As far as ive been taught , Light patterns are predictable. generally in most cases, factory projectors do not work well with HIDs. But ive found research promoting them working very well with the Halogen projectors on my Honda Civic 2007 LX Coupe.
Heres my knowledge, which may be wrong, if you know better please correct me and show me the evidence to back it up:
HIDs run 3-8 degrees cooler after 1-2 hour time period of being on.
They run at 35Watts of power (not current)
Most if not all are made in China
Some of the higher quality ones come from the Guangdong Province, a hotbed for consumer electronic exports.

If the above are true, what cold hard technical facts can be made to not use my current projectors and a Standard HID 6000K kit from ebay from a seller with excellent ratings, a good fair price, and backup from friends who have already gone through with the install?

Thank you in advance.

 

This should help you out...........

http://www.team-integra.net/se...D=973

 

ok thats the kind of infoo im looking for!

 

Or you could go to HIDPlanet and not only get a whole host of information (they have a University section that's just explaining everything hid, led and otherwise) but you also have a whole group of educated knowledgeable people that are willing to answer questions and give help on retrofits and builds...

 

Ok so i found alot of information
The final low down
While most HID projectors do cut off light patterns very well for use with xenon, they also reduce the light output therefore reducing the glare. They compensate for the electrode that goes from the bottom to the top to eliminate the blindspot associated with using halogen projectors with Xenon
BUT
The 2006/7 Honda Civic, uses a halogen bulb that is similar in size to the xenon (9006 size) and the electrode runs along the bottom, where on the civic, it has a plastic piece to hold up a cap infront of the bulb to get a particular beam pattern, therefore ALREADY makes up for the "Blindspot"
in otherwords, the Honda Civic 2007 Halogen Projectors will provide MORE lightout put than a HID projector, and without blind spots!!!
Next in line for lookup is the power needed
Most websites tell u to use the relay wireing instead of your stock wiring. Generally 90% of the cars on the road have thin flimsy wires just barely able to handle the load of the 55W halogen.
An HID uses 35Ws of power at a max of 20 AMPS!!! thats alot of current, but yet again, Honda has already compensated for that using wires with the same 20 amp max! and a 20 amp fuse! A xenon uses 20,000Vs instead of 12Vs to start up, so the newer electronic ballasts can do this, and the wire going from the ballast to the capsule is always designed for compensation of this high voltage!

With much research into the technical info I found some other interesting things also
Bi-xenons are ALWAYS a bad idea, their mechanical parts break down quickly (they create the hi beam by moving the bulb into the high beam filament area on a halogen)
Dimmable xenons break down VERY quickly, dont even look at them!
They have released 50W off-road xenons (i need to do more research into these!!!)


After watching multiple people put certain kits on their cars, i have found a reliable canadian manufacturer that uses German made ballasts, and Philips (if u want 4300) capsules or japanese made capsules for other colors
I would suggest if you are looking for HIDs, you consider looking up what your particular housing can do. many halogen housings should be fine for using Xenons, as long as they are newer. Also check the Voltage(12-16V), Amp(depending on company up to 25amp), and Wattage (35W mainly) ratings on your current wires before using plug and play kits. Most cars, cant support the loads with the stock wires.

One more thing:
DO NOT LET YOUR XENONS RUN MORE THAN 3 HOURS!!!! The ballasts get very hot, and should be placed ON metal that will be mostly cool during use. The temperature after 2.5 hours begins to exceed what a halogen runs (cooler for the first 2 hours generally by 4-7 degrees) When you hit 3 hours (i suggest 2 to be safe) shut them off for approx. 5-10 mins. If you have standard halogen "fog" (driving) lights you should be fine continuing to drive, but never do more than 3 hours, on good kits!


Also for the Chinese. Finding respectable HID manufacturers is EXTREMELY hard. BUT it can be done. Companies you should know about that will fool u:
McCulloch (owned by a taiwan company, manufactured in China)


I will edit this list and add more later. Ive had plenty of people on 8thgen.com tell me to purchase McCulloch, while they are reliable, if your anti-Chinese you wont want them, OR if you dont like getting ripped off! over 85% of HID kits are manufactured in China, even ones that claim they are from Japan and America are more often than not manufactured in China. Shoot, even alot of your car parts currently are manufactured in china! Labor is cheap u know
But that also doesnt mean they arent high quality. Look for reviews from people who sound intelligent before purchasing. Any person out there will tell u McCulloch is good, and they are, but they are 3 times more expensive than the same product without their name on it. Do some research and you'll find them

If you need any technical data on any of this stuff, feel free to email me at tda1337@gmail.com
I can get you all the info you need!!!!!!


***** IN OTHER NEWS! im looking for the inside brake lamp that consists of 4 leds, versus my current wedge base bulb version on my 07 Civic LX coupe. Ive seen them on the coupes before but i dont know where to get the part. If you know please help!!!!*******************

 

HID optics don't reduce light output, they just control the light better and disperse it more evenly.


