supabang

engine: b18a1>>>>>>TURBO
I been reading a lot of the old post of head gasket replacements and stuff so i finally gave it a try. i printed out all the instructions (torque specs, removal/tighten order) I started yesterday and got everything off just fine. Gasket looked to be decent. took the head to the machine shop had it straight edge and resurfaced. Got OEM Head Gasket from Acura. put everything back today and double checked all clips and hoses i removed then cranked her up.. turns over but doesn't start. If i pump the gas pedal the car starts but runs really bad. Let of the gas and car shuts off.

I'm positive the gasket is the right side up. The serial number shows on left side under the distributor.
I torqued the head down with a click type torque wrench. First at 23ftlb then final at 63ftlb. Hopefully that is correct. I'm not sure of what the torque for the camshaft cover so i just put it to 20ftlb.

vacuum hoses> all seems to be correctly plug
checked for leaks> FUEL=none <>WATER=none <>OIL=none
clips for sensors> all connected and tight.
Timing> Cams and crank match up at TDC

I'm also pretty sure i did not mix up the intake camchaft/gear with the exhaust camshaft/gear.ONE THING: My rocker arms fell out of place but i just put them back. Thing is i put them back kind of RANDOM. Can that be the problem? I matched them up and they all seem identical and i couldn't find any information on them so i figure it didn't matter. Or maybe that's where i made the mistake? OR AM I MISSING SOMETHING I NEED TO DOUBLE CHECK?

HELP

Muckman

iTrader: (2)

check the order of your spark plug wires on the distributor. they should be:
3,4
1,2
looking at the distributor.

supabang

thanks for the input. I went outside to double check. the ignition cables are correct order. I also have after market cables with numbering on them and cable holders that keep them in the right order. anyone else.... Theres got to be more people who have done a head gasket job them selves and had problems.

Pullig

you didnt happen to mix up the tb and map sensor plugs did you? the tb wire should have a red wire in the mix and did u make sure to ground it at the coolant temp housing ?

Evilparadize

I know you already checked your firing order, because you double checked it. But it doesn’t hurt to check it one more time. Take your time and run one cable at a time. Make sure all your injector clips are properly seated and your distributor has a snug connection.

Don’t forget to check your valve lash. Very important, specially if the head was taken apart for inspection and hot tanked. I’m not sure what the correct lash should be on your Acura, but without the proper lash on both intake and exhaust cams, the car will turn but may not start. Check the specs on a Haynes Manual for your specific car. Good luck.

supabang

its late night but i'm determine so i went out and as you asked. tripled check my ignition system and firing order. They are correct. plugs are new also just in case someone wants to ask that.

As for the valve lash. I have not done so. In all the threads i have been reading up on doing head gaskets, there has been no mention of adjusting it. I remember after putting on the camshaft, only 3-4 of the rocker arms had play. The rest were stiff solid. IS THAT A POSSIBLE PROBLEM? I looked it up and found the specs that they should be adjusted to.

Here Are The Valve Clearance Specs just in case anyone would like to know.

B18A
INTAKE: 0.006" - 0.007" (0.15mm - 0.19mm)
EXHAUST: 0.007" - 0.008" (0.17mm - 0.21mm)

B18B
INTAKE: 0.003" - 0.005" (0.08mm - 0.12mm)
EXHAUST: 0.006" - 0.008" (0.16mm - 0.20mm)

B18C
INTAKE: 0.006" - 0.007" (0.15mm - 0.19mm)
EXHAUST: 0.007" - 0.008" (0.17mm - 0.21mm)

I do not have a Helms guide so i am unsure on what i should do. From my understanding, I need to:
set piston each piston to TDC and adjust lash for that piston
Lock the camshaft in place
use a 12mm box-end wrench and flathead screwdriver.
Also have a Feeler gauge to make sure the lash is correct.

Can anyone correct me or shine in on this? I want to do this first thing in the morning (assuming i can find a feeler gauge at the local auto parts)

ALSO I WOULD LIKE TO ASK 1 MORE TIME> Do the rocker arms go in a specific order or can they just go random?


Modified by supabang at 11:38 PM 9/11/2007

tek_civic

Its normal for some of your rocker arms to be really stiff as they are either partially on intake or exhaust stroke, which means the spring is stiff.

Personally i would double check the timing, it kinda sounds like its off a tooth. The timing can be lined up PERFECT but then when you retension things and actually crank the engine it may turn out to be a tooth off, so check that too.

