Lens Replcation
07-30-2007, 10:50 AM
#1
Lens Replcation
I've posted this on most of my other Honda boards, but it will probably get viewed the most here.
I haven't worked on this in a few months (busy building an airplane), but hope to get back on it in a month or so.
I've been working with smithenhiven on trying to reproduce some OEM lenses for his S600. He paid a pretty high price for some NOS lenses, and we figured before he slaps them on his jalopy (just kidding) and lets the UV rays have their way with them, we'd try to reproduce them.
he sent me a rear brake lens and a front turn signal lens, which I made silicone molds of. It took me a few tries, but I now have the dye ratios right and am producing exact color matched lenses. Now my issue is bubbles. I've recently acquired some high dollar equipment to help eliminate the bubble problem - a vacuum oven, vacuum pump, and a pressure pot. I also acquired some high grade clear silicone, so I plan on making multiple (and better) molds soon.
I used to do injection molding and casting at an old job. They went out of business and I acquired my supplies and equipment from them for an incredible price.
The reason I haven't worked on it in a while is because my equipment is at my house and there isn't really enough room there to work. I need to get the equipment to my shop (about 15 miles from my house) so I can get going again. Once I hit a stopping point on my airplane, I'm going to hit this full force.
Anyhow, some pictures. Only pictures of the turn signal lens so far, as it's smallest and wastes the least amount of resin.
OEM lens on the right, replica on the left (resin flash not trimmed)
Near = OEM, Far = reproduction
Same shot without the camera flash
No camera flash
Bubble detail
Modified by DaX at 4:56 PM 7/30/2007
Modified by DaX at 8:24 AM 9/19/2007
I haven't worked on this in a few months (busy building an airplane), but hope to get back on it in a month or so.
I've been working with smithenhiven on trying to reproduce some OEM lenses for his S600. He paid a pretty high price for some NOS lenses, and we figured before he slaps them on his jalopy (just kidding) and lets the UV rays have their way with them, we'd try to reproduce them.
he sent me a rear brake lens and a front turn signal lens, which I made silicone molds of. It took me a few tries, but I now have the dye ratios right and am producing exact color matched lenses. Now my issue is bubbles. I've recently acquired some high dollar equipment to help eliminate the bubble problem - a vacuum oven, vacuum pump, and a pressure pot. I also acquired some high grade clear silicone, so I plan on making multiple (and better) molds soon.
I used to do injection molding and casting at an old job. They went out of business and I acquired my supplies and equipment from them for an incredible price.
The reason I haven't worked on it in a while is because my equipment is at my house and there isn't really enough room there to work. I need to get the equipment to my shop (about 15 miles from my house) so I can get going again. Once I hit a stopping point on my airplane, I'm going to hit this full force.
Anyhow, some pictures. Only pictures of the turn signal lens so far, as it's smallest and wastes the least amount of resin.
OEM lens on the right, replica on the left (resin flash not trimmed)
Near = OEM, Far = reproduction
Same shot without the camera flash
No camera flash
Bubble detail
Modified by DaX at 4:56 PM 7/30/2007
Modified by DaX at 8:24 AM 9/19/2007
07-30-2007, 02:13 PM
#4
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Re: Lens Replcation (DaX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DaX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Now my issue is bubbles. I've recently acquired some high dollar equipment to help eliminate the bubble problem - a vacuum oven, vacuum pump, and a pressure pot. I also acquired some high grade clear silicone, so I plan on making multiple (and better) molds soon.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
thats great news!
Now my issue is bubbles. I've recently acquired some high dollar equipment to help eliminate the bubble problem - a vacuum oven, vacuum pump, and a pressure pot. I also acquired some high grade clear silicone, so I plan on making multiple (and better) molds soon.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
thats great news!
07-31-2007, 04:07 AM
#6
Jonathan,
Right now I'm only working with hard resin lenses of a single color - I haven't figured out yet (nor have I messed with it much) how to make single piece lenses with multiple colors in them. I assume there is a partial cure for each piece, then combining them, but I don't know - the factory (I'm sure) uses a very high dollar injection molding machine - while I'm only pressure casting at the moment. My equipment is currently also limited by size - my pressure pot is only a 2.5 gallon paint pressure pot, and my vacuum oven is only 12x20x12. If I felt there was enough demand to invest in buying/building larger vacuum and pressure chambers, I would consider it.
