WOW.... ALREADY!!!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what bore CP pistons?</TD></TR></TABLE>

84mm 10:1 compression

Posted before by Josh Green!!

 

lol +1 for cp pistons

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by josh green &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">but I am pretty sure it was the tune. The tuner hasnt really tuned big power cars before .</TD></TR></TABLE>

No offense but i think you hit the nail.Im not saying scotty cant tune,but your guys car is the only high horsepower car he has really tuned, so he probly added or took to much timing causing it to detnoate and blow!

This aint no bash shopping im just stating the obvious, altough it can be the gas also, thats how trinhs blew his 4 weeks ago, we got tuned on C16 and at the track all they had was 112 we used that and he blew!!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18c1turboedEK &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">No offense but i think you hit the nail.Im not saying scotty cant tune,but your guys car is the only high horsepower car he has really tuned, so he probly added or took to much timing causing it to detnoate and blow!

This aint no bash shopping im just stating the obvious, altough it can be the gas also, thats how trinhs blew his 4 weeks ago, we got tuned on C16 and at the track all they had was 112 we used that and he blew!! </TD></TR></TABLE>

while i agree that our tuner hasnt had as much experience with HIGH HP cars, it definetly wasnt from TOO MUCH ignition. thats for sure. i dont think it was the TUNING either.

Im not pointing fingers, im just asking general questions.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Suprdave &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">To melt a motor that bad in a pass, it has to be something more drastic than alittle too much timing.

Has to be Injector\Fuel Pump Related...Or possibly Overheating.

Definately Fuel related tho.</TD></TR></TABLE>

every pass all day was smooth sailing, just dialing in the boost controller. giving it just as much hell as all the other passes. this was all of the sudden.

the temp needle didnt budge all day long not one bit. I check that everytime i cross the line.

 

it was eighter gas or timing. theres no way to really tell now!!

Just rebuild and hope for the best!!

 

I had the A1000 fuel pump on my gt35 b16 on an engine dyno.. to test the fuel pump I cranked upp the fuel pressure to about 75psi and messured the amount per minit that came through the return line. The result was about 3600cc per minit @ 75psi. The pump was conected to a 100 amp battery with thick electical cables. I would gess the voltage to be 12-12,5 volts.. That means the pump can´t support fuel to have 4 1000cc injectors running 100% duty cykel @ 75psi fuel pressure. That is about the pressure the pump needs to work with when you have 30psi of bosst pressure.

I was realy dissapointed in the pumps performance and it sounds terrible and loud..

I guess the pump coulden´t suport the needs.. If you can figure out the duty cykel @max load and rpm it can be calclated with boost pressure, base fuelpressure if it is to blame.

I´m looking at the SX Performance pumps.. Hope those aint that noisy..

 

maybe boost spike from trying to dial in the boost controller?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by The sweed &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I had the A1000 fuel pump on my gt35 b16 on an engine dyno.. to test the fuel pump I cranked upp the fuel pressure to about 75psi and messured the amount per minit that came through the return line. The result was about 3600cc per minit @ 75psi. The pump was conected to a 100 amp battery with thick electical cables. I would gess the voltage to be 12-12,5 volts.. That means the pump can´t support fuel to have 4 1000cc injectors running 100% duty cykel @ 75psi fuel pressure. That is about the pressure the pump needs to work with when you have 30psi of bosst pressure.

I was realy dissapointed in the pumps performance and it sounds terrible and loud..

I´m looking at the SX Performance pumps.. Hope those aint that noisy..

</TD></TR></TABLE>

I run an A1000 at over 800whp and over 75psi fuel pressure...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I run an A1000 at over 800whp and over 75psi fuel pressure...</TD></TR></TABLE>

You dont count tough!! Becasue you GOT YOU SOME!!

 

also keep in mind that if the piston was hurt even a small ammount at any other time its a ticking time bomb.

pics damn it

 

im out with the flu otherwise i would get pics.

We are just looking for some contructive criticism before the motor gets rebuilt again. Thanks for everyones input. pics up shortly

 

that timing is fine for the car, although was the car's ecu ever sync'd to the distributor?

then again, something to happen this drastic, sounds like fuel problems. Detonation takes a while to kill a piston, not car is running fine for multiple dyno pulls, multiple pases and then one pass, it melts down.

was the car low on fuel? aka under 1/4 tank? how is the fuel pump setup? could have been the forward momentium of the car, pushing the gas to the back of the tank and maybe there wasn't enough fuel, so fuel pressure varied due to lack of fuel. That decrease in fuel pressure caused a big lean condition and heat just jumped up and cooked.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by seen4ever &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">that timing is fine for the car, although was the car's ecu ever sync'd to the distributor?

