camp1320.com

As you know the guys are RevHard Mfg do alot of R&D. i have compared PWR to the Spearco intercoolers.... of course the PWR is tube and fin and the SPEARCO is bar and plate. what i noticed was the intercooler on the Spearco is flat.the PWR has the tube/fins sticking out of the intercooler..i dont have pics up yet but i will do so ASAP..what im trying too say is the charged air flows threw the spearco hits the walls and flow right thew.. as for thr PWR it would have to hit the walls bounce back up about 1/2 inch and go into the tube/fins.. which would cause more turblance and less velocity. So we got 2 of the same size intercoolers and had a GSR integra turbo charged. first the spearco at 14lbs of boos t the gauge read 13psi. then the PWR at the same pressure it read 11lbs.. now at lower psi i dont think it would make too much difference but when a volume of charged air is forced it would make a difference for sure..just my opinion... is PWR just hyped up ..more 8 and 9 sec hondas still use SPEARCO ... anyones thoughts..??


[Modified by camp1320.com, 7:50 PM 10/8/2002]

b18bturbo

i think the spearco work no denying it. Lisa,venom, myles,jojo kenny, all use spearco design. The only reason the barrel works better now is that it is eaiser mountable compared to square design spearco.

I never had issues with my spearco that i bought from myles and it still works great at 35pounds of boost. the only problem probably that i have about it is how big it is compared to the single 3 inch barrel from pwr. I mean i havent seen the PWR barrel up close in person just yet but i know it does work as well.

Midwestrider

Here are some pics of the PWR I/C





I have a few more saved which I can post later. (Pics were provided by Earl and Ninesecrx)

Dublocivic

"Here are some pics of the PWR I/C
I have a few more saved which I can post later. (Pics were provided by Earl and Ninesecrx)"
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That doesn’t look like a barrel to me, ya got a fmic there man..
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As you know the guys are RevHard Mfg do alot of R&D. i have compared PWR to the Spearco intercoolers.... of course the PWR is tube and fin and the SPEARCO is bar and plate. what i noticed was the intercooler on the Spearco is flat.the PWR has the tube/fins sticking out of the intercooler..i dont have pics up yet but i will do so ASAP..what im trying too say is the charged air flows threw the spearco hits the walls and flow right thew.. as for thr PWR it would have to hit the walls bounce back up about 1/2 inch and go into the tube/fins.. which would cause more turblance and less velocity. So we got 2 of the same size intercoolers and had a GSR integra turbo charged. first the spearco at 14lbs of boos t the gauge read 13psi. then the PWR at the same pressure it read 11lbs.. now at lower psi i dont think it would make too much difference but when a volume of charged air is forced it would make a difference for sure..just my opinion... is PWR just hyped up ..more 8 and 9 sec hondas still use SPEARCO ... anyones thoughts..??
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Well think about this... you have 2 different liquid to air intercoolers.. and your getting different boost readings right? well if one is doing a better job cooling then it will read less pressure because cool/cold air is of course much more dense... the compressor is still pushing the same amount of air but it reads less because the colder air takes up less space..

[Modified by Dublocivic, 5:00 PM 10/8/2002]


[Modified by Dublocivic, 5:01 PM 10/8/2002]

SiRkid

???????

Midwestrider

From reading the post camp1320.com is referring to fmic's and that b18bturbo is speaking of the air/water i/c's from PWR.

LshatchTurbo

Are these pics of the 18.5x6x3 intercoolers that were in the groupbuy several weeks ago? Thanks

Midwestrider

Yes they are lshatchturbo..

Full-Race Geoff

ummm the reason they stick out is for velocity stack purposes, they also do not stock out anywhere near 1/2" more like 1/8".

It is a commonly known fact that a tube and fin intercooler will work better. Bar and plate are easier to produce and make in custom sizes. This is not heresay, its common knowledge among formula 1, porsche fab guys and everyone in the heat exchanger business.

end of story.

if youd like to get into the technical aspects of it, lets go -- i have my heat transfer book right here

earl

Here's some PWR internal pix for you guys to look at




I'm no engineer (but I play one on TV). It seems that if there is no pressure drop on an air to air IC, the air would not be cooling as well.

