type R or h22a
03-31-2005, 10:47 AM
#1
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type R or h22a
iam getting a ek hatch iam looking at a type-r or a h22a to put into it all my friends said go with the h22a but i want to know what will be faster in the 1/2 mile
03-31-2005, 11:12 AM
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h22 will be faster imo- but not by much- the tyle r motor has more potential and is less hastle to swap! h22 for a swap and go- type rrrr for more mods
03-31-2005, 11:20 AM
#4
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Re: type R or h22a (accord-25)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by accord-25 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> i want to know what will be faster in the 1/2 mile</TD></TR></TABLE>
1/2 mile? and where is this track? and as stated in a 1000 other threads, handling is not the issue in deciding for the swap. i think the general consensus is that the h22 is better right off the bat, but the type r has more potential with bolt ons/forced induction.
1/2 mile? and where is this track? and as stated in a 1000 other threads, handling is not the issue in deciding for the swap. i think the general consensus is that the h22 is better right off the bat, but the type r has more potential with bolt ons/forced induction.
03-31-2005, 11:21 AM
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Re: (JDM_Ej)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM_Ej »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If your doing drag, then H22. If you want to be able to handle, ITR all the way... </TD></TR></TABLE>
U CAN handle with either choice with the right suspension set up. I have a H22 in a 92 Si hatch and love it. For the price I say H22, but if money is not a issue there's nothin quite like a true JDM R....
U CAN handle with either choice with the right suspension set up. I have a H22 in a 92 Si hatch and love it. For the price I say H22, but if money is not a issue there's nothin quite like a true JDM R....
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03-31-2005, 11:28 AM
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Re: (B16B)
You sir speak the truth. I would go witht he H22 if you planned on basically leaving it at that. Sorry, I have been out of it for a while but I would think a built h22 with FI would have more hp potential than a c5 with FI. If this is not the case, tell me why. As I said been out of it for two years now, and startig to get back into it. Hell, I am thinking abut swapping in an h22 into my Si and leaving it at basically that. Cant go wrong with the tq that SOB puts down.
03-31-2005, 11:34 AM
#10
Former Moderator
Re: type R or h22a (accord-25)
There seems to be some really backwards thinking here in this topic...how many of you have raced one against another? How many of you have driven both? Owned either?
H22A - cheaper, needs custom mounts, cable shifters that feel awkward, a tiny bit slower all around, except for midrange torque, less aftermarket support, needs good tuning to run to potential, needs more sus tweaking to handle right, custom axles required to not bind/break,
B18C5 - OE mounts and axles, better tranny gearing and more positive shifter, a bit quicker all around, less torque, but needs to be revved and stay revved to be faster, more aftermarket support, stock axles fine, rechipped P28 ECU runs it fine, MORE EXPENSIVE.
I respect the H22A more now that I've driven Roti Eater's. The low and mid torque is nice when bumping around town, but you can feel the top end power drop off a bit, whereas the B18C5 has less torque and low/mid whp, but the gearing keeps things tighter and the top end pull is better.
I still think my biggest gripe with the H22a is the gearing and especially the shifter. The cables make things trickier IMO. If someone made a good rod-type shifter adapter that made it more like a B series then I think that'd be bad-***.
BTW:
This topic has been beaten to death. There will never be a clear-cut answer IMO. Some may argue that the price difference makes the choice easy for them - H22A. Some like the ease of installment and OE quality of a B series swap, even if it means giving up some torque.
I'll try to hit Kabir up for his thoughts from the other side - H22A guy who drove a B18C5 hatch for the first time last night.
My bottom line?
i/h/e modded I think the B18C5 has the edge in a dragrace, street race, highway pulling, and on twisties.
BUT!!!
If you want to save yourself a good $1,500-$2,000.00 and do the H22A swap it wouldn't take too much more to beat an i/h/e B18C5 swap in the same weight chassis. I believe with the money saved it would not be hard to beat a B18C5.
H22A - cheaper, needs custom mounts, cable shifters that feel awkward, a tiny bit slower all around, except for midrange torque, less aftermarket support, needs good tuning to run to potential, needs more sus tweaking to handle right, custom axles required to not bind/break,
B18C5 - OE mounts and axles, better tranny gearing and more positive shifter, a bit quicker all around, less torque, but needs to be revved and stay revved to be faster, more aftermarket support, stock axles fine, rechipped P28 ECU runs it fine, MORE EXPENSIVE.
