I Have an STD

ok well heres my problem. my car has decided that today it wants to smoke. i dont really know why, dont know why it has to be now, but today it happened. now the question is, whats wrong with it?

ok 1st off. Turbo B16 stock bottom, unknown milage. 48/60 T3 log mani, 2.5 inch DP to 3" totally unresticted catback (new yesterday, just built it). the car is tuned on crome pro by xenocron, so im confident in the tune. i run a catchcan (it works, so i dont have to explain how i have it run)

im thinking its my turbo seals. i dont run a restrictor, but my line is -3an so i shouldnt need one correct? it smokes at idle and i THINK on decel, but i cant tell. i know that every time i come to a stop, i get a plume of smoke that comes from the exahaust. im gonna pull the filter tomorrow and check out shaft play and to see if i have any oil in my charge pipes (though i shouldnt, causemy turbo doesnt shoot down, it shoots up)

i did a compression test as soon as i saw the smoke and it was 185 190 185 195, so thats fine. i also had a little smoke coming from my valve cover breather (i run a tube to the ground) and a little oil on the end of the tube. anr my ringlands smoked too?

ALSO the car felt like it was down on power today compared to last night. would the turbo blowing out its seals hurt its efficiency? BUT it was 45 degrees last night and CLEAR and today it was 70 and overcast/humid.

and also.... the car still pulls 20-21 hg/m at idle and 24ish on decel. could my vacuum still be that good with smoked ringlands?

Mr. Vapor

just a silly question, but you did a proper compression test under proper conditions.....warm engine, throttle WOT (i know you know this but sometimes in the heat of the moment its easy to forget)

I Have an STD

just got done driving to buffalo (engine was def warm) and throttle was def wide open.

G2turbo_terror

Well you said you just built the exhaust system, is there a possibility the bends/pipe were greasy on the inside and now thats burning off? I know some on the bends I've used before were dirty as hell on in inside.

I Have an STD

i drove the car 65 miles before i saw any smoke. it would have burnt off way before then

drintegra

Maybe it was the drive to buffalo. Do you have Datalogging? Do a leakdown test to make sure. It only smokes on Decel and at IDle? Is the smoke white, blue, black? Thick heavy plume of smoke, and does the smoke quickly dicipate after it comes out or does it linger?

I Have an STD

no datalogger. and ive taken the car on 4 300+mile trips since its been boosted. why would it start now?

yes it seems that its just decel and idle. the smoke it blue, its oil smoke, there is no doubt about that. and when i come to a stop, i will get a thick shot of smoke then it pretty much goes away, except for a little bit lingering for a second (could have been condensation though)

typrdb8

maybe valve seals or turbo seal

I Have an STD

valve seals wouldnt just go randomly. they go progressively

GaRn

I would guess its not the turbo, just a guess though.. when my turbine seal was leaking the smoke was more whitish colored...

I Have an STD

im leaning more towards the motor now. anyone have a complete spare b16 block laying around?

I Have an STD

a friend told me that he had good compression even after he killed the ringlands on one of his pistons. is this common? cause it seems like that might be my problem

tallyturbo

http://www.hmotorsonline.com/s...it=20

complete longblock 900 bones

I Have an STD

why get the 2nd gen? spend 300 bucks for 10 hp. no thanks.

but anyway, heres a little development.

i just went outside and drove the car. got on it a little, cruised a little, engine braked ALOT.

the car smokes all the time when you are ON it. but only on decel/idle/pulling away from a light when you ARENT on it.

heres the big thing. we let it sit and idle for 8-10 mins without doing anything. didnt smoke. then when i revved it up (not driving it, just free-revving) it shot out a HUGE cloud of smoke. this makes me think turbo right? the oil it getting past the seals in the turbo and pooling at idle with no load. then, when you rev it up, it blasts all that pooled oil out in one big blast. am i correct in this? should i order a rebuild kit?? or you guys still think its the motor?

Mr. Vapor

ive got a GSR block in my living room you can have for free

I Have an STD

does it come with the hole?? or do i have to buy that seperate?

EJ1 wilcox

My guess would be the turbo.

Typically if it's your rings or ringlands you wouldn't have even compression like you do. And since it happened rather suddenly I wouldn't think it's your valve seals.

So, that leaves your turbo. I would take the downpipe and compressor filter (if you run one) off and check out the housings/blades. Also check for shaft play etc.

I had a similar problem and it ended up being my compressor seal. I was burning oil, so I checked compression (okay) and took my downpipe off. The turbine blades were dry as a bone and there was no build up or signs of leaking seals. So, I put it back together and drove it some more, but the problem didn't stop.