then again, something to happen this drastic, sounds like fuel problems. Detonation takes a while to kill a piston, not car is running fine for multiple dyno pulls, multiple pases and then one pass, it melts down.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Wait, who said the dist. was never sync'd? Is that true?

oops, re-read that. You were asking if it was sync'd. I hope it was. lol

 

yes the distributor wsa synched up correctly, everything was "normal" for a car making this much power.

except for the melted pistons.

i have over 100 dyno pulls wiht this car an engine making 650-690whp at 25-30psi . he takes it to the track, runs a couple of times, then on 1 pass at high boost it melts down.

curious as to why, i have NOT seen the motor yet, as i have been out wiht the flu.

 

So first pass at high boost this happens right? I'm going to say it was tuning. Believe it or not, a 2.0L engine at 650+whp will blow up if things are not right. And it can happen in 1 pass. Is there a datalog of that pass, cause that will tell a lot...

 

even though MULTIPLE runs were made at that boost level on a dynojet with no problems, no signs of detonation?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So first pass at high boost this happens right? I'm going to say it was tuning. Believe it or not, a 2.0L engine at 650+whp will blow up if things are not right. And it can happen in 1 pass. Is there a datalog of that pass, cause that will tell a lot...</TD></TR></TABLE>

he uses Chrome Pro , an hes not the tuner, so no datalogs , sorry.

Thats my next question, who COMPETIVELY uses CHROME on their race car? anyone?

i thought most people were running AEM or at the minimum S300

 

holly cow, i thought he was using a dataloggable ecu!!! scary **** not to datalog in a 600-700whp setup....

From my experience I've seen were the headgasket would give and then in a heartbeat later the motor collapses...and even then it may have not been the hg...detonation then gh...or gh and then blown motor...MANY MANY scenarios!!! I've seen many catastrophies and without datalogging...it may happen again!!!

If timing was synced properly and topend timing was set to 17-18degree... Then definitely FUEL starvation of some sort. Next time make sure he can datalog and maybe get an electronic Fuel Pressure Gauge inside the cockpit. Reason for datalog is because he could've experienced a BOOST spike, Boost increase and leaned out... this happens alot at the track since ambient track air/temp differs from when you are dynoing in the shop..in addition load of the dyno differs from load at the track(weight of car)...you can sometimes experience different boost pressure or rate/gain of boost due to amount of load...also take into account when racing/driving in the real world and not on the dyno... how hard the motor/tranny moves in the enginebay...anything could've happened...vaccum hose, WG screwing up, etc etc...!!!

DATALOG is key!!!

 

there was no boost spike thanks to the world electronics controller, i just happened to record the data thru the whole run, the boost never went over 27 psi the engine was tuned to 30 psi multiple times.

fuel is supplied by a sumped tank into -8 lines, a1000, 1600 precisions, aem rail, aem big regulator, -6 return into factory feed line. I doubt it was the fuel pump.

gas was a hair under 1/2 tank, i had topped it off a little earlier.

edit for the post above, chrome pro IS DATA LOGGABLE AND I COULD DO THAT. I just wasnt doing it at the time.

 

JDOGG - "lol +1 for cp pistons "

+1 in what way, them self destructing, or do they just plain out suck because i never had a single issue with JE for a long time.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SPOOLINmatt &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">JDOGG - "lol +1 for cp pistons "

+1 in what way, them self destructing, or do they just plain out suck because i never had a single issue with JE for a long time. </TD></TR></TABLE>

haha, either way

 

If you post pics I'm sure most know where exactly that piston started to melt and caused the ultimate failure...

I'm leaning towards the 1600cc injectors doing something...hell, from what I remember you arent running any kind of injector driver box right? My guess is that the drivers in the ECU were SCREAMING hot and either began to overheat and caused the injectors to ultimately supply too little fuel or failed completely. Obviously just a guess, but how many people are actually running 1600cc injectors without a driver box on a stock Honda ECU...not many if any.

Ultimately everything is a guess though, especially without any pics...without exact datalogs of both a good clean 27 psi pass on the dyno or track right next to the failure run datalogs, you can't know what the ECU was seeing/doing really...

Crome has its limits...I dont think that its 600 hp though. I have an H22 @ 15 psi that I am guessing from the butt dyno is in the High 400's that will be upped to the 25 psi level next spring. Most likely it will be run on Crome, Neptune and S300...just to see

 

agreed that he needs to step up to something better in the way of engine managment. IE S300 or AEM.

He ran a chipped ecu with a resistor box (from an EF) an 1600cc injectors. ALso was running air to water Intercooler