Once I get all the kinks worked out of the lenses, I planned on trying to replicate a flexible rubber piece that is part of a floor mat for the S600. I have around 110 lbs of silicone to make molds with, which is a lot, but large pieces take lots of silicone for the molds.
I'm not opposed to branching out further in what I am capable of producing, but I'd like to get the process down for what I currently have right now.
Right now I'm only working with hard resin lenses of a single color - I haven't figured out yet (nor have I messed with it much) how to make single piece lenses with multiple colors in them. I assume there is a partial cure for each piece, then combining them, but I don't know - the factory (I'm sure) uses a very high dollar injection molding machine - while I'm only pressure casting at the moment. My equipment is currently also limited by size - my pressure pot is only a 2.5 gallon paint pressure pot, and my vacuum oven is only 12x20x12. If I felt there was enough demand to invest in buying/building larger vacuum and pressure chambers, I would consider it.
Once I get all the kinks worked out of the lenses, I planned on trying to replicate a flexible rubber piece that is part of a floor mat for the S600. I have around 110 lbs of silicone to make molds with, which is a lot, but large pieces take lots of silicone for the molds.
I'm not opposed to branching out further in what I am capable of producing, but I'd like to get the process down for what I currently have right now.
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08-02-2007, 08:43 AM
#8
Re: (MSchu)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MSchu »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">how does the tiny lettering come out on a second generation mold off of a production unit?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Rather perfect, here's a shot of the inside of the female mold for the turn signal - if you look closely you can see the negative of the lettering.
Rather perfect, here's a shot of the inside of the female mold for the turn signal - if you look closely you can see the negative of the lettering.
08-03-2007, 04:37 PM
#9
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Re: Lens Replcation (DaX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DaX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I've been working with smithenhiven on trying to reproduce some OEM lenses for his S600. He paid a pretty high price for some NOS lenses, and we figured before he slaps them on his jalopy (just kidding) and lets the UV rays have their way with them, we'd try to reproduce them.</TD></TR></TABLE>
looks great, Mark me down for a set when you make them (brake&blinkers).
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DaX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Once I get all the kinks worked out of the lenses, I planned on trying to replicate a flexible rubber piece that is part of a floor mat for the S600.</TD></TR></TABLE>
do you mean you plan to make the whole floormat, or just part of it. If your replicating the whole mat, you can mark me down for those too!
I've been working with smithenhiven on trying to reproduce some OEM lenses for his S600. He paid a pretty high price for some NOS lenses, and we figured before he slaps them on his jalopy (just kidding) and lets the UV rays have their way with them, we'd try to reproduce them.</TD></TR></TABLE>
looks great, Mark me down for a set when you make them (brake&blinkers).
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DaX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Once I get all the kinks worked out of the lenses, I planned on trying to replicate a flexible rubber piece that is part of a floor mat for the S600.</TD></TR></TABLE>
do you mean you plan to make the whole floormat, or just part of it. If your replicating the whole mat, you can mark me down for those too!
08-04-2007, 12:00 PM
#10
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Re: Lens Replcation (ekim)
What kind of resin are you using to make the lenses? Where do you buy your supplies?
I've been messing with some small parts reproductions. I've been buying my resins from smooth-on. I built my own vacuum chamber for degassing. Here is some of the stuff I've done:
CF-48 wheel emblems:
EA Mugen Spoiler emblem:
EA Mugen Exhaust emblem (mines on top):
I'm going to be working on a Mugen steering wheel center cap next. The lenses look good, I bet it's hard to work with a clear resin.
I've been messing with some small parts reproductions. I've been buying my resins from smooth-on. I built my own vacuum chamber for degassing. Here is some of the stuff I've done:
CF-48 wheel emblems:
EA Mugen Spoiler emblem:
EA Mugen Exhaust emblem (mines on top):
I'm going to be working on a Mugen steering wheel center cap next. The lenses look good, I bet it's hard to work with a clear resin.
