What are OBD II people doing for tuning programs??
08-26-2005, 09:58 AM
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What are OBD II people doing for tuning programs??
First let me say there is no need for this to be a poll, for some reason when I click start a new post it tells me I am logged out... tried logging out and back in a few times but whatever. Mods if you see this please ditch the poll. :confused:
Anyway, I have a 98 GSR, Im looking into building my own turbo setup and am at the part where I decide on a management system. I would prefer to retain the use of the factory sensors so going to a stand alone is not what Im after. I only know about Hondata and that is not OBD II compatible without going to an OBD I ecu. So my question is, is everyone doing the conversion or is there another way that I dont know about? Please let me know what to check out so I can keep moving forward. Thanks!
Modified by Demon_Dub at 11:14 PM 8/26/2005
Anyway, I have a 98 GSR, Im looking into building my own turbo setup and am at the part where I decide on a management system. I would prefer to retain the use of the factory sensors so going to a stand alone is not what Im after. I only know about Hondata and that is not OBD II compatible without going to an OBD I ecu. So my question is, is everyone doing the conversion or is there another way that I dont know about? Please let me know what to check out so I can keep moving forward. Thanks!
Modified by Demon_Dub at 11:14 PM 8/26/2005
08-26-2005, 10:52 AM
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Re: What are OBD II people doing for tuning programs?? (Demon_Dub)
Everyone is switching to OBD-I and running Hondata, Neptune, Uberdata, and Crome or they are ditching the ECU and going with AEM EMS. They all utilize the factory sensors. Your only option if you want to stay OBD-II is to use piggybacks like VAFC and SAFC.
08-26-2005, 11:07 AM
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Re: What are OBD II people doing for tuning programs?? (King Tut33)
I know you said no standalones but you can use the AEM EMS w/ all your stock sensors & harnesses and then just swap back to the stock ECU for any emissions testing purposes, since I'm assuming that's why you want to stay OBD2.
08-26-2005, 11:10 AM
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Re: What are OBD II people doing for tuning programs?? (King Tut33)
Agreed. OBDII is simply too robust to be easy to tune. It is just too difficult to trick it to do what you want.
So you can convert to OBDI and run Uberdata. Or, you can run MegaSquirt. You don't need onboard diagnostics (OBD) if you can datalog with a laptop. There really isn't anything MegaSquirt cannot do: COP, DIS, boost control, water/meth injection, extra injectors, automatic wideband tuning with a 8x8 target AFR map.... The list goes on.
So you can convert to OBDI and run Uberdata. Or, you can run MegaSquirt. You don't need onboard diagnostics (OBD) if you can datalog with a laptop. There really isn't anything MegaSquirt cannot do: COP, DIS, boost control, water/meth injection, extra injectors, automatic wideband tuning with a 8x8 target AFR map.... The list goes on.
08-26-2005, 11:16 AM
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Re: What are OBD II people doing for tuning programs?? (beepy)
http://www.xenocron.com/packages.pdf
Easy way to convert to OBD1 from OBD2...all in one nice easy (tunable) package
From there you can run Crome, Neptune, Hondata or Uberdata very easily.
Easy way to convert to OBD1 from OBD2...all in one nice easy (tunable) package
From there you can run Crome, Neptune, Hondata or Uberdata very easily.
08-26-2005, 11:42 AM
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Re: What are OBD II people doing for tuning programs?? (King Tut33)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by King Tut33 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Your only option if you want to stay OBD-II is to use piggybacks like VAFC and SAFC.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I'm using Greddy E-manage. (Flame on *******) It's worked perfectly fine for me and I've had damn good results with it. Oh but it's just a piggyback so don't waste your money
I'm using Greddy E-manage. (Flame on *******) It's worked perfectly fine for me and I've had damn good results with it. Oh but it's just a piggyback so don't waste your money
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08-26-2005, 02:14 PM
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Re: (epic1si)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by epic1si »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Apexi Power FC is obdIIa.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I went on to Apexi's website and checked this. The Power FC will keep important functions like AC working, however it will work alongside OBDII. You replace the OEM ECU with Apexi unit.
I went on to Apexi's website and checked this. The Power FC will keep important functions like AC working, however it will work alongside OBDII. You replace the OEM ECU with Apexi unit.
08-26-2005, 02:16 PM
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Re: (Demon_Dub)
Also for those of you who have gone to an OBDI ecu and are using larger injectors, how are you passing emmisions?
