In an effort to collect as many small/cheap projects as possible while I muddle through a busy semester, I have been looking at options to keep me cooler in the desert. I think the easiest solution would be the addition of a passenger window NACA duct with some sort of hose directed toward the driver's seat. Are there do's and do not's associated with these systems? Is one design better than another? Does anyone who uses/used a similar system care to comment on how well it works?

 

if you're planning on ducting this to your helmet, it would be better to put the duct in the rear driver's side window -- obviously, the shorter the hose, the better. if you're planning on just running a duct into the car, i'd consider taking the air off the front windshield. i've driven cars with just a duct in the passenger side window and, honestly, i couldn't feel a difference. i've been racing in arizona for a while now and i've never really had much of a problem with the heat. i have a "camel-back" ziptied to the cage behind my seat which helps and if i get really hot, i can just put my hand out the window during a caution lap and direct some air towards my body. i don't know how helpful this was -- if you have more specific questions, i can try my best to help.

-tony

 

Unfortunately, IT rules specify that I must put the duct in either the driver or passenger window. Since I don't see much room in the driver window with all the other junk there, the passenger window seemed like the only reasonable place. I am not planning to duct this to my helmet, just toward the driver's seat.

Hmmm...

 

I've got an Ice-Vest system that puts small freezable packets velcroed to vest under your driver's suit. I have only used it one race weekend in July at Mid-Ohio but it kept me much cooler and fresher through the session. Gotta wear a T-shirt underneath or you get hard frozen nipples though

I've used ducts from both windows before and they have some help but not a lot. The problem is that to get that good of air flow, you really need to get them into the air stream whiich likely means blocked vision to some dregree. I have not done a NACA duct from a large window surface though. Did one in the driver;s window opening once in a 280Z and it was worthless. I've raced RX7s which are much hotter in the cockpit in 3, 12, and 24 hour enduros and you must have some air movement or you roast. Even got a few stories of crew throwing cold rags with ice in the duct tube during pit stops in hopes of pre-cooling the incoming air. It worked for a bit until it melted or blew flying ice chunks into your lap and under your feet at speed. Kind of like ice skating with more serious consequences.

Just flipping up your visor and sticking a hand in the window on a straight to direct fresh air at your face can be somewhat refreshing if that is all you can do.

 

Here's a tip to make a NACA work a little harder. Make a flap out of clear lexan and attach it to the rear of the tube hole so it extends into the airstream about 2", therefore grabbing more air and directing it into the duct. Makes a big difference. Use wing nuts so you can remove it easily so you can tape the duct off in cold weather or rain.

 

Get a camelback bladder. Fill it halfway. Freeze it over night. Jam it into your suit before you hit the track. It keeps you cool, and on the cooldown lap, you have cool water to drink.

If you haven't purchased a suit yet, buy the lightest-weight suit you can find. The pimpiest of the Sparco suits is very light, but also $900 or so. The $600 Sparco (which I have) isn't bad either.

 

http://www.icevest.com/index.html

Best value out there. A lot of the NoCal drivers use it during the late-summer races at Thunderhill. It really makes a difference...

 

On a related subject, I read in the Post this morning that Rick Mast (NASCAR WC guy) is out of the cockpit indefinately, suffering from chronic carbon monoxide poisoning. Don't neglect ventilation...

Kirk

 

Since most of us race well sealed cars that were once street cars and do not run in 30 car packs, this is not a huge concern. For years the WC guys left small gaps all over the interior, I visited a local WC shop a couple of months ago and now they fill every seam with clear silicone to help control carbon monoxide.


[Modified by Track rat, 2:01 PM 1/24/2003]

 

ive seen ppl just simple place some extra dryer hose ducting on the side of the passenger door and angle it back in directly at the driver. i asked one person and said that it works well but took a bit of tweaking to get right. looks funny cuz from a distance it almost looks like a hand is sticking out the window. but its pretty effective.

here i took a snapshot from one of my videos.


yeah nick theroux swears by steves ice vest. personally, im not sure if i felt that hot last year. then again, we let NASA race most of the hot months of the season last year at thunderhill....


[Modified by Tyson, 6:34 AM 1/24/2003]

 

On the hot days around here, this thing is awesome http://www.ltbmotorsport.com/coolshirt.html It is just excellent and really makes you want to get IN your car just to cool off.

Ducting is good also. Be careful though, if you make it too direct and too in your face and you happen to go "off" or you pass through dust/debris, it will hit you in the face. Keep the visor down in this case. It's not fun driving with one eye open with one hand, while trying to take out whatever went inside your other eye with your other hand.

