First of all, this is not a hate topic, I am not making fun of in anyway of the NSX or its owners (hell i own a black 2000 Civic Si) but I wonder why people purchase them, except for maybe a undying love towards honda.

First, let's look at the basics, the 2002 NSX has a 3.2ltr DOHC VTEC engine spitting out 290hp, it has a 6 speed tranny, RWD, it's very light and costs about $85,000 for a new one. Now, you gotta wonder, how can you justify spending $85K on this car.

Price wise, there are better bargians (take in consideration I am talking only new cars) A corvette z06 is $55K and would smoke a NSX, as would a $70K dodge viper. Sure the NSX is acura/honda's flagship, but $85K? A Trans Am Ram Air would be a very close race aswell for about $35K.

Ok, ok, I know you are all saying, yeah but they all have big v8s or v10s, so they're really not on the same level, but hey do you wanna fight on the same level?
Buy a BMW m3, a 3.2ltr making 333hp and more torque than a NSX, 6 speed, RWD, seating comfortably for 4 and for... $50k?!?

Amazing, now BMW uses a VTEC like system called VANOS, i know because my dad has a M coupe(z3 hatch with m3 engine), but after all of this how can you honestly buy a NSX? Yes, hey are reliable, fuel efficient, safe, etc.. but really is that the characteristics you want when you buy a sportscar?

 

yea but BMW is cool if ur old, the NSX is a awsome car, and i hate to say but the old men who buy thses cars arent looking at the 0-60 times, hell i like it but i would take an M5 over it, all im sayin is that is very well built car, it might not be the fastest but it will still turn heads where ever u go and to some ppl thats more important

 

You should get a ride in one. Your question will be answered mostlikely. Anyway here's why I picked one up.

1. Used ones are not so expensive and is still very reliable.
2. Looks - M3=sedan, NSX=Exotic
3. Build quality and reliability
4. Sound
5. Exclusivity
6. Overall performance. Granted, the numbers are not out of this world, but is still good.

But anyway, in the end it all depends on what you are looking for. I mean, if everyone bought Z06 or M3, it'd be a real boring world, right?

 

Like I said, new car's only, if yu want bargain performance get an old 80's camaro or trans am with a 350 and say goodbye!

 

Hmmm. . .there are tons of reasons why. But cost justification for a sports car is irrational. Why does someone spend $70K on a Viper if they can get a Mustang w/10K worth of mods to go faster. So price wise, there are better bargains than a Z06 or a Viper or Camaro or a Firechicken. Personally, I wouldn't buy a new NSX and I didn't. What I would do is buy an older one, mod the heck out of it, while spending a lot less than what a new Z06 would cost.

First the basics, stock vs. stock yes there are a few cars quicker in 0-60 and 1/4 mile. But 4.9 and 12.8 aren't anything to be ashamed of esp. w/ only 290hp. And can any of those cars boast that they are handmade? Out of aluminium? With each engine built by one person? Out of the best parts in the bin? Can any of those cars you mentioned boast a mid-mounted mini F1 engine screaming behind their ears? Can they boast of excellent engineering, ergonomics, performance, reliability, looks, drivability, track manners, and style?

I regularly track my NSX - a '91. With 270hp on a 11 turn 1.8 mile road course, I get around quicker than most Vettes, Vipers, Supras, or F-bodys. In fact, my NSX is just 2 seconds slower than a well driven Z06 on the above track. My last time out, a Hoosier shod Viper crashed trying to chase me down after I passed him. . .on the straight. 400hp Supras and Camaros run slower times than I do. Do I ask those guys why a 270hp honda just passed their 400hp monster on the straights? Do I mention that I paid at least 20K less for the car that just passed them? No, I don't. Do I sit and cry when a 400hp car passes me on the straight? "Awww, they passed me, I paid too much for my car, boohoo!" No, I don't. They should pass me - the hp difference is ungodly.

Again cost justification is pretty silly. Why spend 200K on a mcpherson struted Porsche 911GT2? B/c you want to and you can. You like the car and it's a hell of a performer. Besides, if you can spend $85 on an NSX you can probably spend another 10K in mods to satisfy any kind of acceleration envy.

BTW, to give you some credit, new NSX's aren't exactly topping the sales charts. But they do sell a few and those owners absolutely love their cars.

[Q]Yes, hey are reliable, fuel efficient, safe, etc.. but really is that the characteristics you want when you buy a sportscar?[/Q]

No, I want a car that I have to fix constantly. I want a car that I have to take to the gas station before I actually get to the mechanic. And I want a car that'll kill me. Preferably after I get the gas of course. What? Did you actually write that?