I don't really understand what you're saying here, or what logic you're using, but '07 Civic halogen projectors with a drop-in HID kit will not produce more or better output than a good OEM HID setup.

Relaying is a good idea. Yes, the ballast wiring is designed to handle the increased voltage, but the stock Honda wiring that you're plugging them in to is not.


Are you talking about OEM bi-xenon setups, or aftermarket kits? I don't doubt that many aftermarket kits are substandard and break quickly, but many auto manufacturers include bi-xenon setups on their vehicles as OEM equipment, without apparent longevity issues.


According to whom, and what does the newness of the kit have to do with the quality of the light output when used with halogen optics?


If you can't operate your headlamps for more than 3 hours without fear of heat damage, then you need to revise your setup. Again, where are you sourcing this information from?

I don't intend to seem rude, but honestly I don't understand where or how you obtained this information, or what leads you to believe that is accurate enough to present it here as factual. I'd suggest doing a bit more research before creating other information threads, because others could be misled by them.

 

I'm guessing all that info above pertains to cheap junk@$$ HID kits.

I'm using all Philips components with Hella bi-xenon projectors in my setup. The projectors and bulbs are nearly 4 years old now, and the ballasts are nearly 5 years old, still works just as perfectly as the day I first installed the retrofit. I've also certainly driven with them on for longer than 3 hours. I've made 4+ hour trips at night with the lights on the whole time and never had an issue. The ballasts (Philips LVQ-212) do not get that hot.

And um, since when do Civics come with projector headlights? The current generation of Civic is still using halogen reflector headlights, as they always have for the past 20+ years.

 

Its not the ballasts, i misunderstood the engineer, its actually the life of the bulbs, after a determined amount of time the bulbs salts begin to break down more rapddly than when they are first turned on. Same holds true with the rapid turning on and off of bulbs.
Also there is still no significant evidence that Halogen housings cant handle the HIDs. Ive seen at least 6 different 06/07 Civics with HID plug and play kits
A) The wire gauge and quality of the copper is the same in phillips kits, the headlights also have a 20 amp fuse already attached. UNLESS YOU CAN SHOW ME AN EXACT WIRING DIAGRAM FROM A CERTIFIED ELECTRICAL ENGINEER, shut up u are afraid of the unknown like half of the people on this forum! The wires on MOST of the QUALITY plug and play kits are the same... VOLTS does not equal CURRENT which does not equal POWER! soo if the HIDs require 12-16Vdc 20Amp max..... at 35Watts... your honda wires are 20 amp max 600Volt rated for 55 Watts power.... now do the math... seriously lol you have a 20 amp fuse on there
YES THE HIDS BALLASTS MAKE up to (depending on manufacturer) 25000Volts (25kVs) but that is on another set of wires.

Xenons run 6-8 degrees cooler as well, someone told me they run hotter.... moron is all i gotta say

ALSO if you dont believe what im saying, pop the hood of your car and read the wiring on the headlights as well as take a look at the fuse!
And then take a look at your phillips or aftermarket ballasts (most likely they will say made in china for those people who claim phillips is the best) they should say amp ratings as well as volt ratings in and out, that will give you similar traits as explained above

OR be a d-bag and just continue to bad mouth me without doing something good with your life.. if you dont have something nice to say dont say it at all


The civic Halogen housing has a slightly different cuttoff than the Philips d2r setup
the phillips projector is MORE accurate, with less hot spots and slightly better distribution, but for the total difference between that and a plug in play kit, its not worth the difference in money. There are 2 "hot spots" in the halogen housings, but these are areas of light thrown up to hit of road signs and such
depending on the position of the electrode, it can cause blind spots. On a civic 07 LX EX, and si (my friends car, same projectors as on mine) the electrode (depending on manufacturer) will generally run along the same piece of plastic that holds up the bulb cover, therefore there then is no blind spot.

ps projector = any housing that creates a distinct light pattern
OEM hids have a special projector
same with halogen... jeees sorry for getting too technical with that one

 

You know I thought you'd read up and try to learn, but again, as in the original thread, you've turned into an arrogant bastard.

Take your 'knowledge' elsewhere. I'm tired of your incorrect information and lack of understanding thinly veiled as superiority.

 

Alright who in the HELL are you directing that post to? Better not be to me because what I'm posting in this thread is fact.



Made in Germany. NOT in China or anywhere else.

Also, you need to study your current calculation methods again. Amperage (current) is watts divided by voltage. A 35 watt HID bulb during normal operation on a car with the engine running (at least 12.8 volts) draws less than THREE amps of current. Also as you can see from the pic above, the ballast draws just over 3 amps during normal operation, but no more than 20 amps at startup. That's why 20 amp fuses are needed, and are sufficient, for powering HID ballasts.

