Hey, any input is appreciated...I have a 2010 VW Golf (2dr hatch) and my stereo is horrible. I have a Phoenix Gold XS4300 4 channel amp 35x4 @ 4 ohm (supposedly seriously underrated). I just purchased 2 sets of DLS X-Program X-SD62 Components and I'm keeping my stock head unit running a Scosche line converter...im kind of a recent self proclaimed audiophile, and my ears like treble...I was wondering what everyone's thoughts are on running a 5 channel amp with a single 8 inch sub...or will that be too much bass? I'm probably going to install the setup listed and see if it suits my needs first...

The speakers are rated at 50w and I'm pretty sure that's what my amp puts out, so I'm hoping when my current setup gets installed it should be good...I have no experience with one 8inch sub in a hatch, and I don't like much bass. Anyone have experience with one 8...if so what are your recommendations? Keep in mind I'm an old guy, going for an all around richer sound...not into a new head unit and all that jazzy stuff. Anyone have any experience with DLS?

 

The head unit should be changed or atleast use a clean sweep to get a clean signal. The amp is only going to ampilfie the signal it gets. So if its a garbage signal. Thats what your going to hear. The 8 sub would be good depending on enclosure and power.

 

If you want to keep the headunit, please invest in some sort of processing to clean up the signal, eq, and time alignment purposes.

That Amp may put out 60 x 4 which is nowhere near enough. 2 sets of components was 1 set too many. If u can, either return both and use that money toward 1 better set, or keep 1, sell the other, and use that money toward an amp.

Seems like you like a lot of top end sparkle.

Those dls components are very warm sounding and will take a **** load of EQ and power to get what you want out of them.

8's are cool if you go with duals. It takes cone area to get down low, and there's only so much air an 8 can pump out in the lowest octaves.

Not to mention, they're inefficient as hell.

Ideally, this is what would need to be done for a decent sq system.

Headunit or processor. Some use both.
Front components. Woofer, tweets, and passive crossover. More advanced setups skip the passive setup's for electronic controlling
4 channel amp. This roughly depends on the drivers being used. Power is VERY VERY cheap nowadays. You should be buying as much power as u can afford. If u want, i can explain why a lot more power than rated is a good thing.
Sub(s). 9 times out of 10, 1 8 isn't enough. A port can help, but it's best to go with duals if going with 8's. If hatch space isn't a concern, you'd want to put the biggest sub u can fit in there. The less the cone moves= less distortion. Less distortion=happy ears. Not to mention, the more cone area u go with, the more efficient the sub will be. More efficiency=less power needed. Less power needed=happier electrical system.
Sound deadening. Deadening is very important for SQ. In your situation, a fully deadened door and hatch area would be enough.
Wiring. NEVER skimp on wiring. Lots of times, crucial electrical upgrades aren't needed if your electrical and distribution is proper.

 

Looks like we can recycle this phoenix gold amp afterall.

Here are the specs
4 Channel Mosfet Amplifier
PWM Mosfet Power Supply Defeatable
Advanced Overload and Thermal Protection
Dual Hi Level Input Connections
Advanced Muting Circuitry Eliminates Turn-On And Turn-Off Noises
Metal Film Capacitors/Resistors In Signal Path
24kt Gold Plated High Current Power And Speaker Terminals
Isolation Mounting Feet
Optional XS Link For Seamless Multiple Amplifier Installation
Dual Low Pass level control
Frequency Response +/-1dB, 20Hz to 20 kHZ
Signal to Noise Ratio (A-weighted) >100dB
Max Continuous Bridged Power @ 1% THD 150 watts x 2 into 4 ohms @ 14.4 Vdc
Max Continuous Power per Channel @ 1% THD 75 watts x 4 into 2 ohms @ 14.4 Vdc
Nominal Continuous Power per Channel @ 1 % THD 35 Watts x 4 into 4 ohms @ 14.4 Vdc
IASCA/USAC Power Rating 12 Watts x 4 into 4 ohms @ 12.5 Vdc
Minimum Load when Bridged 2 Ohms
Minimum Load per Channel 1 Ohm
Input Signal Voltage Range 0.1 volts to 2 volts
Crossover Type Resisitor Network, Linkwitz Riley,
Highpass/Lowpass
Crossover Slope 24 dB per octave
Crossover Frequency Range 20-550Hz
Factory Crossover Setting 85 Hz
Auxilary Output Channels 2
Auxilary Output Frequency Range Highpass or Lowpass, Opposite of Speaker Output
Bass Boost 0- to +18dB @ 45 hZ
Power Supply Voltage 10Vdc to 15.5Vdc
Recommended Fuse 40 amp
Dimensions 12.25L x 9.25W x 2.10H

It'll give you 150 x 2 @ 4 ohms and has a low pass filter, so you can use this for 2 lower powered 8's.