 

To be honest with you, I posted the same question last year. My answer, you really have to drive one to realize how great of a car it is. Is it as fast as the M3/M Coupe, maybe not. Is it better than the M Coupe, IMHO I believe so.


[Modified by fangtl, 11:36 PM 9/17/2002]

 

i notice that, you keep referring to modding cars, i wonder why? What I meant about the praticality issue is that people shouldn't be buyinng these type of cars with these characteristics on the top of their lists. As far as at the track, that is entirely based on the driver's skill, good for you, you seem to have some, however who cares what the car is built out of, if it makes a difference performance wise sure talk it up, but the M3 is a 4 seater with the same size engine and it beats it solid everytime. What I am saying is that <U>from the factory <U> there are far better choices in regaurds to performance and cost, style is a matter of opinion but an M3 seems to be a better choice. Granted, to each his own and if everybody got m3s they might get boring but in bang for the buck, safety, reliabilty, handling, i wouldn't see why someone wouldn't gt a M3 or a Z06

 

Obviously, people who spend $90,000 on an NSX aren't looking for the best bang-for-the-buck car. They don't care that a Z06 or M3 is faster. They can spend that money without a problem. And like someone said earlier - if you want the best performance bargain, just buy an old piece of crap and mod it, it'll kill factory Z06's. It seems like you keep thinking about best bargains - not everyone cares about that. For the most part, everyday people will view an NSX with higher regards than a Z06 or M3 - that alone might be enough for someone to spend $90,000.

 

I'm sorry was that off topic? I don't see where this was to be excluded from the discussion? If you had an M3 or Z06 (b/c you obviously wouldn't have an NSX) would you leave it stock?

They aren't at the top of the list. But they're pretty high up there. And they do figure significantly.

Thanks for the compliment but there are are better people out there. Including the Z06 guy that's 2 seconds quicker than I am. 2 SECONDS. I do realize that it's not entirely the car but a lot of it is. I'm able to exit corners so much quicker than most Vipers and Vettes that their horsepower advantage is negated in the straights. And a lot of people care what the car is built out of. Are you serious? Weight savings make up a huge difference in performance. If they made it out of steel, it'd weigh 3500 pounds and would need a V8 or forced induction to keep pace. But instead it does it with light weight and a 290hp V6. Have you ever lifted an NSX aluminium body panel? Honestly, it's incredible how light these panels are.

You should definitely buy one. Or better yet get a Supra. They have back seats too.

Yes, to each his own - good point. So why is it difficult to understand that? The jury is still out on the new M3's reliability - SMG and engine issues. Handling is also another question. Everyone I've talked to that's actually driven one says the E36 was a much better handler. Maybe you're talking about the CSL E46 version - but they don't sell those in the US. And forgive me, but I've never ever ever heard anyone say their Vette was reliable.

So if you think there are are better choices, buy the one you like. Whichever one you want is cool with everyone else I'm sure.

Shawn - who loves Vettes and still wants a '94 ZR1 and a M3 Lightweight.


[Modified by Ponyboy, 6:38 AM 9/18/2002]

 

Maybe that is why you drive a Civic, and others can afford an NSX, so they drive them...

 

___________________________

Why buy an NSX? Well if you are in the market and are concerned about the price to performance issue; you should NOT be looking into these cars. Why buy a Ferrari? The question REALLY is why not buy a ferrari if (you can). If you like it and can afford it, buy it, if not dont go annoying those who like it did buy it by saying they should of bought car xxx cuz its cheaper and performs xxx better than the nsx.(not that you are, but others do)

That is why people buy $200,000 lambos and $650,000 ferraris; dont beleive me? go to a dealer and ask how long is the wieghting list. If you think its a "cool name" thing, there are also waithing lists on cars most people never heard of like Zondas.

_____________________

The NSX is special and why buy it over a______? (my opinions)

1. M3 - Looks like a 3 series-not cool (a 850Csi would be nice ...M designed V12 pumping 396 hp..sweet)

2. vette - everyone has a vette, why not be different?

3. lotus - ugly, really ugly (not to mention tall people need not apply sign on the window

4. Viper - About as refined as muscle car, cool , but if I am to spent some $$, I want a pretty car

5. Used Ferrari - why not? Twin-Turbo Testarossas pushing over 700 hp for less than a 100K . Oh yeah, I can't afford upkeep

6. Porsche - looks like a frog. Frogs are not sexy. Frogs are ugly. really ugly.

7. Masarati - pretty, but not not pretty enough; though the 395hp Ferrari-made V8 is nice

8. Jaguar - fat version of the beautiful e type. Why not just buy a '64/'65 E type, and with the money left over buy a used nsx?

