madtownhonda

I am considering a JRSC as an option on my b16a2. This is the setup I am thinking about. Tell me if this sounds about right.

Si/ITR blower
Hondata S200B
Hondata manifold gasket
RC 440cc injectors
Walbro 255lph in-tank pump
B&M FPR w/ Gauge
Kamikazee header 2.5" collector
2.5" cat/exhaust
3" short ram intake

After some dyno time and tuning I am looking for about 190whp @ 6psi. If I were to upgrade to ~8.5psi, would I see 210whp?

This setup would be in my 96 EX w/ b16a2. Comments/suggestions welcome.

Technician

Well
jackson racing super charger
this is a big argument
a good place to start is that a supercharger works off of the crankshaft
which will increase parasidic drag on you're resiprocating assembly
what this means is that you're first pound of boost is wasted
Compensating for the drag, and at high rpm you are still losing power
to the drag, it's not much, so just take off the power steering just kidding
also using a supercharger is limiting there are only pulleys to change out
and thats just not fun. there is no lag but upgrade is limited
with this system you have full power almost right off the line
but the only power that you will get to use is what traction will permit
also going full out off the line is going to put more wear and tear on
you're drive train, snaps you're neck=snaps you're drive train

now turbo, ah ah ah ar
unlimited upgradeability, turbochargers are run off of waste energy
exhaust gas and heat that would other wise be cast into the atmosphere
the money is around the same, if you ask me due to superchagers being so limited to upgrade, and the JRSC being a wipple charger a design. it's way overpriced
it makes power, but from a design that was made way back in the day for detroit diesel two stroke engines or some crap, on the other hand the turbochargers design and technology has advanced 10 fold in the same amount of time. now ball bearing turbochargers offer insane spool up, full boost 2500 rpm, with lower maintance and long life, not that you have to buy the best right off you can get a standard t03/04 hybrid, new or used and later on get a ball bearing center section
it's the same with the rest of the system you can buy the basic parts or a base kit
and add things that you like in, like jet hot ceramic coated equal length exhaust manifolds, shinny oh nice, start with a OEM Intercooler on a base kit like a DSM starion/conquest they are front mount and dirt cheap, later get a bigger better one built from turbonetics or buy the one for the kit. this is just a small amount of what can be done to a turbo system. it is endless... and yet the dirt cheap turbo set up from the junk yard still makes the power of the JRSC for half the money

the wipple charger sucks, if you really want a supercharger go for the vortec
it's Centrifugal, which is how the SC technology has advanced making it more like a turbocharger only shaft driven, and it looks cool under the hood making it worth the money, also it's easier to get to.

Really it comes down to what you want to do with the car
and what you want to get for you're money
do you want to see a change in the looks of you're car
imagine a big front mount intercooler behind the grill
or do you want to see sneaky pete 8.5 psi and you can hardly tell
looking under the hood, oh thats just my thermo friendly fuel compensator
i bought this car in california it's all that emissions crap they have out there
lets race.... BBOOOOOAAAHHHHHHH BOG, whoops guess i need to put that belt back on, get the wrenches out. or a fatal scenario the bypass fails at idle or during a shift, or driving down the road, and the engine spikes lean and melts internals. it's probably not as bad as i make it seem
but it's a big argument, do a lot of reading and pick a side

a hondata and 440's for 6 psi or 8.5 psi, is way more than overkill, if you buy this you should shoot for 21psi or more, which is pretty much impossible from a wipple, I've heard storys that the walbro pump is not very good, but it should be fine for 6-9 psi, at 9 psi you're risking you're ring lands with 10.2:1 compression and idealy the fuel pressure regulator that you want would be a fuel pressure regulator that is boost controled the b&m is good for a static no load setting and a wide open setting, so you'll be wasting fuel at idle.
you're stock air box will make more power than a short ram, a cold air would go well with any FI setup, or even making you're stock intake less restrictive by removeing the white resinator box behind the bumper and having the black tube
still getting cold air down there behind the bumper or in the fender.
and if you're going to get a blower don't dyno it, buy the fuel upgrade from the blower company and put it on, they have already put it on the dyno, and there should be tunning info in the kit like what spark plugs to use or maintanace
I would rethink this whole set up
don't you want to go with turbo by now
after reading all this crap
later

