What do you guys do to keep your studs from snapping?

My cars sees multi-duty. It is my DD, AutoXer, and Tracker. I went through 2 months ago, and replaced all 10 studs in the front. Honda replacements, and had to do 2 new bearings up front because the hubs have to be pressed out. I use anti-seize on my studs, but I still had a couple freeze up on me and had to snap them off. I even let the car cool down for a couple hours before we swapped the race tires with the street tires for the drive home.

Is there a stronger stud than the stockers? Is there a certain time frame I should wait before I torque on my street tires to head home?

Chris

 

Other than using the anti-seize, make sure that you are using a calibrated torque wrench to tighten your lug nuts. Over tightening the nuts or having each nut torqued to a different amount can stretch and weaken the studs.

 

Oh yeah...sorry about that.

I torque my wheels to 75 ft.lbs.

 

Maybe you should go with arp studs next time around. I dont really know any other answer.... sorry.

 

something is wrong here.....

i run two race cars; one is 12yrs old; about a million wheel swapperoos. the other is my h1 car; about 1/3 million wheel swaps. never had a broken stud. ever. stock wheel studs.

are you running aftermarket lug nuts? are they the correct lug nuts for your wheels? (acorn style, cone style, straight style)

are you running wheel spacers? aftermarked wheels with a different than stock offset?

you should not be breaking studs like you describe...

lets find the root of the problem, and solve it. studs will stop breaking.

good luck

 

use anti seize

stock studs are very strong and can take a lot of abuse

maybe try a friends tourqe wrench

 

I am using after-market lugs, one of Wheel Pro's kits. They are a 'tuner' style lug, still acorn, but use a tool that fits into the lug instead of around it. I went to these, because the first stud that snapped was in the factory lug...and Fenton Honda said they didn't produce my particular lug anymore.

I am running OEM '93-'97 RX7 rims, 16x8 / +50mm / 15 lbs on both the track and street (good deal on both sets, couldn't pass it up). I'm still on the stock suspension, and have a Craftsman DigiTorq Torque Wrench that I set to 75-80 ft. lbs.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by essex &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">use anti seize

stock studs are very strong and can take a lot of abuse

maybe try a friends tourqe wrench</TD></TR></TABLE>

My First Post in this Thread
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LowFlyin’ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">... I use anti-seize on my studs, but I still had a couple freeze up on me and had to snap them off. ...</TD></TR></TABLE>

My Second Post in this Thread
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LowFlyin’ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">...
I torque my wheels to 75 ft.lbs.</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

Stop using anti-seize!!! That may be the problem.

When you torque a lugnut, you are stretching the bolt. By adding anti-seize you are basically lubricating the stud and allowing the stud to stretch farther to achieve the same 75 ft/lbs. That is why they are breaking more often.

 

I've always used antiseize and never broken a lug stud.

Its possible that the lugnuts you are using are junk - have you run a tap through them?

 

I haven't broken a stud, and I've changed wheels.. umm.. 50 or so times on the stock wheel studs. I have dabbed a little motor oil on the studs maybe once a year, that's it. Torquing to 80 ft-lbs, usually retorque after usage once. I use an electric impact wrench when changing wheels (cheapo 12V cigarette lighter deal)

Sometimes I wait until the lug nuts are cool enough to touch, but usually I don't. I don't think there's a cooling time required.

You've got some other problem! Did you answer the wheel spacer question (do you use them?) Are you using the right lugnuts (acorn vs. tuner style)? An acorn nut on a tuner wheel could cause some serious stress on the studs.

I wonder if a warped wheel or rotor might aggravate the problem. Hmm!

-Chris

 

Are the lugnuts aluminum? The only thing that makes sense to me is that you have some funky corrosion going on and dissimilar metals might aggravate it.

K

 

Running original 13yr old studs and havent snapped yet. The only other thing i can think of is that the lugnut pitch does not match the thread on the studs. And/Or the taper on the wheels is different.