08-05-2007, 04:31 AM
#11
Re: Lens Replcation (ekim)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ekim »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
looks great, Mark me down for a set when you make them (brake&blinkers).
do you mean you plan to make the whole floormat, or just part of it. If your replicating the whole mat, you can mark me down for those too!</TD></TR></TABLE>
I am going to try to make the rubber insert for the floor mat - I think smithenhiven was going to get the actual mat made somewhere else. Just keep up with the thread - I'll post when I have success.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1gencrx »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What kind of resin are you using to make the lenses? Where do you buy your supplies?
I've been messing with some small parts reproductions. I've been buying my resins from smooth-on. I built my own vacuum chamber for degassing. Here is some of the stuff I've done:
I'm going to be working on a Mugen steering wheel center cap next. The lenses look good, I bet it's hard to work with a clear resin.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I buy my resin from Alumilite - I'm using their "water clear" resin for the lenses with varying amounts of dye to get the colors correct. Clear resin si a little more difficult - you can't use filler, and flaws stand out. Your parts look very nice as well. Are you using silicone molds? I got really lucky and scored some GE TSE 3466 silicone - over 100 lbs of it - it's really expensive stuff and is really nice for molds.
looks great, Mark me down for a set when you make them (brake&blinkers).
do you mean you plan to make the whole floormat, or just part of it. If your replicating the whole mat, you can mark me down for those too!</TD></TR></TABLE>
I am going to try to make the rubber insert for the floor mat - I think smithenhiven was going to get the actual mat made somewhere else. Just keep up with the thread - I'll post when I have success.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1gencrx »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What kind of resin are you using to make the lenses? Where do you buy your supplies?
I've been messing with some small parts reproductions. I've been buying my resins from smooth-on. I built my own vacuum chamber for degassing. Here is some of the stuff I've done:
I'm going to be working on a Mugen steering wheel center cap next. The lenses look good, I bet it's hard to work with a clear resin.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I buy my resin from Alumilite - I'm using their "water clear" resin for the lenses with varying amounts of dye to get the colors correct. Clear resin si a little more difficult - you can't use filler, and flaws stand out. Your parts look very nice as well. Are you using silicone molds? I got really lucky and scored some GE TSE 3466 silicone - over 100 lbs of it - it's really expensive stuff and is really nice for molds.
08-05-2007, 09:40 AM
#12
11:11
Re: Lens Replcation (DaX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DaX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I am going to try to make the rubber insert for the floor mat - I think smithenhiven was going to get the actual mat made somewhere else. Just keep up with the thread - I'll post when I have success.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah, I've got a upholstery shop near by that can make the mats. It's the rubber insert that's going to be the key. It sure would be nice if we can get that reproduced.
I am going to try to make the rubber insert for the floor mat - I think smithenhiven was going to get the actual mat made somewhere else. Just keep up with the thread - I'll post when I have success.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah, I've got a upholstery shop near by that can make the mats. It's the rubber insert that's going to be the key. It sure would be nice if we can get that reproduced.
08-06-2007, 04:46 AM
#13
My Name is Nobody
Re: Lens Replcation (smithenhiven)
really cool stuff!!!
Looking for aero cover replicas if you guys know where any GOOD ones can be found. otherwise I will make them out of aluminum sheets
Looking for aero cover replicas if you guys know where any GOOD ones can be found. otherwise I will make them out of aluminum sheets
09-19-2007, 04:33 AM
#14
Re: Lens Replcation (MSchu)
While waiting for the acid etch treatment to dry on my rudder skins, I decided to fiddle with making another turn signal lens since I moved all my lens making equipment to my airplane factory.
Yogurt cups make excellent disposable mixing cups:
Pressure casting system in action. I am pressure casting at 40 psi.
I modified the turn signal mold for pressure casting by cutting a small reservoir in the side of it. This picture was taken after curing. If I had put enough resin into the mold, the reservoir would still have some resin in it. Live and learn...let's see how the bubbles are.
