_gurusan_

Ok...i'm just wondering why there are plenty of people comfortably daily driving around 300 whp b18b's....making 250+wtq.....and why there aren't an equal or greater amount driving around with 300+whp b16's....

The b16 has a slightly greater C/R of course...but that doesn't mean anything....just that there is less margin of error when tuning.

I mean, the b16 internals are noticeably stronger than the LS. Just look at the rod thickness and rod bolt size.

Left--->Right
--------------
ZC, LS, B16


I am finishing up a b16 turbo project....and I'm going to be plenty happy with 240+whp....but I'm just wondering why people are scared to turn it up to 300+whp on the track?

Is it just the rings that are holding it back?

adseguy

There are plenty of b16's with 300+ HP. It's all in your head

_gurusan_

Is it? I always hear people saying that 300 whp is pushing it on a stock b16.......and then I hear people saying that 300whp is no trouble on an LS.

adseguy

if anything it's better to do it on a B16 because it requires less torque and is a little bit stronger as you can see rod wise

Blackack26

Typically its rpm's that put the most stress on rods, as you can see in the pic above... even though the ls has a longer stroke and more torque compared to the b16, the rod is physically smaller. Someone correct me if i'm wrong here, but are the rods really the first limiting factor in honda motors? (rpm put aside, were talking about horsepower). Basically, I wouldn't worry about the rods giving out first in a stock honda block.




Modified by Blackack26 at 6:09 PM 11/14/2005

adseguy

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Blackack26 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Someone correct me if i'm wrong here, but are the rods the first limiting factor in honda motors? (rpm put aside, were talking about horsepower).

</TD></TR></TABLE>

No way, rods can hold up to a lot of power. The ringlands are the weakest part by far. As long as your arn't over revving Heat and Cylinder pressures will break ringlands first

m R g S r

yea people bust ringlands all the time because of power, or boost spikes or w.e.

rods rarely crack and go through the block...unless you suck in some water (doH!!)

tokesGTR

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Blackack26 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">(rpm put aside, were talking about horsepower)</TD></TR></TABLE>

The loads placed on the rods by combustion is much smaller than the loads placed on the rods by RPM's. RPM = Ruins Peoples Motors. I think the reason you don't see as many 300+ WHP B16's is because the LS is a more desireable platform for it's torque and cheaper price, so not as many people are running turbo B16's period.

_gurusan_

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Blackack26 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Typically its rpm's that put the most stress on rods, as you can see in the pic above... even though the ls has a bigger bore, longer stroke and more torque compared to the b16, the rod is physically smaller. Someone correct me if i'm wrong here, but are the rods the first limiting factor in honda motors? (rpm put aside, were talking about horsepower). </TD></TR></TABLE>

BTW the LS has the same bore as the b16..all b-series are 81mm with the exception of the 84mm b20b/z.

Anyway, thanks for all the comments, that cleared some stuff up.

So do you think I would be pushing it if I turned up the boost to 10 or 11 psi at the track to make some good times?

My setup:
-stock b16a3
-ITS SC61 Killer (same is SC61 but with inconel turbine wheel)
-custom short tubular manifold(not log)
-2.5'' DP, 60mm exhaust (will change out soon for 3'')
-treadstone FMIC, 28 x 8 x 3
-Oil cooler with fan/and 190 degree thermostat (what thermostat should I have on? 180? 200?)
-ssautoshit tial style wastegate
(I went overkill on the cooling, but I would like to be as safe as possible)

Blackack26

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by adseguy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

No way, rods can hold up to a lot of power. The ringlands are the weakest part by far. As long as your arn't over revving Heat and Cylinder pressures will break ringlands first</TD></TR></TABLE>

That's what I was getting at, I guess I just had my "question" worded funny.

I corrected my post above to make more sense.... sort of.. I suck at english

Blackack26

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by _gurusan_ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

BTW the LS has the same bore as the b16..all b-series are 81mm with the exception of the 84mm b20b/z.

Anyway, thanks for all the comments, that cleared some stuff up.

So do you think I would be pushing it if I turned up the boost to 10 or 11 psi at the track to make some good times?

My setup:
-stock b16a3
-ITS SC61 Killer (same is SC61 but with inconel turbine wheel)
-custom short tubular manifold(not log)
-2.5'' DP, 60mm exhaust (will change out soon for 3'')
-treadstone FMIC, 28 x 8 x 3
-Oil cooler with fan/and 190 degree thermostat (what thermostat should I have on? 180? 200?)
-ssautoshit tial style wastegate
(I went overkill on the cooling, but I would like to be as safe as possible)
</TD></TR></TABLE>

With the stock b16 compression ratio, and that healthy sized turbo, just make sure whoever tunes it knows what their doing.

Get a good tune, run high octane pump gas.. and it should hold up nicely. There are lots of people pushing 300whp on stock block around here. Just be nice to it lol