Also check your wires again... Not the order though, check to make sure that all the wires are making solid connection on the plugs themselves. I have had 3 sets of wires destroyed(before i started fixing them) just because the little clip that goes on the the spark plug came off and stuck to the plug. This is common with somewhat crappy plugs, its also hard to see until you take your wires out again.

Well thats my 2 ideas.

jesseman

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tek_civic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Its normal for some of your rocker arms to be really stiff as they are either partially on intake or exhaust stroke, which means the spring is stiff.

Personally i would double check the timing, it kinda sounds like its off a tooth. The timing can be lined up PERFECT but then when you retension things and actually crank the engine it may turn out to be a tooth off, so check that too.

Also check your wires again... Not the order though, check to make sure that all the wires are making solid connection on the plugs themselves. I have had 3 sets of wires destroyed(before i started fixing them) just because the little clip that goes on the the spark plug came off and stuck to the plug. This is common with somewhat crappy plugs, its also hard to see until you take your wires out again.

Well thats my 2 ideas.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I agree with this guy, I don't know much about imports, but you need air, spark, and fuel. Seems like you have the air and the fuel covered enough to at least get the engine started and running. As many engines I have started up for the first time it will run on the first few cranks, but may need some adjustment. Again, don't know much about imports but, are your cams in the right position. Did you have the timing marks on the cams lined up with the locks in place, I don't know much but sounds like a timing problem to me. I am used to timing chains, offset cam bushings and lifters being tightened in the wrong order.

jesseman

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tek_civic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Its normal for some of your rocker arms to be really stiff as they are either partially on intake or exhaust stroke, which means the spring is stiff.

Personally i would double check the timing, it kinda sounds like its off a tooth. The timing can be lined up PERFECT but then when you retension things and actually crank the engine it may turn out to be a tooth off, so check that too.

Also check your wires again... Not the order though, check to make sure that all the wires are making solid connection on the plugs themselves. I have had 3 sets of wires destroyed(before i started fixing them) just because the little clip that goes on the the spark plug came off and stuck to the plug. This is common with somewhat crappy plugs, its also hard to see until you take your wires out again.

Well thats my 2 ideas.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I agree with this guy, I don't know much about imports, but you need air, spark, and fuel. Seems like you have the air and the fuel covered enough to at least get the engine started and running. As many engines I have started up for the first time it will run on the first few cranks, but may need some adjustment. Again, don't know much about imports but, are your cams in the right position. Did you have the timing marks on the cams lined up with the locks in place, I don't know much but sounds like a timing problem to me. I am used to timing chains, offset cam bushings and lifters being tightened in the wrong order.

Dunc

First:
As said above, check to make sure again that when the TDC marks on the pulleys line up that the TDC mark on the crank is lining up with the line on the plastic cover.

Second:
Did you recheck the sensor plugs again? I've made this mistake before since some have the exact same plug on them.

Third:
How did your rocker arms fall out?

0morgan@synapse motorsport

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dunc &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">[B]
Third:
How did your rocker arms fall out?</TD></TR></TABLE>

supabang

I don't think they are called the "rocker arms" but its the small little piece that goes between the camshaft and the valve springs. has a little round ball on one side and a flat angled surface on the other side. They fell out because when the camshaft is off they become lose. I noticed that they have small markings on 1 side of them, but couldn't figure out which way or where they go. so i just put them back on in random selection. Still do not know if they have a specific order. Well its morning now and i thank you all for your input. I'll go outside and check everything you guys stated again for the 5th time. Keep them coming and i will post after each session i have. wish me luck.

boostedb20z

iTrader: (1)

take your cap off your dizzy and but the motor on tdc and see if the rotor points to the number one plug

SIXTY-1HATCH

DING DING DING!!!
If your timing is dead on, ill be willing to bet my money on your valve adjust. Ls ones are a bitch b/c they just pop out like that. unless you put the same one back in place that it came out of, your valve adjust is off. re-do your valve adjust and try again

wade

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SIXTY-1HATCH &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">DING DING DING!!!
If your timing is dead on, ill be willing to bet my money on your valve adjust. Ls ones are a bitch b/c they just pop out like that. unless you put the same one back in place that it came out of, your valve adjust is off. re-do your valve adjust and try again </TD></TR></TABLE>

agreed.

