97CWITR

I believe it.

Wondering what guys are typically running for spring rates with koni/gc. Was thinking 450/380? Almost all street driven, maybe 1 or 2 track days this year.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

I wouldn't really use much more than 250LB for the rear spring on stock Koni yellows (for mainly street use). And I wouldn't lower the car more than 0. 75 to 1".

I've had Konis on an ITR with stock springs, 360/380, 600/440, 440/513, and 440/250.

The stock springs rode really nicely. 440/250 is semi comfortable. The 360/380 was OK. 600/440 and 440/513 rode like dogshit.

I may use 350/250 for the street and then swap rear springs to 440 for the track.

I would not say that Koni yellows are a "comfortable" shock. Especially after 250LB in the rear. Unless you broaden your definition of comfortable. Good shocks with lots of versatility, though.

Sticking with european shocks, you can also check out Bilstein B8's mated to stock ITR springs...or mild lowering springs.

KW's ST line is affordable and they ride great. The shock valving from the sets I've experienced is really well set for street and track use.

Tein Street Flex is actually a very nice riding, high quality setup as well.

Todd00

Keep the OE spring balance, or somewhere close to it if it is primarily a street car. Since stock is 250/250, going to rates like 350/350 would keep basically the same balance while being a bit stiffer/flatter around the turns. And that rate is well within the OTS Koni yellow shock valving. Max on the Konis is 600lb springs, but you'd need to be close to the stiffest setting to make that work--that's why folks who run higher rates then set their shocks down notice a bad ride.

And yeah, don't lower anymore than one inch with more mild springs and stock length Konis.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

OTS Konis are good for 600LB springs in the same way as a stock shock would be good for a 450LB spring Lol. It works very badly. I wouldn't say that they can handle a 600LB spring on stock valving. Its very under damped. Thats why my 600LB springs are sitting on the ledge in the garage instead of on the car.

Koni yellows are made as a sport shock for all civics and integras. There is no special ITR part number that has more valving or a shorter length. Yes...I know the rears are "special", but they are the same part number as for a 88 CRX.

The stock ITR already has about 100-150% more rear spring rate than a regular civic. And is already about 1" lower than a stock civic/integra.

Koni describes the valving to be stiffer than stock by some amount...and they allow for about a 35mm (1.38") drop even though they are the same length as stock.

If you're looking to increase the spring rate 300-600% over the stock civic/integra value.....you're going to feel it. And you're likely outside of the realm of the shock's design.

After lowering an ITR about .75" or so...you are left with 1.5" of TOTAL shock travel up front. I'm not talking shock to bumpstop. I'm talking shock to tophat.

Koni also describes the ride to be something like "acceptable" or "reasonable". Not "comfortable". Big difference. Their FSD line has "comfort" written everywhere, in comparison.

If OP is looking for comfort with Koni yellows....use them with stock ITR springs on the STOCK perch height.

If he wants to lower it, dont lower it more than 0.75"....and do something like the OTS 380/250 setup. The reason for the staggered rate is to keep the front suspension from bottoming out (250LB is too soft to lower the front by 0.75")....while keeping it comfortable by not increasing rear rate from stock.

The rear suspension has good travel. The front is somewhat limited.

And no...you cannot stiffen the shock to help keep the suspension from bottoming out. Stiffening up the damping a rebound-adjustment-only shock will result in bottoming out the shocks even more.

The advantage is that you're able to tune the damping around a wide array of springs. Generally speaking, rebound damping and spring rates have direct correlations. Softer spring = softer damping.

Koni/GC is a great setup in terms of part quality. But its important to note that the user is responsible for a large part of the engineering and trial and error. Which is why most Koni/GC setups ride/work like **** No offense to anyone...but its true. There are some people in the suspension forum who share this sentiment. And I get people to admit in person that their home-brew setup rides like ****. Nobody seems to want to admit it on the internet though. I, however, am not afraid to admit it...my ITR rides like absolute ****. And that's fine if the car's emphasis is to be more hard edged and versatile rather than comfortable.

A matched spring/shock package is much more foolproof if it is bought from a reputable company with real world R&D based design.

Todd00

Correct, and what you said has been hashed out on the forum for the past 15 years. But to simplify it, GC + Konis are a fantastic combo as long as you cater them to what you want. Simply, if you car is a DD and you want a decent ride, then don't go too high on springrates (especially the rear) and don't lower too much. It's pretty simple.

The beauty is in the flexibility of the GC/Koni setup in that you can send the Konis off to get revalved/shortened if you decide to get more "serious", then a simple springrate change is all that's needed to go from a DD suspension to a track suspension.

My comment about the "max" springrate OTS Koni yellows will handle is from the Koni techs. 600lbs is "feasible", but only if the shock is on its stiffest setting. But, in no way did anyone say that was optimal--by any means.

Still, I have seen cases where an ITR with 500lb springs in the rear rides relatively good, as long as the damper is matched to the springrate. Really, the damper is the key to all of this (assuming the car has enough travel and is not bottoming out on the bumpstops).

As OP found out, even with a mild setup like the lowdowns--once the damper/shock goes then ride gets really poor.

97CWITR

Going to go with a 380/250 OTS koni/gc setup. I enjoy driving around with good ground clearance and will have a finger gap between the tire and fender.

Anything has to ride better than this right now...

Todd00

You will get a nicer ride and the car will feel "flatter" in the corners, but you might notice a loss of oversteer when pushed hard. Upgrade your rear sway to compensate (if you haven't already).

mikzsan

I know this thread is old, but if OP is still around, would you be able to help with the exact procedure you followed to fix your issue. Having the same issue.

Thanks

97CWITR

Haven't been on here in a long time and randomly saw this come up.

It seemed as they were blown so I bought koni/gc setup.

dave7

That's too bad. Is there really no way to rebuild the mugen struts?

97CWITR

Call kingmotorsports

Seedc2

iTrader: (1)

No, they cannot be rebuilt