spoonb18b

i have a 1998 ls with 68 000 miles on factory issued bottom end. i use my car as a dailydriver and i go to the trackonce and a while and go down to the street races. what wouldbe a better setup for me a drag turbo kit between 7-10 psi or a vortec supercharger kit. im concerned on blowing the bottom end. please post back any suggestions or any expieriences with both. any info will be appreciated and used.

Mase

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spoonb18b

i have been searching but i can't make adecision on which would be better the turbo makes more power but i can't figure out how long the bottom end will last.

boosted92

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by spoonb18b &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i have been searching but i can't make adecision on which would be better the turbo makes more power but i can't figure out how long the bottom end will last.</TD></TR></TABLE>

If you're concerned about reliability and a more powerful car with daily driving, don't even think about a vortech. This may not be as big of an issue running a smaller blower and a 4-rib pulley on a honda, but centrifugal blowers put enormous loads on the front snout of the crankshaft, I have seen several cars actually snap the snout off the crank after running a blower for a long time, which cuases the domino effect destruction of the rest of the motor. Not to mention you have to deal with belt slip, and vortechs make **** for low end torque.

LostCRX

apparently you're not ready for a FI vehicle. More search would do you good. Block will last pretty good if you know what you're doing. This supercharger vs tubro charge question have been beaten to death.

spoonb18b

i have been wanting to go turbo for a while and i have just been hearing real good stories about boosted ls or real bad ones so im kinda getting spooked now.

Hoosier Daddy

Superchargers actually put more strain on the motor. Turbo all the way

gsrhatch530

Do they even make a vortech charger for the LS?

GDM Z28

id go with a turbo over a SC any day. i just ran a SCed ls on 8 lbs and i have a turboed ls on 8 lbs and i put about 5 cars on him. you can see the vids here:

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=743149

ClubSiRacer

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gsrhatch530 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Do they even make a vortech charger for the LS?</TD></TR></TABLE>

No, they dont but i'm sure you could fab the mounts up...

The Vortech makes less strain on the motor than my A/C did running so I doubt anyone has snapped the crank in half or whatever you people claim. Its funny the wack stories the haters come up with.

I've been running a 15+psi Vortech on my car for ~25k miles now, no problems sans replacing $14 belts every 6 months, pending I remember to retension it after a the first run prior to boosting it hard. (The belts tend to stretch 1/4" or more after they are first run and if you dont retension the belt after warming it up on a nice soft drive, it will fly off and tends to end up in many pieces.)

On a low revving LS, you could easily run a very agressive pulley and make considerable boost down low. Granted I run my revs to 9k, I also have a built B16 and prior to my 8 rib belt setup, I could not make higher boost without revving it more. With my new setup, I can run a 2.75" supercharger pulley and make 20psi at 7000rpm if I so desire. This scales down to about 15psi at 5000rpm and 10psi at 3500rpm roughly which would still be extremely stout on an LS bottom end. Dont want 20psi at 7000rpm but still want asstastic amounts of boost? Got a manual boost control? Good, the "bypass valve" functions in the same was as a wastegate, figure it out... (IE: use the boost control to bleed off boost past a set level using the bypass valve, thus make superhuge boost at low RPM's while limiting boost up top if you dont want so much power.)

Sure, you could run a turbo still and make big numbers... but their will always be someone with a bigger turbo than you.

pissedoffsol

http://www.hondaswap.com/forum...29398

ClubSiRacer

Its funny how incorrect that is...

Fact: The supercharger can be easily spun by hand with virtualy no resistance. It is gear driven internaly to increase the impeller RPM which adds some drag but increases the output substantialy.

Fact: The boost does rise with RPM's, though it is not linear and not a 1:1 ratio. In fact, i make virtualy full boost by 7000rpm where it pretty much holds there to redline. Why not full boost at 4000rpm? Well first of all, the blower is moving more CFM's at a lower temp compared to a smaller turbo that would spool quickly. Remember, pressure alone isnt everything....

Fact: My track times pretty much prove lack of a mountainous midrange means next to nothing when you are making peak power during 90% of your power band unlike a peak torque that would be closer to 4000-5000rpm on a "typical" turbo setup where all that extra power is simply wasted up top. (I'll use the Subaru WRX for example, it pulls very strong from 3000-5000rpm but makes **** for power from 5000 to redline. It simply falls on its face yet it still has a healthy amount of midrange torque you quickly rev right past.)

Fact: NOBODY in the world will start a race accelerating from near idle in a car that revs to 9000rpm or more. With that said, gearing is your friend... If you need to accelerate faster and you are in 5th gear, downshift. Instant rpm increase = greater boost = greater power and acceleration thanks to both gearing and the tall power band.

I've said it 420300234 times now, yes a turbocharged car with a properly sized turbo at an equil power level will be SLIGHTLY faster in the 1/4 mile assuming the torque doesnt drasticly fall off past the surge near 5000rpm.

When I run at the drag strip side by side with 11/12 second turbocharged Civics, we pull virtualy the same. The power feels the same, the cars accelerate the same. Hell, if you didnt know any better, you'd think my car was turbocharged also.

The REAL problem with people running Vortech superchargers is the fact the blower itself is BEST when run at high power levels. It really doesnt start to sing until 12psi or higher. At that point the midrange is strong enough to break the tires loose at will. In fact, my car makes MORE torque at 2000rpm WITHOUT BOOST and with low compression than it did in stock form as a peak. Now people saying that the supercharger draws so much power, answer me this... Why would I make MORE power than stock TOTAL at 2000rpm with 1 point lower compression while driving a supercharger that "draws so much power to turn" without using creating boost at all. Oh yea, thats right... An engine is just a big air pump and the blower on the end of the shaft may not be making positive pressure, it sure as hell is making it easier on the engine to pull in air.


Modified by ClubSiRacer at 4:48 PM 1/26/2004

B18bEK

vortec

JrCRXHF

all i can tell you is that my t3/t4e stage 5 makes good power i am not done tuning yet due to all the damn snow up here but i have been happy with the turbo setup but for a daily driver a jackson might be what you need they are cheep i mean if i had to do it all over again i would look into it for the money for a used blower. but anyway you go just do alot of reading and ask people who put stuff like this on other peoples cars for a living they will tell you what is easier or what might work for you the best. you could talk to tom payn if you are in michigan area he can help you make this call. http://www.payntechnologies.com/