supabang

OK. so i tore the whole head apart again. i re torqued the head a few pounds more then the specified amount just because they were the stock head bolts and i reused them. not to mention they when i removed them, they were more then 150ft tight. then i reinstalled the camshaft/gear then re tighten their bolts. Still not sure what the torque specs on the valve guides are so they are about 18-20ftlb tight now. Then i went in and did the valve lash adjustment. I did it one whole sequence. then turn the motor over by hand 5 times then re adjusted them once more. Put everything back, double check all plugs, hoses, ect. and put back the ECU fuse. Crank her, and she started!!! Not sure what it was but i'm leaning towards the valve adjustment also. I got the car to idle about 750-800rpm (chrome sucks at idle) got my timing gun, set the timing to the middle notch and revved up, hit my 2-step and then check timing and its still on. Everything looks fine. as the car was running, i did a sweep for leaks and everything is clean so far. Don't seem to get any air in my coolant system like before. (reason i did the head gasket replacement)

1 PROBLEM STILL REMAINS... CHECK ENGINE LIGHT IS ON. I have a OBD2 scanner but nothing for my P06 OBD1 ECU.. what do i do?




Modified by supabang at 2:42 PM 9/12/2007

wade

iTrader: (1)

crome sucks *** to idle smoothly. make sure to jack the front end of the car up and let it idle with heater on. Itll bleed out air bubbles. do it for a long time, like 20-30 mins. They seem to never end. its worth it, trust me. keep adding coolant as it goes down when it burbs out air.


cant help ya with the CEL. check all sensors are correctly mated up and plugged in with no breaks in the wires or loose wires.

wade

iTrader: (1)

wait,to check the CEL, find that little 2 wire plug on the pass side kick panel. put a wire or paper clip and jump the plug. The check engine light on the dash SHOULD flash.

long flash is in multiples of 10. short flash is multiple of 1.

supabang

So i took the car out for a test drive and it still over heated!!! I got a new radiator cap and not running a thermostat. Fan turns on and such. How can i test to see if it is my radiator or Water pump? Those are the only things i have not changed in this process. I have an aluminum racing radiator i got the same time i did my turbo install. At this very moment I am doing as WADE suggested, i have the front of the car jacked up and letting it run and filling the radiator as needed.

wade

iTrader: (1)

i cant stress enough to leave it idle on jacks with heater on for least 30 mins. Hell do it for 40 and 30 more tomorrow.

the fan is drawing in air from OUTSIDE moving it INSIDE correct?

Get a thermostat tho man.. seriously.

water pumps still work even if they are old and begin to seep water. they never just stop moving the water. Cant say i ever seen the impeller break away from the t-belt shaft.

supabang

Yes, my fan is wired to a switch inside the cabin and it is set on a puller type. I'll throw a thermostat in tomorrow then bleed the system some more. I understand what you are saying about the water pump still pumping even tho it's old. The car only seems to over heat at highway speeds (excess of 55mph) on street it just fine. i even did a few medium pulls and temps consistent. I've bleed the air system for the last hour and after a short drive, i the radiator hose gets a little stiff. I open the little bleeder bolt on the head attached to the upper radiator hose inlet and massive air pressure shoots out. Then after a minute or so i carefully open the radiator cap and more air burst out.
On a side note, looking into my radiator while the car is on, i can't really tell if the water is circulating. Should it be easy to spot? On my friends LS1, you can clearly tell the water was moving. I'm also almost sure my aluminum radiator is warped. Its an Aluminum half sized generic radiator. Top core is 1.25" thick. (ebay type if you will)

Reason i think its warped:
1- I removed it while doing the head so while i had it in my hands, i lifted it up towards the sun and tried to see through it. 1 side was clearly more spaced out then the other. The side closes to my down pipe had fins that looked to be a lot closer to each other. The opposite side was fine. I then got the water hoes and blasted through the radiator fins. As expected, one side allowed water to pass at a higher rate then the other.

2- My hood seems to sit right on top and it contact the top of the radiator. I don't think that helped at all when the car over heated.

What do you think? why am i only heating up on the highway?

wade

iTrader: (1)

you should be about to see it circulate with the cap off.

supabang

When i feel my lower radiator hose while the car is running, it kind of feels empty. After i drive it a bit it becomes tight. Mainly because of the air i think. Is there any other way for air to be sucked up into the coolant system other then the head gasket? I always have water in my over flow tank so no air from there.

superx34

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU for this post.....

I had just replaced the thermosat & radiator on my daughter' 96 civic ex race car...

http://34.superxcars.com/2007_06_01_archive.shtml her PINK PANTHER car is on this link

And the car would not start... I found this post, and saw that the ground wire had to be connected to the map sensor ... opps ... I connected it ... it started right up...

thank you

Paul

wade

iTrader: (1)

thats what we are here for.