The way I understand it, if they cant talk to the OBDII port you fail, and if you swap your OBDII ecu back in your car runs like **** or you throw codes. Fail/Fail.
The way I understand it, if they cant talk to the OBDII port you fail, and if you swap your OBDII ecu back in your car runs like **** or you throw codes. Fail/Fail.
08-26-2005, 02:42 PM
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just go fmu like me! LOL!
i don't get why there is a poll...and those items on the poll. but yeah. most ppl just convert to obd1. i would like to stay with obd2 as well cause emissions is soooooo much easier with it. but i don't know what exactly to do. if AEM ems is the answer, i will go that way.
i don't get why there is a poll...and those items on the poll. but yeah. most ppl just convert to obd1. i would like to stay with obd2 as well cause emissions is soooooo much easier with it. but i don't know what exactly to do. if AEM ems is the answer, i will go that way.
08-26-2005, 05:55 PM
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Re: (LiTtOGPiMp)
they don't make Hondata for OBDII? then whats this thing? http://www.hondata.com/wizard/wiz_civic96.html
08-26-2005, 07:13 PM
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Re: (Demon_Dub)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Demon_Dub »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also for those of you who have gone to an OBDI ecu and are using larger injectors, how are you passing emmisions?
The way I understand it, if they cant talk to the OBDII port you fail, and if you swap your OBDII ecu back in your car runs like **** or you throw codes. Fail/Fail. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Only way to do it is swap back in the stock ECU and stock injectors. If you are turbo...take out the wastegate spring and hope they dont pop the hood and look in
The way I understand it, if they cant talk to the OBDII port you fail, and if you swap your OBDII ecu back in your car runs like **** or you throw codes. Fail/Fail. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Only way to do it is swap back in the stock ECU and stock injectors. If you are turbo...take out the wastegate spring and hope they dont pop the hood and look in
08-27-2005, 08:53 AM
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Re: (xenocron)
How is it that cars like the Subaru's, Evo's, and VW's have OBDII compatible software but the most commonly and most popular car to mod in the country doesnt? Does that not make sense to anyone else?
08-27-2005, 05:59 PM
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Re: (Vanilla_Gorilla)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Vanilla_Gorilla »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ohhh ok i see now, well if you do the switch to OBD1 is there any set backs, or functions that wont work sence you are back tracking?</TD></TR></TABLE>
just cant hook up diagnostic equipment to the stock OBD connector
just cant hook up diagnostic equipment to the stock OBD connector
08-27-2005, 06:01 PM
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Re: (Demon_Dub)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Demon_Dub »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">How is it that cars like the Subaru's, Evo's, and VW's have OBDII compatible software but the most commonly and most popular car to mod in the country doesnt? Does that not make sense to anyone else?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Its all about cost.
Suby, EVO and VW guys are much less tight fisted than your average 16-18 yr old honda enthusiast.
Honda are like marijuana...its a gateway drug to bigger an better things.
Some of the reflashing equipment for those other platforms goes for roughly $10k too...you dont see a lot of DIYers out there pushing the envelope and buying that type of equipment.
They are working on it...check out the OBD2 forum on PGMFI.org
Its all about cost.
Suby, EVO and VW guys are much less tight fisted than your average 16-18 yr old honda enthusiast.
Honda are like marijuana...its a gateway drug to bigger an better things.
Some of the reflashing equipment for those other platforms goes for roughly $10k too...you dont see a lot of DIYers out there pushing the envelope and buying that type of equipment.
They are working on it...check out the OBD2 forum on PGMFI.org
08-28-2005, 10:01 AM
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Re: (b_ron007)
Actually, Hondata's K-pro software is for OBDII computers on K series engines. The problem with Honda's first gen OBDII computers is that they use PROM chips and can't be reprogrammed. The latest generation (K series) can be.
I attended a Hondata seminar yesterday given by one of the owners who explained all this. Basically the K series is a gift to tuners - you get 50 degrees of intake cam adjustment just from the computer.
K series is the wave of the future...these guys are getting 60 HP just from bolt ons and tuning....scary.
I attended a Hondata seminar yesterday given by one of the owners who explained all this. Basically the K series is a gift to tuners - you get 50 degrees of intake cam adjustment just from the computer.