Then, one night at the drag races I noticed a bunch of oil all over the left side of my engine bay. After some inspection I realized that oil was shooting out of my blow off valve when I shifted!! LoL. So I took off my lower charge pipe (the closest to the turbo) and oil dumped out!

Turns out my compressor seal was leaking oil into my charge pipes and intercooler. My intercooler had about a quart of oil in it. LoL.

Anyways, check both sides of your turbo, sometimes one side leaks and the other one doesn't.

N20civicB18

I used to rock a LS turbo, did the same thing.... desided it was time for a rebuild, taken it apart I noticed my turbo seals were shot due to a kinked return line, but I also found that I had a cracked ring land.... all my compression numbers were fine. So basically for me im not sure if it was one or the other or both... but good luck to you!

turbotime

brett what have u done now?

i think its ur turbo or the ringlands, well figure it out tonight no worries

GaRn

Before you start dumping tons of money do some cheap stuff first..

Go on ebay and don't waste money on an entire rebuild kit, but search for stagger gap ring, and buy a stagger gap turbine shaft ring seal..

This one little piece made the difference in my car from billowing smoke like crazy(looked like a fire exstinguisher went off) after letting off of a hard run, to not smoking at all..

Just disassemble your turbo and be sure and index(mark) your compressor blade and shaft so everything stays balanced when you reassemble it.. its really not hard, just dive right in and do it, a monkey could figure it out..

Do that, and then maybe go with a bigger return line too..

Also, like mentioned, check your spark plugs to see if you have any residue, check your exhaust ports on the head to see if you see wetness, and then check after the turbo..

if its only after the turbo then there is your problem obviously...

blackeg

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EJ1 wilcox &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I had a similar problem and it ended up being my compressor seal. I was burning oil, so I checked compression (okay) and took my downpipe off. The turbine blades were dry as a bone and there was no build up or signs of leaking seals. So, I put it back together and drove it some more, but the problem didn't stop.

</TD></TR></TABLE>


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by I Have an STD &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the car smokes all the time when you are ON it. but only on decel/idle/pulling away from a light when you ARENT on it.

heres the big thing. we let it sit and idle for 8-10 mins without doing anything. didnt smoke. then when i revved it up (not driving it, just free-revving) it shot out a HUGE cloud of smoke. this makes me think turbo right? the oil it getting past the seals in the turbo and pooling at idle with no load. then, when you rev it up, it blasts all that pooled oil out in one big blast. am i correct in this? should i order a rebuild kit?? or you guys still think its the motor?</TD></TR></TABLE>


both of these sound like my situation. motors my turbo was on from range from a 200k ls motor, to 2 different lsvtecs both with less than 3000 miles. once i start driving it smokes for a lil while, then goes away. only other time it smokes is if im on it hard, and half that smoke is black cuz my a/f is probably low 11s right now.


brett, im thinking it might be your turbo. im rather confident that is what is/was happening to me

I Have an STD

thanks for all your help guys. im thinking turbo too. im gonna run to the junkyard today (in the rain ) and grab a SAAB T3 and slap that on my car. id the smoking stops, i'll know thats my problem. then ill order the minor kit off ebay and rebuild my big T3 and then i'll have a backup SAAB T3 in case this ever happens again.

oh, and my return line is 5/8 heater hose wrapped in electrical tape. its PLENTY big

I Have an STD

ok, grabbed a turbo ($54 ) its a 42/48 T3 and the car seems like its smoking MUCH less. the turbo hadnt had oil in it for a LONG time so im sure the seals need to be moistened before it will STOP smoking. but it SEEMS like this was my problem. im gonna go drive itaround a little more later and find out

ham

i didnt read all the replys but i just have 2 things that came to mind when I read your post.
1. my b16a had 215psi across the board with a calibrated pressure transducer. A friend of mine blew 3 ring lands and was smoking badly but still had good compression.
2. if you take the turbo off and if there is wet oil on the turbine but not in the manifold, your seal is blown. If there is oil in the charge pipe, that seal is obviously blown.

I Have an STD

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ham &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i didnt read all the replys but i just have 2 things that came to mind when I read your post.
1. my b16a had 215psi across the board with a calibrated pressure transducer. A friend of mine blew 3 ring lands and was smoking badly but still had good compression.
2. if you take the turbo off and if there is wet oil on the turbine but not in the manifold, your seal is blown. If there is oil in the charge pipe, that seal is obviously blown.</TD></TR></TABLE>

well i have CTR intake and GSR exhaust cam. the overlap is a little more than a stock b16, which might have affected my compression. i also have a 1st gen b16 which has slightly lower compression than the 2nd gen. my motor might also be tired. its been boosted for a few thousand miles and i drive it pretty hard. if it keeps smoking i'll probably just throw an LS block in it and hope for the best.