JDMRice

Doing a little reaserch Ive gathered a bit of info about them, looks like something I might be intrested in doing rather then getting actual sleeves.
I just would like to know where I can pick them up?

Heres' stuff I found about them....on this site.
"press-in iron liners are pretty common to repair blocks with messed up bores.. it works on a closed deck motor pretty well"

"you bore out the stock sleeve, press in the new one"

JDMRice

anybody>?

PrecisionH23a

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDMRice &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
"you bore out the stock sleeve, press in the new one"</TD></TR></TABLE>

What do you think sleeves do? There's no way to go around 'sleeving'.... just sleeve it with products that you know work.

JDMRice

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PrecisionH23a &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

What do you think sleeves do? There's no way to go around 'sleeving'.... just sleeve it with products that you know work.</TD></TR></TABLE>
.
There are others way that work also, I dont need a block that can handle 600hp, Im not building a drag car, this is why Im looking into this, If I can find an answer Ill just use mahle's.

fastludeh22

iTrader: (1)

doing right is cheaper then doing it twice...trust me: https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=870704

that was at 450 whp, thats not too high, cause trust me, once u start boosting, there is no stopping

JDMRice

^ I understand what your saying, but If i had listend to most people on here, I wouldnr have a turbo h22, cause accroding to them h22's and boost dont mix.....

fastludeh22

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDMRice &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">^ I understand what your saying, but If i had listend to most people on here, I wouldnr have a turbo h22, cause accroding to them h22's and boost dont mix.....</TD></TR></TABLE>

i feel u on that, but im not talking about some crap i heard, or the recent honda-tech bandwagon, im telling you from personal experince. i mean how much do u think ur going to save, and how much could lose. for me, even if i thought i could get away with it on a certian setup, the chance would bother me soooo much i wouldn't be able to sleep at night...

earl

You won't get any more strength with your press in liners than your oem sleeve. The sleeves need to be made from ductile iron for more strength. Darton makes them for the closed deck but they cost as much as regular sleeving.

JDMRice

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by earl &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You won't get any more strength with your press in liners than your oem sleeve. The sleeves need to be made from ductile iron for more strength. Darton makes them for the closed deck but they cost as much as regular sleeving.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I see what your saying, but if u get the press in liners dont they then allow u to run FI pistons? I know thats a big no for oem sleeves.

NAEGH22

what material do those use in a proper sleeving job? i was under the impression that they used iron sleeves anyway????

93preludes

I am going to be running replacement iron liners on my closed deck h22 block. The sleeves will allow you to run aftermarket pistons but its like everyone said... the block will not be as strong as a darton sleeved block. I personally think that it will make a block stronger but thats just my opinion & this will be the first block I run with this setup.Can someone can give an explanation as to why an iron sleeve (not ductile) would not be stronger than factory aluminum bores?

They will allow you run aftermarket pistons without worrying about frm, this is a somewhat "cheap" solution for someone who wants to run a "stock block" h22 with aftermarket internals. mahle's would probably accomplish the same thing but like i mentioned i personally think an iron sleeve is stronger than a factory aluminum one.

It seems to me that the amount of air shoved into a sleeve is not what causes damage, it's detonation. So it might it be accurate to say that a sleeve like dartons would be able to withstand a greater degree of detonation if it were to occur than a stock aluminum block?

If that's the case then a traditionally (thick) iron sleeve would still be an improvement over the factory aluminum also, right? I would imagine it's hard to measure these things but that's how i justify it in my head ;-).


Modified by 93preludes at 1:21 PM 10/16/2006

b18sihatch

just sleeve it

PrecisionH23a

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by earl &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You won't get any more strength with your press in liners than your oem sleeve. The sleeves need to be made from ductile iron for more strength. Darton makes them for the closed deck but they cost as much as regular sleeving.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Bingo. You may save what... 200 300 bucks tops? Then when it blows up you'll end up spending another few grand to correct your errors, lol.

93preludes

settle down with the scare tactics... a thick iron sleeve would make the block stronger and would likely be the last thing to cause his motor to go.

my block is already sleeved with a set and we will see "when it blows up" if there's a problem with the sleeves... c'mon man, it's not like he's cheaping out. Half the people overbuy into thousands of dollars when realistically they dont need it.

he's obviously going to make his own decision but you all are getting a little out of hand with the "if you're not running this you're an idiot" stuff...

PrecisionH23a

Scare tactics?

lol.

He asked for info and I shared my point of view. I've seen to many guys half-*** set-ups only later to do it again on down the road. I've tuned plenty of stock blocks past 400whp... but if you are going into the engine do it right the first time and don't cut corners. That's my point.

You can take what I say with a grain of salt... I don't care what the guy does. Did you not see vinny's post on what happened to his 'press-in liner' style sleeve?