K series is the wave of the future...these guys are getting 60 HP just from bolt ons and tuning....scary.
08-28-2005, 10:35 AM
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Re: (econorocket)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by econorocket »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Actually, Hondata's K-pro software is for OBDII computers on K series engines. The problem with Honda's first gen OBDII computers is that they use PROM chips and can't be reprogrammed. The latest generation (K series) can be.
I attended a Hondata seminar yesterday given by one of the owners who explained all this. Basically the K series is a gift to tuners - you get 50 degrees of intake cam adjustment just from the computer.
K series is the wave of the future...these guys are getting 60 HP just from bolt ons and tuning....scary.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
There we go, thats the answer I was looking for. I have owned numerous constantly broken VW's and just sold a WRX and let me tell you, its not just Honda fella's who are tight fisted.
I attended a Hondata seminar yesterday given by one of the owners who explained all this. Basically the K series is a gift to tuners - you get 50 degrees of intake cam adjustment just from the computer.
K series is the wave of the future...these guys are getting 60 HP just from bolt ons and tuning....scary.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
There we go, thats the answer I was looking for. I have owned numerous constantly broken VW's and just sold a WRX and let me tell you, its not just Honda fella's who are tight fisted.
08-28-2005, 12:45 PM
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Re: (Demon_Dub)
Well - I can tell you, I routinely beat 10 or so WRX's at my local autocross with my 99 Civic SI. Very reliable too - I've been beating on it for almost 6 years, and 100,000 miles without a hiccup. Now I'm gonna supercharge it and see what happens.
In a few years I'll probably sell it and buy an RSX type S. The dynos Doug at Hondata showed went from 160 WHP to over 220 with the right IHE and digital cam tuning. Supercharging is good for well over 300 WHP on these things - I think his best plot showed like 330 whp at 8000 rpm - and still climbing.
You can get the K-series Civic Si's for cheap - especially now that the next Generation Si is coming out - with the RSX engine!
Modified by econorocket at 6:17 PM 8/28/2005
In a few years I'll probably sell it and buy an RSX type S. The dynos Doug at Hondata showed went from 160 WHP to over 220 with the right IHE and digital cam tuning. Supercharging is good for well over 300 WHP on these things - I think his best plot showed like 330 whp at 8000 rpm - and still climbing.
You can get the K-series Civic Si's for cheap - especially now that the next Generation Si is coming out - with the RSX engine!
Modified by econorocket at 6:17 PM 8/28/2005
08-29-2005, 08:45 PM
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Re: (econorocket)
people in NY...
with the new obd2 laws, what are you doing to pass inspection? the only ways I've heard is to put the stock obd2 ecu, stock injectors so you won't throw any codes. this whole inspection crap is kinda holding me back from going turbo
with the new obd2 laws, what are you doing to pass inspection? the only ways I've heard is to put the stock obd2 ecu, stock injectors so you won't throw any codes. this whole inspection crap is kinda holding me back from going turbo
08-29-2005, 09:59 PM
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Re: (econorocket)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by econorocket »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well - I can tell you, I routinely beat 10 or so WRX's at my local autocross with my 99 Civic SI. Very reliable too - I've been beating on it for almost 6 years, and 100,000 miles without a hiccup. Now I'm gonna supercharge it and see what happens.
In a few years I'll probably sell it and buy an RSX type S. The dynos Doug at Hondata showed went from 160 WHP to over 220 with the right IHE and digital cam tuning. Supercharging is good for well over 300 WHP on these things - I think his best plot showed like 330 whp at 8000 rpm - and still climbing.
You can get the K-series Civic Si's for cheap - especially now that the next Generation Si is coming out - with the RSX engine!
Modified by econorocket at 6:17 PM 8/28/2005</TD></TR></TABLE>
Maybe I missed it, but what are you using to tune your Si? What's your setup?
In a few years I'll probably sell it and buy an RSX type S. The dynos Doug at Hondata showed went from 160 WHP to over 220 with the right IHE and digital cam tuning. Supercharging is good for well over 300 WHP on these things - I think his best plot showed like 330 whp at 8000 rpm - and still climbing.
You can get the K-series Civic Si's for cheap - especially now that the next Generation Si is coming out - with the RSX engine!
Modified by econorocket at 6:17 PM 8/28/2005</TD></TR></TABLE>
Maybe I missed it, but what are you using to tune your Si? What's your setup?