the girl im going out with hates the car says its to noisy, i guess its the dumptube.... oh well her problem

 

Let me explore the less-glamorous side of boost - home made turbo setups, aka 'HMT'.

I have a '91 Accord I got for free. A DSM manifold/turbo I got for free that bolts right on. A welder, a chop saw, and lots of tubing. CromePro. A f22a1 in it that has virtually no aftermarket parts made for it. Should I go NA, or boost it for $475? I pitty you if you chose NA.


The debate is primarly a Honda issue because Hondas were essentially bred for NA, or at least making a lot from little. Oddly enough, thats what turbos do, make a lot from little. For most other pigs, aka non-Hondas, boost is the only real way. Do you think the SRT-4 or Cobalt SS would be so hot if they were NA? Hell no.

NA Hondas are popular because people have been doing it so freaking long, is so less involved than boost - and because their chassis' are very light. They have been given the chance because no other automaker chose that route, boost was so much easier. You have turbo mitsus, turbo firebirds, turbo mustangs, turbo thunderbirds, turbo chryslers, turbo buicks, turbo probes, turbo this, turbo that from the 80's. Only Toyota was the other brand that chose NA for certain cars, yet those motors - 20v inline 4's, sub-compacts with factory ITB's or IAB's - never made it to the USA.

Honda laid the groundwork, and the 'individual' caught on. Now that boost is just as easy (with a little bit more knowledge), its either 'get hooked' or 'be nostalgic'. My nostalga ends with the goddamn chokeless carb on my 1967 firebird. A good EMS, a safe tune, and boost is all that's in my future. Same for the 'bird.

 

i respect all boosted guys... i just think its cool to take atmospheric pressure and make the engine run just as fast as 15+lb boosted hondas.

sure it might be a full race car to go deep into the 10's but ..

its still atmospheric pressure..

it might take more money etc..but theres nothing like a 10k allmotor honda, and theres nothing like a 20lb boosted honda..

so everyone has their opinions..

 

big bonus to boosted cars are their versatility. try making a naturally aspirated 10 or 11 sec car. now try making it a street car....u cant just turn down compression. all u have is a track car that runs on a mix or race gas. boosted cars can make power on and off the track.

theres something to be said about being the best at something thats what the n/a guys are all about i guess. "boost is a crutch" "ive got the fastest n/a car here". the way i see it n/a cars are an underdog to boosted cars, as a 4 cyl is to a v8. even though u know the odds are against u there is a satisfaction theyre looking for. doubtfull theyll get it without a ton of cash though.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hybrid93Eg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Unless you have some ungoldly built and mean setup, you aren't going to hold a candle to any new Z06 thats stock. Period. They run 11.7 on street tires, stock, spinning most of the way. I've heard of people getting into the 10's with nothing more then slicks.</TD></TR></TABLE>

10's with slicks and a good driver. My Dad's 07 Z06 with headers dynoed 480 RWHP on a Dynojet. My car dynos 440 on a Mustang dyno. My car weighs 700 pounds less than his. Just as much, if not more power, and less weight. Tough equation to figure out. Nothing more than a mild built B16 (JE pistons, eagle rods, stock sleeves) with ITR cams, JG intake, SC61 on an inlinepro manifold, tuned with crome. From a dig to only 70 or 80 I have a hard time against my Dad unless I warm up the drag radials, but even a slow roll I don't have any trouble pulling on him.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b16sedan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Because my car with a little B16 is quiet because of the turbo, but on pump gas will run with 600-750CC sport bikes on the highway. Nothing like putzing along getting 30 MPG on the highway, but then racing a Viper, Z06, 911, etc and tearing it a new one. Good luck running a new Z06 with any streetable all motor honda.</TD></TR></TABLE>
x2
dido

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b16sedan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">10's with slicks and a good driver. My Dad's 07 Z06 with headers dynoed 480 RWHP on a Dynojet. My car dynos 440 on a Mustang dyno. My car weighs 700 pounds less than his. Just as much, if not more power, and less weight. Tough equation to figure out. Nothing more than a mild built B16 (JE pistons, eagle rods, stock sleeves) with ITR cams, JG intake, SC61 on an inlinepro manifold, tuned with crome. From a dig to only 70 or 80 I have a hard time against my Dad unless I warm up the drag radials, but even a slow roll I don't have any trouble pulling on him.</TD></TR></TABLE>

exactly, from a dig it will be difficult to keep any reasonably powered fwd honda to hold power let alone doing it on the street, but on the HW is where the weight and the power curve come in handy. Turbo hondas ussually just continue to increase unless you are making like 700hp. This comes in handy on rolling starts. My NA car would just run out of steam once the boosted car got traction.

 

great responses guys i just wanted to see the other side of the story since i read the other thread in the all motor form

i was planning on boosting my civic in a few months until i hit a deer this morning

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by petty$rep &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">great responses guys i just wanted to see the other side of the story since i read the other thread in the all motor form

i was planning on boosting my civic in a few months until i hit a deer this morning </TD></TR></TABLE>

hahaha, sorry but thats kinda funny. But i would save up again and boost.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Yambor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">iit might take more money etc..but theres nothing like a 10k allmotor honda, and theres nothing like a 20lb boosted honda..

so everyone has their opinions..</TD></TR></TABLE>

In my opinion, there's nothing like high compression, 9500RPM, and with a turbo to go along with it

All motor was fun back in the days... I surprised so many people with a 230 WHP NA setup with a 2400lb chassis back in '98. I used to smoke a whole bunch of turbo hondas which were laggy as hell and only makes around 300 WHP or so.

Eventually, NA sucked, basically because no one really leaves their turbo Honda at 300 WHP anymore..LOL Any bolt-on STi would murder you from a dig, and some punk's Stage III SRT-4 could give you a run for your money. All the new muscle cars are packed with 400+ HP from the factory and any bling Euro car (M3, M5, C32, E55, etc) would rip you a new hole.

Back then, boost was not as popular because most of the weakpoints of our engines were not discovered yet. And like all other cars out there, the lack of engine management and good tuners eventually lead to engine failures and trailer queens. The general concensus of turbos being unreliable is somewhat true, but with both NA and turbo engines making similar power, there's probably no difference between the two. An NA setup making 200 WHP is pretty reliable, but so is a Greddy kit at 6 psi with proper EMS for example.

Now with the vast knowledge, we can take our 400-500+ WHP turbo setups and drive it daily. I used to remember when stock sleeves were the limitations; now, it's pump gas...ROFL

The only thing I missed about my NA setup is the shear response and linear powerband which offers great traction. Although right now I have one of the most responsive turbo setups out there, it's still nowhere hear an NA car unless the RPM's are around 6000+ RPM.

 

I'd have to say PGMFI.ORG had a little something to do with the popularity and reliability of turbo honda "movement." Oh and HMT too! can't forget them boys. They had an influence on me anyway.