 

maybe a stupid question but

i know that sometime people have to run a ring or a spacer of some sort when useing OEM wheels from a different manufactur. could it be that these wheels hub is too big and alows the wheel to move some how fuckn up the stud's.


any one else know what i am talking about? i can't think of the correct termenology.

and maybe this doesn't even apply

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by slammed_93_hatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">maybe a stupid question but

i know that sometime people have to run a ring or a spacer of some sort when useing OEM wheels from a different manufactur. could it be that these wheels hub is too big and alows the wheel to move some how fuckn up the stud's.


any one else know what i am talking about? i can't think of the correct termenology.

and maybe this doesn't even apply</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hubcentric rings?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ccfries &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Hubcentric rings?</TD></TR></TABLE>

ya, thats what i was thinking of.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by slammed_93_hatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">maybe a stupid question but

i know that sometime people have to run a ring or a spacer of some sort when useing OEM wheels from a different manufactur. could it be that these wheels hub is too big and alows the wheel to move some how fuckn up the stud's.


any one else know what i am talking about? i can't think of the correct termenology.

and maybe this doesn't even apply</TD></TR></TABLE>

It's called a hubcentric ring. The only thing it does is helps center the wheel while the lugs are being torqued. Without the ring, you need to torque the wheels while off the ground. Once torqued, the weight of the car is supported by the friction between hub/wheel and no (vertical) load is placed on the studs under normal to even sever use such as racing. If a force great enough to move the wheel and put a load on a stud is encountered, most likely you'll be worrying about things other than the studs, like bent suspension parts or sheetmetal...

That makes me thing of something... I once saw a car with anti-seize all over the hubs, off course effectively lubricating them and defeating the whole purpose of the above.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jsi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> If a force great enough to move the wheel and put a load on a stud is encountered, most likely you'll be worrying about things other than the studs, like bent suspension parts or sheetmetal...</TD></TR></TABLE>

Next time you get new rotors paint the hats.

After a few track sessions, look at them.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Next time you get new rotors paint the hats.

After a few track sessions, look at them.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I don't get it. Are you saying it's normal to rub the paint off between the wheel and rotor, or that it's unusual?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Next time you get new rotors paint the hats.

After a few track sessions, look at them.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I was actually referring to the rotor hats. I allways call them hubs for some reason... Anyways, I would imagine you would see signs of the wheel moving around? But then wouldnt that be because of the slippery paint? Should not happen with say aluminum alloy on iron torqued to ~80ft/lbs. There was a discussion on this on here a long while ago...

 

Well...the lugs are not aluminum. They have 50x12mm on them, but I think the 12 refers to the key size. I don't think they are the incorrect pitch, they go on just as easy as the factory lugs did. The RX7 wheels fit like the stockers do, and have the same size and angle of contact as the angle of the lug nuts. I don't know...I know I have to fix the problem eventually, but I'll probably wait to take care of it before next season. I have other plans in the works that will require the removal of the spindles, so I'll just take care of the missing studs when the spindles come off.

I thank you guys for the input, if anything else crosses your mind that hasn't been covered already...speak up!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LowFlyin’ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What do you guys do to keep your studs from snapping?

I still had a couple freeze up on me and had to snap them off. </TD></TR></TABLE>

If they are freezing up after such a short time of being on the car then they are either crappy lugs or have the wrong thread size/pitch. Just go back to stock lugs and have your torque wrench checked in case it is out of calibration and you are way over tightening the lugs.

 

16x8 50mm offset means that compared to stock the center of the tread is 1" further to the outside. This does put extra stress on the studs. Is it enough to cause failure? I would not think so. The only thing I can think of (sorry about this) is that you under-torque the wheels sometimes. Running loose torqued nuts will surely inflict damage.

I also use stock studs and have 5 years of autocrossing (30+ events per year) and street driving and hpdes. So that works out to about 1,000,005 wheel changes - no problems.


Why not go to another type of nut on one front wheel and see if that stops the problem?

 

One thing I haven't heard mentioned is replacing your lugs. If the studs are streching or breaking, similar things are probably occuring to your lugs. When I replaced my studs I was told to replace the lugs as well because they were also probably damaged. I'd definitely get some new lugs for your studs and see if that starts to curb your breakage.

In my case, I stopped breaking studs once I stopped using wheel spacers.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LowFlyin’ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The RX7 wheels fit like the stockers do, and have the same size and angle of contact as the angle of the lug nuts. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I could have sworn that Mazda hubs were a few mm smaller in diameter than Honda hubs, and that to use a hubcentric Mazda wheel on a Honda you had to bore out the hub slightly.

Maybe that was just for Miatas?

I would also recommend trying some different nuts. A friend of mine was using the "tuner style" lugs (with the "starburst" key that fits into them) with a set of aftermarket wheels he had, and they would seize up and shear off wheel studs all the time. No problems since he switched back to OEM-spec open-ended lugs (and Honda wheels) . . .


Modified by Targa250R at 2:19 PM 10/4/2004