RyanAutry

This was my setup.

b16a2
JRSC 10psi
AEM CAI
Kami 2.5"
Test Pipe 2.5"
Cat-back 2.5"
Hondata
440's

220whp / 153wtq.

madtownhonda

Nice numbers...I'm thining at 8.5psi you would have seen at least 205whp.

I'm going to buy the Hondata and fuel stuff first and then see which kind of boost I want. My other consideration is an intercooled 18g greddy kit @ 8psi. I'm sure the 255 pump and 440s will be sufficient for at least 300whp with the hondata.

BudaKai

So umm, why do you think the Whipple charger sucks? Please no lame answers because it weighs a lot or there's no kits for it "yet".

fredtoast

Looks like a good setup. I agree that the Hondata may be overkill, but if you have the $$$ then go for it.

I love the JRSC on my ITR. Lots of power. Very simple and dependable.

However, if you ever plan on going over 10 psi think turbo.

Holden

When someone RECOMMENDS a vortech supercharger for a Honda, you'd be wise to not take advice from that person.

VTC_CiViC

Why? just last weekend at the Winter-nationals at Moroso, there was a B16 powered 6G EX with a Vortech and bolt-ons running 13.4's on small slicks. Not too shabby IMO.

Oh there was also a JRSC's white 6G coupe with a B16 running too a few months afo, 14.3-14.4 all weekend at 6psi, also on slicks.

Holden

Vortech SC's combine the worst aspects of supercharging (parasitic drag) with the worst aspects of turbo's (lag, uneven power delivery).

They make great peak HP (which looks good in the ads) but area under the power curve is not as much as a turbo or JRSC will have at the same boost level.

Plus, all of the first person accounts of driving Honda's with vortech sc's I've seen have the same complaints. Namely, crappy low end followed by such a quick rush of power near redline that shifting before you hit the rev limiter becomes a new skill you have to master to drive one of these.

When you compare similar cars with similar engines, one with a Vortech and the other with a turbo or JRSC, the Vortech car always loses based on 1/4 mile times even though they have peak HP 20-30 higher than the other car.

This forum is pretty biased towards turbos, but most peeps (like 99.99%), if forced to recommend a supercharger for a Honda will go with the JRSC.

VTC_CiViC

Makes me wonder what this 13 second guy was boosting at if he was laying down such quicker times...?

Do you know what the Vortech's come regulated at?

Holden

I think Vortech SC's start at 8psi, but I'm not sure.

I always ask how stripped people's cars are too. I got a vivid lesson in this at a HPDE last month. I was following an ITR and could barely pull on him in the straights. I took a walk over to where he was parked in grid later and... you guessed it, he had basically a driver's seat and a dashboard and controls. Everything else was bare yellow metal. (My car's not stripped at all.)


[Modified by Holden, 4:20 PM 12/23/2002]

RyanAutry

I'm sure you will make what I made @ 8.5psi with lower intake temp.

I was up in the 240º range.

RyanAutry

[QUOTE]Looks like a good setup. I agree that the Hondata may be overkill, but if you have the $$$ then go for it.
/QUOTE]

wtf?

Hondata an overkill? I'd call it a bare minimum.

It's only $450. is that really breaking the bank.

fredtoast

I want the Hondata, but it would cost me several hundred dollars (including new ECU and wire harness) to install plus another $400.00 to $500.00 to tune on a dyno. That is too much money for me.

However I spent over $500.00 for the Jackson Racing MAP controller and boost timing controller. If I was starting from scratch like this guy the additional investment would not be that great. Everyone says the hondata system is really nice, but I am very pleased with the way my car runs. So like I said before, "if you have the $$$ then go for it."