he said the tuner changed out the pump, which i assume was evans-tuning.

 

This is just not adding up...story's keep changing.....

John (jk-tuning) does a great job, like i stated IMW is where he tunes out of...

 

Its not that its more or less your minds to shallow to comprehend all of whats going on.

EVANS Tuning/Jeff Evans is a phenomenal tuner, bottom line. If I lived in that area I wouldn't trust anyone but him. I have never heard of JK-Tuning so he can't be that good. I am by no means a know it all but if you asked 30 people on this forum who Evans is 29 will know. The same can't be said for JK-Tuning.

 

agreed. ive personally seen bone stock motors with stock sleeves put down more wheel and on more psi too. he does a damn good job on tuning from what i hear, so somthing deff had to go wrong mechanically.

 

thats not neccesarily true, just because he doesnt have a big name doesnt mean he isnt good....I would however have to say that tuning is one of those things that experience means alot....and Im gonna take my car to someone that tunes hondas all day over someone that tunes mustangs..... evans is about 9 hours one way from me and I've considered taking a mini vacation out there just to get it tuned, I dunno though there is a guy close to me by the name of blundell (I think his HT name is blundar) that tunes ALOT of the imports in this area and his reputation is great, his work speaks for itself.

 

my buddy made 500+ on a stock sleeved ls. 26psi on a sc61

 

Thats nice but irrelevant to the OP. He's aware that stock sleeves should have handled his WHP.

 

lmfao at that comment.


are you serious, blundell has been a huge help to the honda world of tuning. i would goto him with confidence just like i would goto evans, tony in texas, laskey, MASE or tony in canada.

TO OP: did you have a question anywhere in this thread

 

lol agreed. i would let him take my car for a week. crome ftw.

 

sorry i just know that john does a great job at meeting ur power goals. thats why im going to him. but evans is a awsome tuner as well. I know alot of people in the northeast go to jeff evans. His rep is through the roof.

 

I believe I tuned your car in the summer time, cant remember exactly since there are so many cars that come through the shop. If its the same car, its a yellow eg hatch and you have done all of the fabrication work on the car.

Just a little background on the car from my standpoint. The engine smoked. When i mean smoked, I had to put fans behind the car from filling up the engine dyno bay with smoke. I could not breathe when I started to first tune the car. Looked over the turbo, piping, etc did not see any oil blow-by from the turbo. I was concerned, expressed my concerns about it and you decided to keep having it tuned. The engine made an terrible noise, sounded like really bad piston slap but I could not pin point it. Again, i told you I did not like the sound of it and you decided to proceed. I even spoke with the shop that built the engine concerned about the smoke/noise. They said proceed with it as well.

I started making a couple of pulls, ran out of fuel in the higher rpms almost immediately. Pump was not producing any noise, which led me to believe it was stock (which happens alot). Pulled the pump, put a walbro in and continued to tune. Made a few more pulls, started smoking less. Pulled plugs multiple times, everything looked fine. Made a few more pulls, no issues. Let the car cool down because it was relatively hot out. Made a pull at 17psi, plugs looked great but air/fuel was a bit rich. Made another pull, engine just took a crap.

I dont care who tuned this engine, it would have crapped out. Unfortunately I pulled the trigger on it. It was obvious that the engine had some serious issues as evident from the extreme smoke and noise. I specifically asked you if you wanted to proceed, and you made the decision. I am not in the business of toasting motors. If anyone tunes as many cars as I have, there is a certain failure rate associated with it. If everything is put together properly, engines stay together. Bottom line.

 

the truth shall set you free, Jeff would never tune a car to a level he is not comfortable unless the owner insists

 

I also just want to make things clear to the owner of the car, I am not upset in any way about your post. I know you were not posting to bash me, however with the way everything is portrayed and dramatized on the internet I just wanted to clear things up. I know you were super bummed about what happened, and hopefully you get the issues resolved with the engine building.