I'd nominate the jbl gto. Has triple shorting rings, decent xmax & power handling. True SQ sub.

Oh, and did i mention dirt cheap?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/JBL-GTO804-C...ht_4167wt_1397

Considering you only have 150 on tap per driver, you should port these. The port will help you get into the lower octaves. Properly made box and the right tune, you should be able to get 125+ db of clean output from the pair. More than enough for normal listening.

 

Edzy...I really appreciate the advice, but now I feel like I am in a quagmire. I ordered off of sonicelectronix.com and the goods are yet to arrive. I don't want to get crazy, and I don't mind waiting and returning some stuff in order to get a better all around system. Money is not an issue, I want a simple set up that sounds warm and rich. I wanted to keep the factory head unit because I don't really want a double din in my car. I'm not against it, but I live in Miami and theft is an issue, I'm a bit older and I think the look is a bit tasteless. This is why I put this off this long...I honestly don't want subs, I'm not into much bass and I don't want them filling my trunk up. A stealthbox setup is an option, but only to make the sound of the system more round...I ordered 2 sets of components because I am trying to avoid the subs all together. I hope this gives you a better understanding of what I'm trying to accomplish, and again...I really appreciate you spending time responding to my thread.

Much appreciated.

 

No chance you're in or around Miami? Ideally Id give you my debit card and you could do whatever you'd deemed necessary...and I'd pay you for your troubles.

 

Understandable.

Without some sort of processing, you won't have any control over the sound. It's never gonna sound good directly out the box, and you won't have much control over anything.

An extra set of components won't really do anything.

Subs play from 80hz down to their natual drop off which will be in the higher 20's since u listen to reggae.

6.5 components will never get down to into the 20s with authority. They'll run out of throw or power handling way before then. It's even worse in a door since they're running free air and not in an enclosure. You will want something to fill in the lows. Mids won't do it. I noticed sonic has them for 130.

If u sent them back, that $260 would get you a pretty damn good set of components.

The 8's require pretty small boxes. The pair will need 1.4-1.5 cubic feet of space.

They're plenty installs that i have done for customers that have wanted zero subs only to come back a month later becus they were craving more bass.

 

Im located in NY, lol.

 

I'm hopeful the components will have enough bass...bc I really dont need a lot at all. I'd probably rather go with one 10 as opposed to two 8's. One sub will be enough for me.

 

IMO it's not quite powerful enough. I've always tried to match or exceed RMS power ratings when pairing an amp with a sub (or subs.)

It's not to say that it won't work, though. And I've certainly seen worse cases of mismatched audio components. One guy in particular was running a 250.2 PG amp to a pair of 1,000w RF 12's. Sure, it made lots of noise, but it didn't exactly sound good.


You and Des are also spot-on about the signal from the stock head unit, as well as your initial (detailed) reply. Personally, I'd get just get a new head unit if I were this fella.




Edit: I wouldn't count on it. It'll sound okay at really low volumes, but you'd still be missing some of the spectrum and it'll sound like *** as soon as you "turn it up."


I'll leave you in the capable hands of Des, fcm (if he decides to poke his head in here), and edzy.

 

I did see a few 5 channel Amps on sonicelectronix for fairly cheap that would handle both sets of components and a 8' from morel that runs at 200rms 4ohm...

 

Not the most ideal, but it can work if needed.

The jbl's have a thermal handling of 200w, so it really won't miss that extra 50. Not to mention, the amp is underrated. It might actually put out what the jbl's like and then some.

Also, subs are more lenient to less power since they aren't like mids and need the extra power for those peaks.

The crest factor of a CD is like 30db(a power factor of 1000), which means the peaks can be 30 dB higher than the average, so if you are listening to music at 1 watt RMS.. your amp (even the one on the tweeters) will need to be able to produce a full 1000 watt output - even if for just a few milliseconds.

This why guys can put 600 watt amps on 100w speakers and rarely if ever blow them, the power is for headroom.

It's funny cus me and FCM always bump heads over this.

Op,

1 10 would've been my original choice as well, but i was tryin' to put that nice old school phoenix amp to good use, lol.

This 10" would require a smaller box than the 2 8's. 1.5 vs 1.25 for the 10.
But, you won't be able to recycle the phoenix gold amp. No worries, though..It only needs 250-300w's and those are dirt cheap nowadays.

http://www.soundsolutionsaudio.com/i...tion/dcon.html

These subs are pure SQ. Not meant to be boomy or annoying, but they will get loud if u turn up the ****. They're meant to blend in with your mids.

Cheap, too. $119 i believe.