I respect the H22A more now that I've driven Roti Eater's. The low and mid torque is nice when bumping around town, but you can feel the top end power drop off a bit, whereas the B18C5 has less torque and low/mid whp, but the gearing keeps things tighter and the top end pull is better.
I still think my biggest gripe with the H22a is the gearing and especially the shifter. The cables make things trickier IMO. If someone made a good rod-type shifter adapter that made it more like a B series then I think that'd be bad-***.
BTW:
This topic has been beaten to death. There will never be a clear-cut answer IMO. Some may argue that the price difference makes the choice easy for them - H22A. Some like the ease of installment and OE quality of a B series swap, even if it means giving up some torque.
I'll try to hit Kabir up for his thoughts from the other side - H22A guy who drove a B18C5 hatch for the first time last night.
My bottom line?
i/h/e modded I think the B18C5 has the edge in a dragrace, street race, highway pulling, and on twisties.
BUT!!!
If you want to save yourself a good $1,500-$2,000.00 and do the H22A swap it wouldn't take too much more to beat an i/h/e B18C5 swap in the same weight chassis. I believe with the money saved it would not be hard to beat a B18C5.
03-31-2005, 11:54 AM
#13
Former Moderator
Re: type R or h22a (JDM H23A)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM H23A »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It's all about H-power IMO 
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Great logic.
WHY?
</TD></TR></TABLE>Great logic.
WHY?
03-31-2005, 12:03 PM
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H22'S dont have the same flexability that a b series does- parts in general are more expensive and if you dont know which h22 you are buying and you buy a closed deck h22 and boost you suck- every one is so opinionated h22 for a drop in right out the box- b18c5 for modding imo still !
03-31-2005, 12:39 PM
#16
Former Moderator
Re: (IHateJDM)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by IHateJDM »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">best answer you are going to get is when you seach and make up your own mind. please let this thread die, we don't need another H vs B.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Skip the ******* topic then.
Skip the ******* topic then.
03-31-2005, 01:19 PM
#17
Re: type R or h22a (B18C5-EH2)
Honestly... Tom covered everything exactly the way it is.
I've always been a hater on the C5, but after actually competiting against one and then driving it I must say I was impressed. My only problem with the C5 is the actual cost of the swap.
If you want my opinion....read this:
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C5-EH2 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">There seems to be some really backwards thinking here in this topic...how many of you have raced one against another? How many of you have driven both? Owned either?
H22A - cheaper, needs custom mounts, cable shifters that feel awkward, a tiny bit slower all around, except for midrange torque, less aftermarket support, needs good tuning to run to potential, needs more sus tweaking to handle right, custom axles required to not bind/break,
B18C5 - OE mounts and axles, better tranny gearing and more positive shifter, a bit quicker all around, less torque, but needs to be revved and stay revved to be faster, more aftermarket support, stock axles fine, rechipped P28 ECU runs it fine, MORE EXPENSIVE.
I respect the H22A more now that I've driven Roti Eater's. The low and mid torque is nice when bumping around town, but you can feel the top end power drop off a bit, whereas the B18C5 has less torque and low/mid whp, but the gearing keeps things tighter and the top end pull is better.
I still think my biggest gripe with the H22a is the gearing and especially the shifter. The cables make things trickier IMO. If someone made a good rod-type shifter adapter that made it more like a B series then I think that'd be bad-***.
BTW:
This topic has been beaten to death. There will never be a clear-cut answer IMO. Some may argue that the price difference makes the choice easy for them - H22A. Some like the ease of installment and OE quality of a B series swap, even if it means giving up some torque.
I'll try to hit Kabir up for his thoughts from the other side - H22A guy who drove a B18C5 hatch for the first time last night.
My bottom line?
i/h/e modded I think the B18C5 has the edge in a dragrace, street race, highway pulling, and on twisties.
BUT!!!
If you want to save yourself a good $1,500-$2,000.00 and do the H22A swap it wouldn't take too much more to beat an i/h/e B18C5 swap in the same weight chassis. I believe with the money saved it would not be hard to beat a B18C5.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
What swap should you choose? That's honestly up to you. No one can really decide that for you.
I've always been a hater on the C5, but after actually competiting against one and then driving it I must say I was impressed. My only problem with the C5 is the actual cost of the swap.