 

Whoops. Misread that earlier. lol For whatever reason, I was under the impression that it was tuned twice before on the other engine setups with the stock fuel pump (my assumption). I'm thinking the other engines let go on the street before getting tuned then.

lol. You don't get out too much. I can assure you that both of them are two of the best PA has to offer by way of tuning. No one is impervious to fault, but like Mr. Evans just stated, they aren't in the business of toasting motors.

 

well the OP did say......

 

I guess the litmus test is whether you've "heard" of them, lol.

 

Don't apologize, as soon as this was brought to my intention I intended to post. In our 5 year history, we have NEVER had a motor let loose prematurely. We have hundreds of satisfied HT members who have had their motors built by us and tuned by Jeff. Thanks for your concern, and check your pm, I had a mod scan your IP and *gasp* it matches that of another member You dont have to go to all the trouble of registering a new name, we could really care less!

Anyhow, I'll fill you guys in on our (FSM) side of the story. Let me start off by saying, anytime you do work for family or friends, you WILL get screwed. Don't ask me why, its just how it goes. All of you shop owners/tuners know exactly what im talking about! I feel TERRIBLE for Steve(owner of the car), he has the WORST luck of anyone we know.


Motor #1---- Steve came to us with a beat B16 longblock still in the car. He wanted to do an LS/VTEC conversion. I got on the horn with Randy@IAS and ordered him a fresh 2001 LS longblock so we could be assured that we were using a good running shortblock to begin with. Anyone who has dealt with Randy knows he deals only in the finest used parts. We put the motor together reusing his original cylinder head which showed no visible signs of damage. We also installed a greddy turbo kit that steve purchased from one of our old employees, as well as a clutch/flywheel, gauges, etc...I personally drove the motor for 30-40 miles on 5psi and the A/F was nice and rich in boost. No smoke, no noises, no leaks.....Deeming it good to go, we give it to the customer. He doesnt even make it to his house Oil pressure light came on and he shut it down. We had the car towed back in and determined the pump had failed and the block was no longer reusable.


Motor #2---- We called IAS and informed them of the situation and being as good as they are they did not hesitate to get us another 01 longblock out immediately. We stand behind what we do, and seeing as how we sold him the motor, we obviously agreed to take everything apart and replace it at no charge to him. Let me tell you, any profit that was made, which wasn't much in the first place, was now long gone. But thats beside the point....We got the new block, put the car together with his original head(again) and this time I sent Dan(our head tech) out for a lengthy test drive. The car did not make it back Dan called me and told me that it had excessive blowby and that somehow this motor was beat. It was then we were informed that the car had a chipped ECU in it, which in addition to the blue box and 310's, was not a very cooperative setup.

Motor #3---- We again agreed to remedy the problem at no cost to steve. We had then said we were going to go through the entire motor and freshen it up as to ensure that it was 110%. He decided to buy pistons and rods seeing as how we were taking care of the labor, he would have a built motor when it was all said and done. We had our local machinist bore, hone, and deck the block. The motor was assembeld here in house and after specc'ing it out, it had conservative P2W, Ring Gap, and the bearing clearances were all within spec. The only variable was his cylinder head which he kept wanting to reuse. We agreed to send it out of here all motor to ensure a smooth break in and the customer was going to fabricate his own turbo kit.



When the car finally left, there was no noise, no smoke no leaks and it ran pretty dam good for being a 9.1 boost motor with a header on it. If it made any sort of noise we would not have given it back, nor would Steve had accepted it back. The period between the dyno and the time it left here was significant. We are talking 2006 here people, it is now 2009. Personally, I always thought it was something in his cylinder head, and that still has remained a mystery. Throughout the course of this NIGHTMARE MONEY LOOSING job, we forgot to install his walbro. Oh well, **** happens, and Jeff caught it and we paid for it. Technically we are still owed for the materials he used to fabricate his manfiold, but I didnt sweat that because he is a good customer/friend, but the manufacturer I bought it from certainly charged me for it....



