KRiS1

Im looking at purchasing a JDM B18C-R and am trying to figure out what if any differences in this motor throught it's existence. Is there any year that is more disireable than others and if so why?

B18C5-EH2

Beginning in 1998 they came equipped with the 4.78 final drive-equipped trannies.

Why do you want the JDM one?

KRiS1

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C5-EH2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Why do you want the JDM one?</TD></TR></TABLE>

They seem to be more widely available and cost less

KRiS1

Is the 4.78 final drive optional or standard?





Modified by POS Hatchback at 11:02 AM 6/23/2003

B18C5-EH2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by POS Hatchback &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Is the 4.78 final drive optional or standard?

Modified by POS Hatchback at 11:02 AM 6/23/2003</TD></TR></TABLE>

It was standard on the 1998-up Spec JDM ITR.

Also the 1-3 gears are identical to the 4.400-equipped ITR, but the 4th and 5th gears are the same as the GS-R, which are taller.

Importers usually want more for the '98 Spec ones.

I still think spending the extra money on a USDM swap from a reutable yard like Import Auto Salvage is much wiser.

It can be 100% totally plug and play if you want to listen.

junglerunna

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C5-EH2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
It can be 100% totally plug and play if you want to listen.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Haha thats pretty funny. If I were him Id listen to people who have done that swap before.

KRiS1

Thanks for the info!

B18C5-EH2

First of all what type of car do you have?

What year, trim, etc?

I might have jumped the gun and assumed that you were a 1992-1995 hatch driver.

If you have a any 1992 or 1993-1995 VX or Si then it can be 100% plug and play for a USDM ITR swap if you use the Type R engine harness and a re0chipped P28 ECU from Kenji at kenji211@tampabay.rr.com .

I'm at work so my time to post is limited, but trust me before the day is out you will know how to plug and play with a USDM ITR swap into the cars aforementioned.

I even have pics.

KRiS1

94 civic Si
What about the JDM swap that makes it non-plug & play?
I kinda have to be cheap as my choice was between just ploping in the spec-R, or buying a c1 and giving it a mild rebuild.
Thanks again for all the help.

B18C5-EH2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by POS Hatchback &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">94 civic Si
What about the JDM swap that makes it non-plug & play?
I kinda have to be cheap as my choice was between just ploping in the spec-R, or buying a c1 and giving it a mild rebuild.
Thanks again for all the help. </TD></TR></TABLE>

The JDM swap will have the completely wrong engine harness because it's RHD. I have a friend who used his, but it wasn't easy and not all of the JDM motors (seldom do) come with the harness intact.

If you go JDM you'll need to use your engine harness from the Si. This means that you will have to do some MINOR repinning of TWO wires on the distributor.

Why?

Because the JDM engine will have a dizzy with only one plug on it while your engine harness has two plugs.

There is a very simple method for converting your dizzy to incorporate that extra plug as seen in these pictures:



And:



Simply move those two lowest wires to their color-coded plug on your engine harness - it's that easy.

Next will be the injectors. You'll need to use your injectors from your civic. No big deal as they are *supposed* to be nearly identical in flow rates.

Now what ECU are you going to run?

I say **** the JDM P73 ITR unit because of it's need for a jumper harness and it's crap-*** 115mph speed limiter and it's not so ideal fuel and timing maps. I ran the JDM ECU on my B18C5 as a temporary with a Kenji jumper harness until I got my P28 rechipped.

The P28 will not look for a knock sensor, so you won't have to wire one up like you will for the P73 ECU.

I say go with a re-chipped P28. The only minor complication is that you will need to add a VTEC oil pressure switch to the JDM R engine because the P28 looks for one and the engine lacks one and the stock JDM P73 ECU doesn't look for one.

Solution?

Take the one from your D16Z6 and it will bolt on and function just as a USDM B Series one would.

Easy as pie.

Last thing would be the alternator plug. It's been like 3 years since I did this swap so I honestly cannot remember, but I either located an OBD1 B Series unit, or repinned the plug on it, or it plugged in. That's the only blur right now.



So in reality the JDM swap isn't too horrible in terms of wiring.

My problems with them are their totally unknown history.

I have two local Atlanta friends that have both had their JDM Type R engines mysteriously self destruct.

One of them had a retainer come apart and drop a valve into the cc (user blykins) and the other isn't sure what happened with his, but it could have been a simple missed gear and not grabbing the wrong gear and mechanically over revving it.

I have mis shifted in my engine and driven the hell out of it for over two years with ZERO problems. My V-AFC logs rpm and it has tipped 9500rpm on completely stock internals, valvetrain, etc. and I still run totally strong.

Also the myth about the JDM engines making more power isn't always true either. My engine baselined 175/123 and my pal blykins baselined 177/125 so the difference in power isn't all that it's hyped up to be.

Bottom line IMO is that you get what you pay for.

