I've done a search already! So,

1990 B16A, I am adding forced induction, and am swapping in GSR cams. What else do you guys recommend I do? valves,retainers,springs,valve guides?

over sized valves? stainless steel valves? which ones? thanks!

bottom end = stock, planning to run not more than 10psi.

Also, while I have the head off, what can I do to improve flow? not many shops around here. What's involved in Port & Polish

And what head gasket? I was planning to go with a stock one.


[Modified by bonesix, 7:21 AM 12/6/2002]

 

simple and simply works
ITR head, GS-R cams..
revs to 8500 ish rpm, ported head...
honda heads flows very well as it is

and built bottom end





[Modified by Flamenco-T, 1:29 AM 12/6/2002]

 

I want to work with what i have.

Going to run low boost, and leave bottom end stock.

Or are you saying just get all ITR valvetrain,valves, etc. and GSR cams.

 

Since you are going to only run 10psi on stock bottom end, just keep the head stock. No need to touch it.

Ive run that for that for almost 2yrs. Im gonna start to do a rebuild on my motor for more boost and my head is gonna remain for the most part stock. The only thing Im gonna change is the Valvesprings, retainers, and new seals. No port and polish needed.

A new head gasket is good too.

art

 

Ok, so just put the cams in, what do people mean when they say "do the valves too" and "get a valve job"

 

A valve job should be part of the Head porting. Honda valves are acutally pretty damm good already! But if you really want to replace the valves go with supertech black nitrite valves. As far as cams, go with Type R cams, you will thank me later. I gained a couple of horses with Type R cams as compared to Gsr cams.

 

This brings us back again to the whole itr vs gsr cam debate. I wish someone would post some solid numbers showing the dyno difference between the two cams. I keep reading so and so says he lost power, he so and so gained power. I'd like to hear the set-ups and dyno #'s to get a solid answer. To much hersay and conjecture going on with the cam debate.

 

That is why I still have stock cams. I havent seen solid proof just yet. Not that I that it wont ever happen, but anything is possible. I just kept it simple and used what I already have. A "few" extra ponies isnt enough for me to buy other cams.

art

 

I hear ya Art. I was going to send my head out to portflow to get a pnp job done to it for my 2.0 gsr block, but after reading some of the posts from jinxproof and littlebluecrx, they convinced me to just buy new valvetrain and call it quits. I am going to do a little clean up of the ports, and the combustion chamber. Nothing to drastic, pnp comparable to the itr.

Now contributing to this thread. I have skunk2 valvesprings, and titanium retainers. I was debating on what valves i should get. I am not sure to go standard or 0.5mm oversized. I probably will go with the skunk2 valves, to keep things consistent. Any thoughts on 0.5mm oversized valves? Does the head need to be modified in any way to compensate for the larger valve seat?

 

I agree. Wheres the proof?

 

will putting gsr/typer cams into a 1.6 litre afftect anything? compression? or?

i'm fairly set on putting in gsr cams, as i have the first gen b16a cams now, and have been told they are the mildest


edit, ALSO, whats the difference with valves? stock VS aftermarket


[Modified by bonesix, 3:07 AM 12/7/2002]

 

Installing cams with not have any effect upon the compression ratio of an engine. Cams open and close valves in manner that allows air/fuel to enter into the combustion chamber. Cam design is based off of lift and duration. The more lift the cam has, the harder it pushes on the valve opening it for a fixed time period. The fixed time period is dictated by the duration of the cam. The duration is how long the valve it keep open, ie the fixed time period. Working together, the camshaft allows for different amounts of air to be drawn into the combustion chamber. A high lift, short duration cam is desired for force induction vehicles. A short lift, long duration is desired for a naturally aspirated vehicle. Overlap is another aspect of camshafts. Overlap is when the intake and exhaust valves are opened at the same time. You want to keep overlap to a minimum with forced induction, allowing more air to be crammed into the combustion chamber. Naturally aspirated engines want more overlap, to allow the engine to move more airflow. Gsr cams have a lower overlap from the factory, more so than si or itr cams. Conversely, itr cams have more overlap better suited for all motor applications. Overlap can be dialed out with the use of cam gears, but only to a certain extent.

Aftermarket valves usually are forged, where as the stock ones are a cast material. Just like pistons, the forging makes the material alot stronger. Also, the valves can be nitrate coated, allowing for the air to move past the metal quicker, and therefore allowing for higher revs. There are oversized and standard sized valve designs as well. The standard are just that, models of the stock size valve much like aftermarket pistons modeled after stock size engine bore. The oversized valves are typically 0.5mm, 1mm and in some extreme cases 2mm oversized. The oversizings allows for more airflow to be moved by the engine. Usually the intake gets the larger of the valve size, to keep the air in the combustion chamber longer.

 

thanks for the info.!!


so the gsr cams alone will be a power increase over my 1st gen b16a cams?

 

I wish, I still had my dyno sheet with the gsr cams. I don't know where that one went, actually I don't know which dyno sheet is which because I didnt label them. All I know is that I made more hp with type r cams then with gsr cams. Gsr cams are fine for turbo also, it's jsut that I made more hp with my particular setup with type r cams.

I would go and pull out my type r cams and installl the gsr cams back in and then goto the dyno. But I'm too lazy

I guess everyone just has to believe me.

edit- Everyone is always trying to get more lift for turbo cams, but no one ever focus on duration. It's not always true that short duration is better for FI. That's all I'm saying.


[Modified by ekb18c, 2:16 PM 12/7/2002]

 

Since its a 90' head, check if cam journal & bore surfaces have too much wear.
I also have a 1g b16a head.
When I put on set of fairly new cams, the cam bores on the head look too worn out (oval). Makes me want to dish out $$$$ for a brand new head, cuz when its together I wouldn't want valvetrain to byebye @ 8000rpm!
I will post something about this pretty soon, since there is nothing in the search about it.

Your big TB + ITR cams = ?

 

Are you sure stock valves are cast?? I have a hard time believing that.

If anyone has a stock valve, I could take it to work to verify.

 

thanks for the info. i'll check it out, but swapping cams is fine with everything else stock on a 1st gen b16a head?

 

If you are willing to get a new valvetrain you should do what i did. Get some ITR (not CTR - very imprtant) and get skunk2 springs and retainers. This should bring your redline safely up to about 9500. The only good thing about gsr cams is the very low overlap, something like 17 degrees. Type r's have like 25 degrees but have a 1mm more lift on each cam, very nice. But you might want to get some adjustable cam gears to take some of that overlap out that you have gained cause it won't help. The good thing about getting the valvetrain at the same time as you get the cams is that type r cams will make power all the way up to about 8800-9000. GSR's will drop off around 8000. So if you are planning on getting gsr cams there really is no reason to get a better valvetrain cause you won't be able to use your higher rev capabilities and it's not like gsr cams have any bigger lift than stock so it wouldn't require stronger springs for that.

The only good thing that could come from getting the gsr's are that the money you saved on the springs and retainers, you could put toward oversized valves, which i hear is the best headwork a b-series head can have done.

Hope i helped

 

thanks!!