 

Oh yeah, upkeep is the big thing with NSXs, they are just cheap (in reletive terms) to maintain and parts are not that expensive (again reletive terms)

I love Ferraris and wanted to buy a 88 Ferrari Testarossa instead of my nsx. Only problem? simple example: clutch job on normal car? $350-$750 On NSX? 2500-3500 (w/ flywheel) Ferrari TR? $7000-8000 (w/ flywheel) Not to mention that Forza magazine tech section says that a TR's clutch should be replaced every 2000-3000 miles HELLO 2-3K miles not 20-30K, 2-3K!!!!!!!!!

ouch to say the least....nsx are cheap to maintain :implies:----&gt; daily driver; something many other cars can't claim as well; but now the compitition is also reletively ok to maintain (still not as good, but better than it was by far)...so sales sink some more....

 

I am in the market right now for a used NSX. I have found a 91 in awesome condition for 28,500 which I am working the details out now. I get the question asked to me all the time, why dont I get a Single T Supra for that price, or a Vette, etc. I chose the NSX for various reasons: exclusiveness, exotic car, I know hondas very well and am comfortable wth them, and the biggest reason of all&gt;&gt;&gt; I have ridden in one. The car sells its self.

 

And CivicUnrest, quite obviously, has not.



[Modified by nsxtasy, 10:42 AM 9/18/2002]

 

A couple more reasons:

The M3 and Z06 don't have the sound at 7800 RPM that makes the hair on the back of your neck stand up.

And a pristine '91 NSX for $35K is a lot better deal, and will turn a lot more heads, than an '02 Z06 or an '02 M3 for $55K.

 

all steel? Last time I checked they were all Fiberglass

 

Umm, Vette's have fiberglass body panels. That's a big difference from being "all steel."

Eh, yes they are. And it's not my fault if the average joe doesn't know how to drive a car.

Respectfully, we are all dumber for having read that. I guess that means your ITR is incredibly "plain slow."

I doubt it. Sincerely. Are they in the pits?

Again, we are now dumber for having read that. We're you joking?

Good point and I agree. The difference is not as big as you think. But there IS a difference. Obviously, some argue that it is a better car. Certainly there is room in the world for differing views.

Because they can. . .and they want to. Pretty simple. Little performance? Honda engineers, I'm sure, sincerely apologize to you. Wait, you didn't buy one did you?

Say it ain't so. . .please buy a Supra.


[Modified by Ponyboy, 9:43 PM 9/18/2002]


[Modified by Ponyboy, 9:44 PM 9/18/2002]

 

the corvette and m3 don't have the exotic look, the nsx is a damn exotic.

who cares if its faster, the corvette is a piece of ****! try putting the corvette on a lift and the front windshield will crack!!

imports
domestics

 

Steve, why do you hang at this forum? Pretty much everything that you post seems to be with negative attitude toward NSX/S2000. Do you get kick out of trying to prove that your beloved Z06 is such a superior car than anything else in this world? That's quite sad.

 

sorry to have cause so much hate, I just wanted to see how people justified spending $90,000 or so on a car from the factory when there are better options(performance wise anyway), in regards to appearance, that is completely subjective, I love the way porsches look, some may not, so as said, beauty lies in the eye of the beholder. As far as the M3 looking like a 3 series yes it does, but it has subtle changes in appearance just like the 99-00 Civic Si and the ITR (except the not so subtle yellow) well anyway take pride in your ride and aslong as you enjoy it, who cares.

 

steve kinda is right though, some of you guys should research before you start talking trash.

 

Your point? A jaguar convertable costs as much as a NSX, and its performance sucks, why would one buy that? The same argument above could be used to justify buying BMW 7 or MB S (or even a caddi) over a RR or Bently. Or a Zo6 over a Austin martin. Guess what...The owners of these cars can easily look 'down' on the cheaper cars because they know that if they WANTED they could of bought one(or 2 or 3), but they didnt. They prob. could still buy one now but dont want to. They are happy with what they have.

So your car xxx is faster in situation yyy? Fine good for you, if I wanted I will go and buy car xxx and say that now I can too, but I dont want to.

