned roadrace tracks won't have jumps (except pacific raceways whoopties before the repave) or loose asphalt. Maybe the CIA guys can offer some help.
Modified by bulldog_RS20 at 6:22 PM 1/19/2004
Jumps??! Most all of the sanctioned roadrace tracks won't have jumps (except pacific raceways whoopties before the repave) or loose asphalt. Maybe the CIA guys can offer some help.
Modified by bulldog_RS20 at 6:22 PM 1/19/2004
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 500
Likes: 0
From: Tucson, AZ
After reviewing that map of the track real close, it isn't very accurate. My inside tires would always hit the dirt, and sometimes, if I was a little off of the line, 3 or all 4 of them would.
I wasn't able to see anyone else drive that part of the course, so I'm not positive if it is the correct line or not, but I'm pretty sure it was, if not really close. My car would slide, and it would cost me some time.
I think I will have to adjust my line and go wide, but I think it'll put me off for the next turn, but not too much because as you can see turn #15 is pretty big.
I wasn't able to see anyone else drive that part of the course, so I'm not positive if it is the correct line or not, but I'm pretty sure it was, if not really close. My car would slide, and it would cost me some time.
I think I will have to adjust my line and go wide, but I think it'll put me off for the next turn, but not too much because as you can see turn #15 is pretty big.
Trending Topics
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 500
Likes: 0
From: Tucson, AZ
For the jumps...
This isn't a "real" road race course, it's a training course, and no CIA guys were available for comment. We had to slow down to about 10 mph or slower, because the offsets were so extreme.
This isn't a "real" road race course, it's a training course, and no CIA guys were available for comment. We had to slow down to about 10 mph or slower, because the offsets were so extreme.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 495
Likes: 0
From: Snohomish, WA, 98296
Re: (bulldog_RS20)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bulldog_RS20 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Jumps??! Most all of the sanctioned roadrace won't have jumps (except pacific raceways whoopties before the repave) or loose asphalt. Maybe the CIA guys can offer some help. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Wait till you try the launching ramp at the end of the mile long straight at Spokane. The rear tires of the FWD cars are anywhere from 4-8" off the ground just at the same time you need to loose 70MPH.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MrIllegalX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">After reviewing that map of the track real close, it isn't very accurate. My inside tires would always hit the dirt, and sometimes, if I was a little off of the line, 3 or all 4 of them would.</TD></TR></TABLE>
No matter what track or condition, even if it is only one corner, you need to adjust your driving style to suit the condition. You may alter your line, turn in points, entry speed, etc. Everyone at the place has to deal with the same conditions.
Rick
Jumps??! Most all of the sanctioned roadrace won't have jumps (except pacific raceways whoopties before the repave) or loose asphalt. Maybe the CIA guys can offer some help.
</TD></TR></TABLE>Wait till you try the launching ramp at the end of the mile long straight at Spokane. The rear tires of the FWD cars are anywhere from 4-8" off the ground just at the same time you need to loose 70MPH.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MrIllegalX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">After reviewing that map of the track real close, it isn't very accurate. My inside tires would always hit the dirt, and sometimes, if I was a little off of the line, 3 or all 4 of them would.</TD></TR></TABLE>
No matter what track or condition, even if it is only one corner, you need to adjust your driving style to suit the condition. You may alter your line, turn in points, entry speed, etc. Everyone at the place has to deal with the same conditions.
Rick
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,467
Likes: 0
From: Mainland, USA
Re: How to handle changing surfaces (Greyout)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Greyout »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what the hell kind of track are you racing on?
something like this?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I would like to hear the story behind this one....
something like this?
</TD></TR></TABLE>I would like to hear the story behind this one....
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,552
Likes: 0
From: Ames, IA, usa
Re: How to handle changing surfaces (jisu009)
I remember reading about the Lambo on the dirt track... It was atleast a year ago. I want to say it raced against like subarus on the dirt track, and also on a road course or something....
I am completely butchering the story, I'm sure.
I am completely butchering the story, I'm sure.
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 494
Likes: 0
From: AZ
Re: How to handle changing surfaces (MrIllegalX)
Hey, I was the guy driving the black R.
yah, the surface changing sucked, but i drove with another guy and you basically have to change your driving surface as you go from one to another, you can definitely feel the grip changes as you go from one surface to another. i just backed off a little when it started slipping...
yah, the surface changing sucked, but i drove with another guy and you basically have to change your driving surface as you go from one to another, you can definitely feel the grip changes as you go from one surface to another. i just backed off a little when it started slipping...
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 30,826
Likes: 0
From: RIP Craig Jones
Re: How to handle changing surfaces (jisu009)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jisu009 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I would like to hear the story behind this one....</TD></TR></TABLE>
One lap of america did a leg on a dirt track.
Lambo in dirt =
One lap of america did a leg on a dirt track.
Lambo in dirt =
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 500
Likes: 0
From: Tucson, AZ
Re: How to handle changing surfaces (gary201147)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gary201147 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hey, I was the guy driving the black R.
yah, the surface changing sucked, but i drove with another guy and you basically have to change your driving surface as you go from one to another, you can definitely feel the grip changes as you go from one surface to another. i just backed off a little when it started slipping...</TD></TR></TABLE>
oh hey whatsup man! I hope they clean the track up a little more next time, but I know now to change my line and avoid it, so hopefully I'll get a better time. I can't wait until they post the results.
yah, the surface changing sucked, but i drove with another guy and you basically have to change your driving surface as you go from one to another, you can definitely feel the grip changes as you go from one surface to another. i just backed off a little when it started slipping...</TD></TR></TABLE>
oh hey whatsup man! I hope they clean the track up a little more next time, but I know now to change my line and avoid it, so hopefully I'll get a better time. I can't wait until they post the results.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,968
Likes: 1
From: Austin, Tx, USA
Re: How to handle changing surfaces (.RJ)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
One lap of america did a leg on a dirt track.
Lambo in dirt =</TD></TR></TABLE>
thats correct.
a good write-up from a local supra guy can be found here:
http://www.onelapsupra.com/One...a.htm
pics of the dirt track event:
One lap of america did a leg on a dirt track.
Lambo in dirt =
</TD></TR></TABLE>thats correct.
a good write-up from a local supra guy can be found here:
http://www.onelapsupra.com/One...a.htm
pics of the dirt track event:
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
RACEPAK
Drag Racing
1
Apr 1, 2006 03:14 PM