I know you have a larger budget, but things can be done on the cheapz if the right products are chosen. The only thing that won't be cheap is probably processing and enclosure for the sub.

 

So using sonic electronix...since that's where I bought my stuff. (assuming I have a 250.00 credit) What would I need to do? Btw installers in Miami are shady! I'm almost inclined to bring it to best buy, bc I know if they mess it up, they can fix it. I'm capable of installing it myself, but I'm not too interested.

 

Sonic electronix is funny with prices

See, with sonic credit, i would get these
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/cart....ded&item=45048

But, they're over 50 dollars cheaper on ebay. We'll use that $250 from sonic on something else.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/JBL-MS-62C-6...ht_4836wt_1163

The last thing u want to do is take your car to best buy.

You don't want some 16 year old working on your car.

This should help u
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/...i-florida.html

 

Here's what i whipped together

Rockford 3sixty.3 $599.99

This will be the brains of the operation. YOu'll have total control over how everything sounds. 248 total bands of eq. 31 bands on each channel.

Will need a laptop with usb to tune the system. Has auto eq, so it'll do 90% of the work for you. After it tunes, you just cater it to the way you want it to sound.

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-cqiL0v7...-3Sixty-3.html

JBL ms-62 $172.99 on ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/JBL-MS-62C-6...ht_4836wt_1163

PPI p.9004 $249.99
http://www.woofersetc.com/p-10138-p9...amplifier.aspx

This amp will be bridged down to 2 channels to power the front stage. Will give you 450 watts x 2. More than you'll ever need for the setup. Since you'll have so much power on tap, the amp will never run hot and remain cool. This can probably be installed under the seat.

Sound solutions audio dcon 10. $114.99
http://store.soundsolutionsaudio.com...subwoofer.html

Choose the dual 4 ohm option. Box requires a 1.25 cubic foot ported box. You'll want to tune low for an sq system. I'd shoot for 30hz

Use your sonic credit on this amp to power the sub.

Kicker zx 500.1 $249.99
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...11ZX500.1.html

As you can see, the amp is very tiny..so this may be able to be installed under the seat.

This amp will give u 500 watts @ 2 ohms(where the sub will be wired to) in a very tiny footprint.

Next is sound deadening.

The norm is to "cover everything", but that's not needed.

With the sounddeadenershowdown cld tiles, you just need to cover 25% of the area.

I would get
5 tiles per door
and 10 or so tiles for the hatch area
http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/products/cld

This is to stop the vibrations.

Next we want to stop outside noise from entering the cabin area.

This is where Mass loaded vinyl comes into play. You want to completely lines the doors and hatch area with this.
http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/products/mlv

After that is wiring.

The shop you go to will have this stuff available.

This is how you want things wired.

You want the big 3 electrical upgrade done in 0 gauge wiring.
0 gauge wiring from the battery to the in input of the distribution block & 4 gauge runs to each amp.

 

Sounds like a really good setup, now I wonder if I can find someone competent enough to complete the install. Although the link you showed me has a couple of promising leads.

 

There are plenty of good installers that work for best buy.. they happen to employ more master certified techs than anybody out there. You just have to know which shop to go to to find the good people.

Where are you located OP? I'll do some networking and see if there's someone in your area worth talking to.




Also.. lol'ing at jbl gto subs being referred to as SQ subs

 

if you're willing to make a little bit of a drive, call the best buy in west palm and talk to bryan baum.. guy is insanely talented and knowledgeable.

 

They're not sq subs?

The triple shorting rings
tons of xmax(for its size and cost)
efficiency

Oh, i forgot to mention that IASCA world champ Natan Budiono uses the gto's in his car. Obviously, that doesn't mean anything, right?
http://www.mobilesq.com/gallery2/mai...g2_itemId=1348
Yeah, you're right. Those are def suited for SPL.

 

don't get your panties in a bunch.. i install them on the reg (8" version) when people don't wanna pony up the coin for a flat kenwood or a w3. they do the job, but i don't know if i'd call it an sq sub.

def not saying it's an spl sub either.. it's just a sub. you need a little low end boom, then it will fit the bill.

 

They're SQ subs....

 

I'm in Miami...thanks again for taking the time to help me out guys...my speakers are getting installed outside of my front door as I am typing...and simultaneously watching the hurricanes getting killed in the 1st quarter. :/ thanks to edzy posting that link, diyaudio...I took a chance with a guy on the forum. His name is max, he drove to me and has been installing my two sets of components/amp/power wires/line converter for less than 150. And he has been here since 11!

 

I figured I'll just try this setup out for now and see if im happy, if not I'm buying a mono amp and probably installing one 10. And maybe I'll just bite the bullet and install a head unit. Or maybe I'll just wait until edzy gets down to Miami on a vacation/business trip...haha.