93preludes

my point is this is just a different approach he is trying to take, he's not cutting corners because he's not following the honda-tech cookbook.

i dont give a **** either and we're obviously on a public forum but just because it's not on your checklist of how to build a motor it doesnt make it a mistake.

He's just thinking about taking a different route... seriously, if you read it back it sounds like you're saying "h22's arent good for boost". hah.

PrecisionH23a

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93preludes &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">my point is this is just a different approach he is trying to take, he's not cutting corners because he's not following the honda-tech cookbook.

i dont give a **** either and we're obviously on a public forum but just because it's not on your checklist of how to build a motor it doesnt make it a mistake.

He's just thinking about taking a different route... seriously, if you read it back it sounds like you're saying "h22's arent good for boost". hah.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Different route? It's not different, vinny tried it 2 years ago and it didn't last very long.

As far as your little honda-techcookbook goes... I follow my own cookbook that I put together during college when I was in Mechanical Engineering. I know what works not only due to hands on experience but through years of education unlike people on here who read things and know everything.

And me say H22's aren't good for boost? Give me a ******* break. Come look at our shop... h22's are what we specialize in building. I've worked with the H series engines since late '99 and have done probably 30 set-ups since then. I've built several 500+ set-ups and right now I'm working on a 700whp H22 set-up if that matters to you at all.

I don't know why you are taking what I say so personal... I'm giving 7 years of experience and help to this kid. He can take it if he wants or he can go another route.

93preludes

i didnt mean to make it sound like i'm taking it personally and specifically about what you said because i'm not.

The argument you are making sounds similar to the h22 boost argument, not that specifically you were saying that h22's arent good for boost. What i mean by that is that the message everyone is putting out is somewhat over generalized... just because it didnt work for vinny it doesnt mean it wont work for him...

i am not taking a stab at your experience or education, sorry if it sounded like i was taking aim at you... this is just generally speaking.

edit: sorry, this is hard to put into text but the iron liners would make the block stronger & are cheaper although not by all that much.


Modified by 93preludes at 2:59 PM 10/16/2006

PrecisionH23a

I did not mean to sound like H22's are bad for boost... they are GREAT engines for boost.

My point here is why spend money on an OEM replacement liner when for a few hundred more bucks you can have the real-deal product and never have to have a doubt in your mind about it failing?

Anyways... let the guy make his own decisions.

JDMRice

thanks for posting, ^ do u know where i can get a set of those liners then? Id rather try that, Im not going for crazy power.

b18sihatch

what kinda power are you trying to go for?

JDMRice

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b18sihatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what kinda power are you trying to go for? </TD></TR></TABLE>
Right now im at 300whp stock bottom so if i can get a bit more like 375, Id be happy,, My car isnt a drag car by all means, I have full interior etc..


Modified by JDMRice at 2:50 PM 10/16/2006

fastludeh22

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDMRice &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Right now im at 300whp stock bottom so if i can get a bit more like 375, Id be happy, it, My car isnt a drag car by all means, I have full interior etc.. </TD></TR></TABLE>

sounds like you made up ur mind before you even asked. not tring to sound like an ***, cause i do the same thing sometimes. if you push 375 only, sure you'll prob be ok, but i promise you after 375 you'll want more. it only took me 2 weeks to get used to my 482 im running right now, and i already got my new turbo and stuff, going back to the dyno looking for 6-700. im telling you boost is addictive. when u have that block in there, knowing your pistons and rods are good for over 500 your going to want to turn up the boost. which leads to 1 of 2 things. you kick yourself in the *** cause u cant turn it up or you do it anyway, and most likely blow it, then kick yourself in the ***...

to 93preludes, press in are not any stronger then factory ones. they are just that, oem replacements. where they do help, is in a h block where you cant run forged pistons because of the frm. now u can run good pistons, but still oem style sleeve. im not 100% sure on numbers, but i think the b-series guys for the most part say 400whp in stock sleeves forged internals. im here to tell u they didnt hold 452 in my case and trust me it was a good consertive tune..

to break it down in money terms. press ins are 300 if ur lucky. another 2-300 in machine work. so ur saving 400 dollars. but risking a 1200 piston and rod combo. not to metion bearing cost, gaskets, possible head damage...and my biggest one TIME

in jdmrice's situation, you want to save money cause u say u dont want to run super big numbers. insted of using press in liners for the h, why not run a f block. they come factory with iron sleeves. depending on what year your h22 is, and what stroke u want to go with, will determine the many options you have down that road.

oh and btw-i have full interior and drive my car on the street also

speedworks

if done correctly it will work and work well. i have done 2 or 3 this way with good success. i made around 450 horsepower for about 3 years this way. it is definately not the best way. we actually used replacement liners for a 64 dodge dart 6 cylinder and decked the height off of them.

NAEGH22

what material do those use in a proper sleeving job? i was under the impression that they used iron sleeves anyway????