Midwestrider

Damn... Each day i learn something new from this board..
Thx guys!

Quick 200k Mile Motor

That core looks very restrictive.
A radiator should not be used for cooling down high flow charged air.

carsaregood

FFgeoff! you know matt in san diego right? me too, small world. hehe. anyway, i'm taking a heat transfer class right now, and since you offered, lets hear what you have to say. maybe it'll spark some interest on my part and give me motivation to study, hah. btw i know next to nothing about turbos/intercoolers/heat exchangers...

Full-Race Geoff

who is matt in san diego?

i had heat transfer already, there are 4 chapters dedicated to fin heat exchangers in my book, and i need to finish some work tonite for another class, if you have any specific questions, i can answer them mathematically for you.

as for inspiration, the only inspiration i can give you is to solve this problem out for yourself If you teach yourself how an IC works youre pretty well off.

who is matt in san diego?

MADEINIRAQ

all i know is.. pressure drop would equal temp drop.

ninesecrx

One more tid bit that I really shouldnt let everyone know but I will...Spearco tested the pwr intercoolers and loved them so much that they wanted to buy out pwr and market the pwr intercoolers as their own. If you look at an old turbonetics catalogue, you will see that they were selling spearco intercoolers as well. Well they were offering 2 styles in there, their own bar and plates and they were offering their new tube and fins as well. Needless to say, it was really pwr intercoolers. They even went as far as having flow numbers and pictures taken of them. If anyones into trucks at all, theres a company that makes turbo kits for them called Banks. They use wr intercoolers and are a top of the line company and have real world testing on their stuff as well. Since im a main distributor for PWR, I have lots of feedback from people who run their intercoolers and raditors on street and race cars. Nothing but good things....And as far as the water to air, The Laskey Racing crx is comming back out soon with one and I will back it as well. Their are other pro racers switching to them as well and LOVE it.....CAMP1320...do you have intake air temps from your tests? That is a very important aspect when testing and without that, you do not even have a test. I dont think Spearcos are bad by any means, and I dont think there really is any hype around PWR products, but I feel strongly enough about them to run them in my race car.....Mike

Arturbo

Im all about a technical topic on heat transfer Geoff. I would also like to see the R&D that Rev-hard is doing with comparisson with the PWR and Spearco IC's. What do they use to test? I think this will be good and fun...

art

TurbothisLS

yeah, i wanna apply what i'm learning in thermo right now. i hate thermo and can't seem to find any interest in it...

i too am running the pwr fmic


[Modified by TurbothisLS, 5:45 AM 10/9/2002]

shadowdawn

Wow I didn't know I had such a "high quality" intercooler.... just looked at it as the "used intercooler that came with my used rev hard kit"

Nice to learn something new Of course mine isen't as shiny as the one posted in the pics here, but mabye someday I can change that :D :D

How much boost can these intercoolers support out of curiosity?

V-SPEC 1

What is the website for pwr or how can I get more info on their product?

blufke

how much do they run shipped? and how much were they in the gb?

carsaregood

matt's user name is type autox. i think i think. i could very well be wrong, and am thinking of the wrong guy, i only know him in person, not really from honda-tech...

earl

http://www.pwr-performance.com/index.htm

Overblown-Teg

Does anyone have internal pics of the other types of intercoolers? I am sort of confused about the difference between bar and plate and tube and fin.. Is the one posted from pwr tube and fin? I can see how that would flow very well but how does it compare cooling wise to say a Griffin with lots of little fins inside the tube?

I would also be interested in some pricing.. how about a 20x8 core... How thick are they? I can make my own tanks to fit then.

TurbothisLS

exactly....Pv=RT for ideal gases (air)
so a pressure drop would indicate a temperature drop.