If you want my opinion....read this:
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C5-EH2 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">There seems to be some really backwards thinking here in this topic...how many of you have raced one against another? How many of you have driven both? Owned either?
H22A - cheaper, needs custom mounts, cable shifters that feel awkward, a tiny bit slower all around, except for midrange torque, less aftermarket support, needs good tuning to run to potential, needs more sus tweaking to handle right, custom axles required to not bind/break,
B18C5 - OE mounts and axles, better tranny gearing and more positive shifter, a bit quicker all around, less torque, but needs to be revved and stay revved to be faster, more aftermarket support, stock axles fine, rechipped P28 ECU runs it fine, MORE EXPENSIVE.
I respect the H22A more now that I've driven Roti Eater's. The low and mid torque is nice when bumping around town, but you can feel the top end power drop off a bit, whereas the B18C5 has less torque and low/mid whp, but the gearing keeps things tighter and the top end pull is better.
I still think my biggest gripe with the H22a is the gearing and especially the shifter. The cables make things trickier IMO. If someone made a good rod-type shifter adapter that made it more like a B series then I think that'd be bad-***.
BTW:
This topic has been beaten to death. There will never be a clear-cut answer IMO. Some may argue that the price difference makes the choice easy for them - H22A. Some like the ease of installment and OE quality of a B series swap, even if it means giving up some torque.
I'll try to hit Kabir up for his thoughts from the other side - H22A guy who drove a B18C5 hatch for the first time last night.
My bottom line?
i/h/e modded I think the B18C5 has the edge in a dragrace, street race, highway pulling, and on twisties.
BUT!!!
If you want to save yourself a good $1,500-$2,000.00 and do the H22A swap it wouldn't take too much more to beat an i/h/e B18C5 swap in the same weight chassis. I believe with the money saved it would not be hard to beat a B18C5.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
What swap should you choose? That's honestly up to you. No one can really decide that for you.
03-31-2005, 01:38 PM
#18
Former Moderator
Re: type R or h22a (RotiEatter)
BTW:
I'm an exception to all of this because my B18C5 costed me literally maybe $2,500.00 after I purchased a legit complete wrecked ITR for $4,000.00, sold the 5-lug for a G, sold extras, misc. for more, etc. so sometimes I lose sight of the money aspect.
If I were starting from scratch and I truly only had $5,000.00 to get the swap in the car and running I might go H22A.
Why?
One could use the extra money saved from getting the H22A to get top-notch engine management and the top dollar header of his choice. This could clearly be an advantage over the guy who barely affords the ITR swap and keeps the stock manifold or goes with a Dc JDM 4-1 header rather than the likes of ANR, Header Tech, HyTech, SMSP, etc.
I think it'd be cool to get an H22A LSD swap and do mild cams, best header possible, best engine management and tuning possible, etc.
I'd still long for better gearing and a better shifter set-up, but if I was beating B18C5 swaps with the same money invested I think I'd be doing well.
I kicked around the idea of an H22A in my wife's hatch right before we sold it, but I digress...
I'm an exception to all of this because my B18C5 costed me literally maybe $2,500.00 after I purchased a legit complete wrecked ITR for $4,000.00, sold the 5-lug for a G, sold extras, misc. for more, etc. so sometimes I lose sight of the money aspect.
If I were starting from scratch and I truly only had $5,000.00 to get the swap in the car and running I might go H22A.
Why?
One could use the extra money saved from getting the H22A to get top-notch engine management and the top dollar header of his choice. This could clearly be an advantage over the guy who barely affords the ITR swap and keeps the stock manifold or goes with a Dc JDM 4-1 header rather than the likes of ANR, Header Tech, HyTech, SMSP, etc.
I think it'd be cool to get an H22A LSD swap and do mild cams, best header possible, best engine management and tuning possible, etc.
I'd still long for better gearing and a better shifter set-up, but if I was beating B18C5 swaps with the same money invested I think I'd be doing well.
I kicked around the idea of an H22A in my wife's hatch right before we sold it, but I digress...
03-31-2005, 02:08 PM
#19
Re: type R or h22a (B18C5-EH2)
Yeah... The cost of the H22A swap is a lot cheaper and that had a big role for me. Tom's cost was less than that of a GSR swap, that definately made it worth every penny.
I'm running a 13.84 with an intake and exhaust. I just got a beat-up AN-R header, but I'm going to re-do some of the piping and then I'll be your typical Honda with I/H/E. This will pretty much determine my overall opinion.