Harnesses with relays are a good idea on Hondas because they did not use headlight relays like other car manufacturers do (my old Camry had headlight relays). So with factory halogen, the current drawn by the headlights passes through the stalk switch inside the car. That's why there used to be reports of people's headlight switch burning out when they used high-wattage bulbs back in the day.

By using relays, you power the ballasts directly from the battery, and then the headlight switch only handles a very small amount of current to switch the relays.

As for projectors, your terminology is completely incorrect. A projector refers to a self-contained unit containing a rear reflector, a lens to focus the beam of light, and a shield to limit light coming out to point below horizontal only. A reflector headlight uses only the rear reflector and sometimes a fluted exterior lens, and as a result the light coming out is much less controlled than that from a projector assembly. It characteristically has more upward glare than a projector assembly. Using an HID bulb in a halogen reflector housing (which is what ALL Civics have had from the factory) only intensifies the problem.

HID in a halogen projector housing (which Civics have never had, but Integras did from 94-01) is not as bad as a reflector housing, but it still doesn't put the light where you need it, and doesn't have the proper beam pattern.

 

a) no it wasnt but now that u make a few points
b) LOOk up projector in the dictionary
c)... this is an american company were talking about here.. well Japaneses American. dont believe wat the sticker says, those still came off a boat from china... prolly could look it up
d)yes OLDEr hondas had that problem, newer hondas go through the fuse box which is linked to a controller....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tda1337 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">b) LOOk up projector in the dictionary</TD></TR></TABLE>

If you had basic knowledge of automotive lighting, you'd understand that there's a distinct difference between projector-based and reflector-based systems. The term "projector" does not accurately describe both of them in an interchangeable fashion. This is a fundamental concept of automotive lighting.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tda1337 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">c)... this is an american company were talking about here.. well Japaneses American. dont believe wat the sticker says, those still came off a boat from china... prolly could look it up</TD></TR></TABLE>

If you looked it up, you'd realise that Philips is actually based in the Netherlands, and the lighting division does indeed have manufacturing operations in Germany, among other places. What proof have you provided for the claim that the ballasts were manufactured in China?

 

Interesting how the Philips China webpages are all about consumer electronics and medical offices, with no links to any sort of automotive lighting. Their lighting division is based in Europe, mainly the Netherlands and Germany.

 

This kid never ceases to amaze me....just because Philips has a website in chinese he thinks that Philips makes all products in China as well...Well Microsoft has a website in China Too...as well as Korea and Japan...
projector and reflector?? Cant tell the difference??? wow
Philips is Japanese American Company?? and these are made in China??


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tda1337 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">a) no it wasnt but now that u make a few points
b) LOOk up projector in the dictionary
c)... this is an american company were talking about here.. well Japaneses American. dont believe wat the sticker says, those still came off a boat from china... prolly could look it up
d)yes OLDEr hondas had that problem, newer hondas go through the fuse box which is linked to a controller....</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

Honda and their clever Japanese and American engineers, have designed the reflector housing in the new FG/FA Civics, to give a very straight "projector-like" cutoff.

This "projector-like" cutoff is confused with "hid" when in reality it is a halogen reflector.

Why? I dunno, but when you drive these new civics, the cutoff line bounces with the nose over bumps - just like a car equipped with HIDs.

If you want to increase your light output, with little money, purchase a set of Philips X-Treme +80%.

You will not get the same sweet cut-off with the blue rainbow at the cut-off line without doing a retrofit.

Big companies have offices and factories all over the world... Honda is a Japanese Motor Company, but your FA/FG is built either in Ohio, or in Canada. The engines are normally built in Japan, and the transmission can come from either Japan or Indonesia...The plastic panels i think are built in the USA... and other parts come from DENSO, NGK, BOSCH, SHOWA, Michelin, Bridgestone, Dunlop, Goodyear, etc..

Each of those parts are either built in Japan, China, USA, United Kingdom, Germany, etc...

 

I'm pretty sure those X-treme Power bulbs are currently only available in H4. The newer Civics have separate low/high beam bulbs, do they not? If so, then the X-treme Power is a no-go. If they use 9006, then 9012 HIR bulbs are an option.

 

I should've posted this link instead of the review: http://www.nam.lighting.philip...r.php

 

despite what the Philips page says, I think they are currently only available in H4 at the moment, at least in this country. I did several internet searches last week and have yet to find a single internet retailer selling the X-treme Power in anything other than H4.

 

The OP can either call the number or fill out this from: http://www.nam.lighting.philip...t.php

For info on where to buy the bulbs... they'll gladly direct you to a place you can buy it from.. cause if they don't.. its bad business...

Or he can go to any of the stores listed here: http://www.nam.lighting.philip...r.php

and ask their "intelligent" staff to order him a set...