It looks like no bubbles - I'll know the whole story after I demold completely tomorrow.
Detail of no bubbles. You can see the large void though.
My reasoning for having a void:
I decided to try a few new things this time. The working time of the resin is only 5 minutes once mixed. I spent 3 of those minutes degassing in a vacuum chamber. In my opinion, this was 3 minutes wasted. I saw absolutely no gas come out of the resin during this degas. This left me two minutes to fill the mold, get it rubber banded, put it in the pressure pot, seal the pressure pot, and connect the air hose. I knew I had little time so I at least wanted to get some resin in the mold to see if it would have bubbles. Next time I'm going to skip the degassing step and take my time filling the mold. I might also enlarge the reservoir a little bit.
Yogurt cups make excellent disposable mixing cups:
Pressure casting system in action. I am pressure casting at 40 psi.
I modified the turn signal mold for pressure casting by cutting a small reservoir in the side of it. This picture was taken after curing. If I had put enough resin into the mold, the reservoir would still have some resin in it. Live and learn...let's see how the bubbles are.
It looks like no bubbles - I'll know the whole story after I demold completely tomorrow.
Detail of no bubbles. You can see the large void though.
My reasoning for having a void:
I decided to try a few new things this time. The working time of the resin is only 5 minutes once mixed. I spent 3 of those minutes degassing in a vacuum chamber. In my opinion, this was 3 minutes wasted. I saw absolutely no gas come out of the resin during this degas. This left me two minutes to fill the mold, get it rubber banded, put it in the pressure pot, seal the pressure pot, and connect the air hose. I knew I had little time so I at least wanted to get some resin in the mold to see if it would have bubbles. Next time I'm going to skip the degassing step and take my time filling the mold. I might also enlarge the reservoir a little bit.
09-19-2007, 04:41 AM
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Re: Lens Replcation (DaX)
wow! good progress man, keep it up! you'll be definately valuable to the vintage honda community! i remember your first tries.
09-19-2007, 07:21 PM
#17
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Lens Replcation (smithenhiven)
Great to see these parts being reproduced. I'd be interested in a set of full rubber mats (the S800 had floor carpets but the S600 had just rubber mats). I've never seen them for sale and ours now have a couple of cracks on the driver's side.
Let me mention the reproduction parking light lenses made by a technical school in France and available (I think) from the French S800 club. There's an interesting set of photos of the manufacturing process at http://perso.orange.fr/club.ho...l.htm. For those that don't read French, they appear to have run these lenses for 12 hours straight, which means they probably made enough to re-equip all the cars still around. They were also working on distributor caps.
Let me mention the reproduction parking light lenses made by a technical school in France and available (I think) from the French S800 club. There's an interesting set of photos of the manufacturing process at http://perso.orange.fr/club.ho...l.htm. For those that don't read French, they appear to have run these lenses for 12 hours straight, which means they probably made enough to re-equip all the cars still around. They were also working on distributor caps.
09-20-2007, 06:49 AM
#18
Re: Lens Replcation (Bobs600)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bobs600 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Great to see these parts being reproduced. I'd be interested in a set of full rubber mats (the S800 had floor carpets but the S600 had just rubber mats). I've never seen them for sale and ours now have a couple of cracks on the driver's side.
Let me mention the reproduction parking light lenses made by a technical school in France and available (I think) from the French S800 club. There's an interesting set of photos of the manufacturing process at http://perso.orange.fr/club.ho...l.htm. For those that don't read French, they appear to have run these lenses for 12 hours straight, which means they probably made enough to re-equip all the cars still around. They were also working on distributor caps. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Very cool. They're using way more professional equipment than I am!
Let me mention the reproduction parking light lenses made by a technical school in France and available (I think) from the French S800 club. There's an interesting set of photos of the manufacturing process at http://perso.orange.fr/club.ho...l.htm. For those that don't read French, they appear to have run these lenses for 12 hours straight, which means they probably made enough to re-equip all the cars still around. They were also working on distributor caps. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Very cool. They're using way more professional equipment than I am!
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