I'm running a 13.84 with an intake and exhaust. I just got a beat-up AN-R header, but I'm going to re-do some of the piping and then I'll be your typical Honda with I/H/E. This will pretty much determine my overall opinion.
03-31-2005, 02:20 PM
#20
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Re: type R or h22a (B18C5-EH2)
I like both swaps myself. Money however made me choose the h22 though. B18c5 top end does Own an H22a for sure. My h22 did come with an LSD so i at least have that advantage. I think ATS makes a 4.9 fd for H22 trannys.. if that is the case, I would consider doing that because it was stated that the gearing is poo. I agree. Either swap is a good idea. they both make lots of power. Buy what you can afford, not hype.
03-31-2005, 02:30 PM
#21
Honda-Tech Member
Re: type R or h22a (RotiEatter)
I will say this.
H22a swap is hard because you need to do more wiring then a B-series swap (some harness and motor combines are plug and play). Most people have problems with that. Wiring is something MOST people overlook.
I put together (for a friend) a H22a swap for $2900 for everything. Now, that is cheaper than a GSR swap and about $700 more than a B16a (second gen). The swap is perfect and no corners cut.
You have to ask yourself if you want to pay more for the swap and get a easier swap or pay less and get a swap you have to work harder for. They are similar then most people think.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b204dr »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">parts in general are more expensive and if you dont know which h22 you are buying and you buy a closed deck h22 and boost you suck-</TD></TR></TABLE>
Why are the parts more expensive? You can not compare a ebay **** b-series header to a ANR, IE, Hotshot header (h22a). Why does a closed deck suck for boost?
H22a swap is hard because you need to do more wiring then a B-series swap (some harness and motor combines are plug and play). Most people have problems with that. Wiring is something MOST people overlook.
I put together (for a friend) a H22a swap for $2900 for everything. Now, that is cheaper than a GSR swap and about $700 more than a B16a (second gen). The swap is perfect and no corners cut.
You have to ask yourself if you want to pay more for the swap and get a easier swap or pay less and get a swap you have to work harder for. They are similar then most people think.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b204dr »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">parts in general are more expensive and if you dont know which h22 you are buying and you buy a closed deck h22 and boost you suck-</TD></TR></TABLE>
Why are the parts more expensive? You can not compare a ebay **** b-series header to a ANR, IE, Hotshot header (h22a). Why does a closed deck suck for boost?
03-31-2005, 08:56 PM
#24
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Re: type R or h22a (B16B)
Word to b18c5-eh2.
I have ran a ITR Ek on the highway, from say 45-115, and it pulls ahead a tad (vids if needed). The ITR gearing is no joke, it really is a good motor. But for the cost, I still have to stand up for the H22. Good torque, overall nice power curve, match this with a lightened flywheel, and you got yourself a fast revving, torque filled motor - it truly is an awesome feeling.
Good header, Intake, Exhaust, some tuning = ~ 185+whp
I dunno, this is an ancient debate and there is no good answer. They both are good.
Just my .02
I have ran a ITR Ek on the highway, from say 45-115, and it pulls ahead a tad (vids if needed). The ITR gearing is no joke, it really is a good motor. But for the cost, I still have to stand up for the H22. Good torque, overall nice power curve, match this with a lightened flywheel, and you got yourself a fast revving, torque filled motor - it truly is an awesome feeling.
Good header, Intake, Exhaust, some tuning = ~ 185+whp
I dunno, this is an ancient debate and there is no good answer. They both are good.
Just my .02
03-31-2005, 09:14 PM
#25
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Re: type R or h22a (SpeedingHatch)
Personally ive never ran a c5 (raced or drivin) so my opinion is pretty biased. I will tell you that I initially wanted the h for a couple reasons. One, where I live its not as common as a b series, two; the difficulty level appealed to me, and three; the cost in comparison with a c1 or c5 (those were the only 2 other options i was considering). I will say that right now i am sitting at 180 whp and that was made with only, lightened flywheel, sri, exhaust, and chipped p28. So with a basically stock motor im sitting at a decent hp number with having done next to nothing to it.
So, if cost is a factor and you dont mind a bit of work, then h all the way. If cost isnt a factor and you want something thats fairly easy to pop in, then b series all day long.
So, if cost is a factor and you dont mind a bit of work, then h all the way. If cost isnt a factor and you want something thats fairly easy to pop in, then b series all day long.