 

Thanks for all the input guys. You brought up some issues I didn't consider (like the high dust content of AZ air ). The title of the post was a little misleading it seems, as I was primarily interested in ducting. However, there's no reason this can't serve as a resource for all types of cooling since that is what I put in the title I have done my best in address the water/hydration issue with a camel-back that I use for cycling. I want to say it holds around 3L and is well insulated and very durable. A fellow racer invested in the Longacre water bottle setup, but for the $50 he spent I figure I can just buy some more bladders for the camel-back I already have. Plus, the majority of the events here are 20 minute sprint races with the occasional 1-2h "enduro" that are frequently held at night. So, I need something that's good for the short term even if it fails in the long term (no 24h at Dayton in my budget ). I have also been polling locals about race suit choices and they all agree (or mostly agree) that no suit is good enough in 110+ AZ sun, so just wear some long underwear to soak up the sweat and take the suit off when you aren't in the car. Sort of like the hood sock theory of keeping your helmet fresh even if it's not required.

The large (and unsolicited) praise for cool shirts, ice vests, etc. is interesting. I don't have any experience with these at all and haven't really been looking at them. Where do they rate on a "more-trouble-than-their-worth" scale in terms of hassle? If you use it for 4 20-minute sessions, do you need 4 of them or time to freeze in between? How long do they stay frozen/cool, and are they worth it for short periods? Any link to info? Thanks!

As for the ducting, it sounds like I'm just going to have to play with it and see. I think I'm going to invest in an actual NACA duct rather than just an open hose since they're pretty cheap (Tyson, you're right, that does look like an arm ). Does anyone run a filter somewhere in there? I wonder what a cheap HEPA filter would do to the flow of air if I were trying to keep the large dust chunks out of my lap.

 

Icevest link in previous post... up there

What about nylon materal (pantyhose) to keep the chuncks from getting through? I know on the "closed" f/a helmet ventilation systems that use the beer cooler there usually a filter at the intake side of the system...

 

Yea, I checked that out along with the cool suit link, but they both provide "manufacturer" information which just says they're the greatest invention ever, LOL! I was wondering if GRM or anyone similar had tested a few systems. Also, the vest is $125? Seems a little steep. I did notice that it includes 4 packs which would be good for our 4 session days, but I'm not seeing how 4 icepacks and a mesh vest adds up to $125.

*goes to add pantyhose to the tool box*

 

The cool suit is heinously expensive. I do have one and I would hate to race without it. I made the mistake of buying a Simpson 3 layer nomex suit. I feel like I am going to melt while wearing that damn thing and by the end of a race I was feeling lightheaded so I bought one.

Anyhow, the little cooler for the cool suit is mounted in the car and you wire up a switch to turn it off and on. Then route the tubes for the cool suit to the driver's seat. Before the race weekend you make a few large blocks of ice for the cooler and stuff them in your food cooler. The kit comes with this little tupperware container to use as a form. Before a session just put a big *** block of ice in the cooler with a little water. Some people just use regular crushed ice but it does not last very long.

I really like the system. To be honest it helps the most while on grid. Seems like NASA-VA enjoys baking our *** on grid. But while everyone else is frying I am chillin'. I think you kind of get used to it as the race goes on but it definitely helps the while time. It pulls the heat out from between your skin and the driving suit. By the end of a 20 minute session this huge block of ice you put in the cooler has shrunken dramatically. Before I got the suit I would come out of the car bright red and dizzy. Now I generally feel fine. It does work well.

 

I wanted to update this thread with my most recent (and cheap) addition just to see if any of this stuff works worth a damn. I haven't invested in any *real* cooling products like the cool suit, but I will say from the May event in Phoenix that an ice vest would certainly be appreciated on grid when you're not moving any air. Maybe later, but for now...here's my $6 AC system:



...from the driver's view (sort of):



This setup is pretty temporary. I did it just to see how it would hold up under a day of racing, and also to see how much air flow I could generate with a 3" tube (and if I could feel it at all). Basically, I was really surprised with how much air force this thing generated. Above 30-40 mph I could feel significant pressure through my glove, and any faster than that and I had to have my visor down. It blows hot air, but that's better than no air. I'm going to replace the mirror mount with a NACA duct and see if I gain or lose any air flow (I suspect I will lose some). The nice thing about this specific ducting is that it's expandable so I can still open/close the passenger door without pulling anything out of place. Overall, not bad for $6 total (duct, zip ties, and a single bracket). The NACA ducts are about $20, so it still doesn't add any significant money. Anyway, if you're hurting for AC and don't have hundreds to spend on a cool suit, this is certainly worth the time and money.

 

you mean to say the piping seriously does not get in the viewable area of the mirror at all?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tyson &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you mean to say the piping seriously does not get in the viewable area of the mirror at all? </TD></TR></TABLE>

In the temporary way it's setup now, it gets in the way of about 1/2 of the passenger side mirror. If you wanted to keep it cheap like this, you could allow the tubing to go about 8" back from the mirror before bending into the car toward your attachment point. My plan is to just replace the makeshift zip tie mount with a clear NACA duct that won't block vision to that mirror. Actually, I didn't notice the difference in the blocked mirror since I never look in that one, but that's just me.