So in closing, you HT'ers can believe what you want. **** happens, and this is a very unfortunate situation. I 110% believe that Jeff or US did not cause this motor to let go, it just happened. IT might be hard for all you guys who have built one or two motors that have held up to understand, but come back and talk to me when you build 100. One or two of them are going to have problems no matter how perfectly you did them.



Sincerely,

Josh@FSM

 

Thats hilarious.

So the motor was built in 06, it wasn't tuned til 09, and you said the motor was a POS yourself, and you wonder why it blows up LOL

 

Never did I state that evans was a bad tuner! I said the kids story was not adding up......I live in pa and have seen Jeff tune cars he is a great tuner one of the best!!!!.....

Also I was just stating that JK-Tuning was a good tuner as well...He isnt that big of a name yet being he's a 23 year old college student.....Now has a shop and trust me you will start hearing his name alot more...

 

before anythig gets out of hand evans did tune the car and yes it did blow up. However i personally do not think that it was his fault. He was not the one that forgot to change the fuel pump, that was the people who put in the motor, i paid for that to get done. I have no idea what the problem is/was all i do know is that evans did chage the fuel pump on the dyno when he saw that he was not getting enough fuel. Here is the whole story on this motor so there is no confusion.the bottom end of this motor was machined to fit 9:1 compression je pistons and it used crower rods. the head was taken to the machine shop with the block and taken apart and checked for all tolerances. all seals, and valves were replaced to factory specs. ARP head studs were installed with a cometic head gasket. I was given this car back from the shop after the motor was replaced with this motor and i drove it for a few (2or#3) months with no turbo I wasnt done the manifold yet. After these few months the head took a ****, and removed and sent back to the machine shop. they did a 5 angle valve job ad changed the valves and seals again. (I think the head going bad f-ed up the block, but i dunno) The new head was installed and i drove the car 500 hundred miles with no turbo kit babying it around town to break the motor in. It ran fine for this time. I put the turbo kit on the car and it ran ok just idling but the turbo seals were leaking. i replaced the turbo and it idled ok. I did not have the car tuned at this point but i still had the piggy back from the old turbo kit installed on the factory ecu. I was told from a good source that i could drive the car back and forth in the parking lot to check for leaks. (no i did not beat the f out of the car first and second 5 pds boost if that 3000rpms which i was told was safe. Tuned it and it blew up. I dont think i should have ever driven in the parking lot.... thats my theory.

 

I did not realize how ugly these post would get just wanted to show my car and see what people thought. Both FSM and evans tuning have post in this thread as you all know. the are both correct in their stories and i hope there are no hard feelings. I hope the above story clears it all up. i think i blew the ****ing thing up. worst part is soon i will finally fixing the car but i dont want anyone to be f-ed with this nightmare car again.

 

I did see this thread a few days ago and was going to comment on it, but I let it slide.

It is funny how soo quick the tuner gets the blame for engine failure. I am sure that Jeff expressed his concern for the engine's health as soon as he saw any excess smoke coming from the car and/or any odd noises. And if he is asked to keep tuning the car then it is understandable that he continued due to the customer's request after his inspection.

Just tear it down, replace what was the issue and have at it again!

But next time.. trailer that thing to the tuning shop to break it in on the dyno. After an initial start up and oil change of course.

 

Hey josh

this is mark with the clean 89 std civic hatch. i remember this car there everytime i came in and u said that it was one issue after another. It seemed like that car would never leave ur shop u were always working on it. BTW Josh and Dan at First state motorsports will take care of u for whatever it is. Josh and dan helped me when i got my b16 swap in my hatch and they got it in the car the obd0 ecu was a auto. they called hmo and they got a 5 speed shipped to them next day. they also helped me get the thing through inspection. Josh and dan are great people and will help the best they can with whatever it is. Thumbs up FSM!!!!!

 

x2

 

wow, did this thread get messed up