Can you afford to spend an extra $700.00 or so for a 20K USDM engine?

Can you afford not to?

Katman

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by POS Hatchback &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">94 civic Si
What about the JDM swap that makes it non-plug & play?
I kinda have to be cheap as my choice was between just ploping in the spec-R, or buying a c1 and giving it a mild rebuild.
Thanks again for all the help. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Nothing about the JDM swap makes it non-plug n' play. You'll just need to use a US 96+/OBD2 integra engine harness (type-r or GSR suggested) . Even though its an OBD2 engine harness, it is compatible with an OBD1 vehicle, such as your 94 Si. You can't use the JDM engine harness because its designed for a right hand drive vehicle; some of the main harness plugs are on the wrong side to be used on a US vehicle.

B18C5-EH2

I just jogged my brain and remembered what to do for the alternator plug.

The OBD2 style that the JDM motor comes with is square.

Your engine harnes supports a round plug.

Either:

Swap the voltage regulator from your D series alternator into the B Series housing and plug that bitch right in.

Or:

Find an OBD1 B Series alternator.

As Katman has stated and I too have, the USDM swaps are plug and play if you use the P28 and an OBD2 Integra harness.

I doubt that you will want to locate and spend the extra money for an OBD2 Integra harness if you're really strapped for cash, but if you can find some sucker that has an extra one then go for it.

Ask around here for people with Type R swaps in their 1996-up civic DX and Cx hatches since they cannot use the Integra harness anyways.



Katman, where's that very nice pic of the OBD2 harness plugged into the EH chassis?

Here's my ghetto pics since Image Station resizes and screws them up:

KRiS1

Thanks for all you help Tom, looks like i will try to hunt down a US swap.

B18C5-EH2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by POS Hatchback &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks for all you help Tom, looks like i will try to hunt down a US swap. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Err, ummm, thank Jason/Katman too.

KRiS1

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by POS Hatchback &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks for all you help Tom, looks like i will try to hunt down a US swap. </TD></TR></TABLE>
edit:

Thanks for all you help Tom, Jason & Katman, looks like i will try to hunt down a US swap.

B18C5-EH2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by POS Hatchback &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
edit:

Thanks for all you help Tom, Jason & Katman, looks like i will try to hunt down a US swap. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Pssst!

Jason and Katman are one in the same y0!

WAFFLES

tehehehe

KRiS1

to me
would you believe it was a long, long weekend?

Katman

lol..

WAFFLES

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by POS Hatchback &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> to me
would you believe it was a long, long weekend?</TD></TR></TABLE>

at least your car didn't get broken into this weekend! Mine did!

KRiS1

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by WAFFLES &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

at least your car didn't get broken into this weekend! Mine did! </TD></TR></TABLE>

OUCH!
and all I was complaing about was working on saturday and having to take the wife and kid to an amusment park.

daver

Tom, are you saying you CAN'T use the obd2 injectors in the eg swap, or that its simply easier to use the si injectors?

Also, are you noticing a huge ratio in mysteriously blown jdm engines compared to usdm? You can't really know anything about the history of the usdm engine either, unless you knew the guy. what would cause a retainer to drop, a manufacturing defect? Or by some one fooling around with the engine, or overrevving it? You can tell pretty quick, the condition of an engine ( ie. the history) with a compression test or a leak down.

the jdm R's are only rated for like 3 fly hp more than the usdm ones anyway, aren't they? It looks like your friend got his 3 hp.

d

B18C5-EH2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by daver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Tom, are you saying you CAN'T use the obd2 injectors in the eg swap, or that its simply easier to use the si injectors?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well the OBD2 injectors don't plug into the OBD1 Civic harness. you could hack into the wiring and make it work, but unless you do it clean it'll look like ***.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also, are you noticing a huge ratio in mysteriously blown jdm engines compared to usdm? You can't really know anything about the history of the usdm engine either, unless you knew the guy. what would cause a retainer to drop, a manufacturing defect? Or by some one fooling around with the engine, or overrevving it? You can tell pretty quick, the condition of an engine ( ie. the history) with a compression test or a leak down.

the jdm R's are only rated for like 3 fly hp more than the usdm ones anyway, aren't they? It looks like your friend got his 3 hp.

d</TD></TR></TABLE>

I spoke with Larry Jr, the owner of arguably the best import salvage yard in the U.S, and he told me that while he's seen JDM R engines mysteriously failing and has not yet seen a USDM swap fail like thet yet.

Draw from that what you will.

daver

ok good, as long as it wasn't some injector impedance incompatibility or somthing. I'm actually planning out a jdm b18c gsr swap into a '94 cx. I'm just trying to make sure it CAN be done, assuming i just have an si harness.

I'd much rather get a late '90s engine over an obd1 engine. I'd hate to have my swap spitting oil out of every seal because they rotted out after sitting around some scrap yard for 8 years.

d