I repeat, people buy exotics because they like it for what ever reason (style, name, performance, hell even sound) They rarely go shopping around for the best bang for buck.

those who do not do this end up praising their great car due to its performance. Good for you.

Some people spend 50 grand on 64 jag E types. Why? its slow by todays standerds. well guess what, If they still made the E type with the exact same body as the series 1, I would buy it hands down even if it was a 100K; even if civics beat me left and right,

"why?" again its really "why not?"

 

And the only thing intelligent or reasonable about your statements is that most of the spelling is correct.


He's right. It does. Rather it can. . .if the driver knows what they're doing.

How about a McLaren F1? How about a Saleen S7? How about a Mosler? How about a Lotus Elise? How about a Caterham 7? What's your point? Would you also like to compare an NSX to a top fuel dragster?

But I'll take the bait, a 911, a non-turbo model, say a C4S (which is a pretty cool car). So around $83K, 0-62 in 5.1 and 5.6 if you get the Triptronic transmission. Weighs 3,241lbs. Hmmm. . .sounds pretty familar. And no it doesn't weigh 100 to 200 pounds lighter. So how about a 911? Wish I had one. Still a cool car, great brakes. By your definition this is pretty poor performance, right? Right.

And what about past models of the 911 and NSX? Stevie sure feels bad for the early model owners. Say the '93 models? Okay...

NSX $65K 3,010lbs 270hp 210lbs at 5300rpm
Carrera 2 $63K $63,900 3,031lbs 247hp 228lbs at 4800rpm

NSX 0-60: 5.03 0-100: 12.08 1/4: 13.47@105.6 top speed: 163mph skidpad: .94g.
Carrera 2 0-60: 5.13 0-100: 12.85 1/4: 13.74@103.6 top speed: 159mph skid: .93

By your and the Civic dude's definition, any '02 Porsche C4S or '93 Carrera 2 owner lacks good judgement b/c they paid as much for a car that doesn't perform as well? Do you know how ignorant and foolish that sounds?

Oh, did I mention that the NSX is more fuel efficient and reliable? It is. Safe too.

Shawn - who passed on buying an m coupe b/c it looked like a fat lady sat on it. Hell, a stock ITR looks better.


[Modified by Ponyboy, 4:30 AM 9/19/2002]


[Modified by Ponyboy, 4:42 AM 9/19/2002]

 

If I had to replace my '91 NSX, I'd buy a brand new '02. Yeah, it costs more than the Viper or the Z06 but let me tell you one thing: HORSEPOWER ISN'T EVERYTHING. Has anyone thought of power to weight ratios? The NSX weighs less so it does a pretty good job keeping up with the big boys with the V6 and I can almost get 30mpg (freeway crusing) to boot! The other important note is that those who bash the NSX and then finally get to DRIVE one change their minds really quick. I drove a Viper and sure, the car has tons of straightline speed, but other than that, I was not impressed. It's a dog in the corners and drives like a clown shoe. I believe the Z06's high tech answer is injection molded plastic. Big engine in a shitbox. The NSX is a very refined exotic, very reliable, has an awsome sounding engine at 8000rpm and is an absolute blast to drive. I have owned my '91 silver/black for five years now and wouldn't trade it for any other exotic on the planet. Nothing out there excites me as much as the NSX does. To me, the NSX is worth every penny. As always, this is my opinion.

Paul

 

When people buy exotics, they don't care about having the fastest performance. Half a second in the 1/4 mile is meaningless to the average exotic buyer. The Z06 may be nearly a second quicker in the 1/4, stop 10 feet shorter from 60-0 and pull 0.07g higher in the skid but what difference does it really make? Cars are not judged merely by their performance. Performance is but one aspect of it.

I would say exotics are judged on the following scale (in decreasing importance):

1. Looks (has to look like an exotic)
2. Rarity (must be limited to a few on the road)
3. Price (has to carry a hefty pricetag... related with #2)
4. Performance (must be fast)
5. Interior (upscale interior)
6. Uniqueness (such as 8000+rpm redline, aluminum body, hand-built, etc.)
7. Practicality (reliable and usuable)

In those terms, the NSX has the Z06 beat in 6 out of those 7 categories. That's why the NSX is a superior EXOTIC compared with the Z06. It's not the superior performance car, but it is the superior EXOTIC. Along the same lines, those factors are what makes the Ferrari, Porsche, Jaguar, Maserati, etc. superior EXOTICS compared with the Z06.

Performance is a big part of the equation when I buy cars, but I'm not so blind as to see that it's not the sole determining factor. Some people get it; others just... don't.