It has been identified as a problem recently that there are too many non-ITR specific threads. Let's discuss what is and what is not appropriate.

Although the ITR is unique, it shares many parts with and is directly compatable with Gen 3 Integras.

The following lists are not written in stone or complete.

Acceptable in Dogginator's Mind:
1) Tech related threads for factory ITRs
2) ITR part identification threads
3) Discussion of B18C5 and B18CR engine performance and modification that is directly applicable to ITRs (Putting a B18C5 into any DC2 or DC4 will usually satisfy this requirement. This forum has the expertise on the B18C5 and B18CR engines.)
4) ITR specific community threads
5) ITR build and rebuild threads

Unacceptable in Dogginator's Mind:
1) Fitment of ITR parts into non-ITRs
2) FS, WTT, WTB beyond the stickied threads at the top.

Feel free to comment and add to the list. It is a bit rushed and far from complete, but you all seem to want to discuss this now.

 

Posting your painted PY, FMB, NHBP, CW, MR, ect, LS or GS-R or any lower trim in the Official color threads, or anwhere in the ITR forum is not acceptable. Or any other Integra that has been made to clone the way an Acura with the first eight digits of the VIN JH4DC231 was made, is also not acceptable, because it's not an ITR as bad as the poster may want it to be, no matter how close the clone is to DC2 ITR spec.

 

You always seem to dodge my posts or questions directed towards you, so this case will probably be no different, but..

I agree, keep your LS/GS/GSR out of the ITR specific picture threads.

I rarely see questions from people attempting to "clone" an ITR. Cosmetically speaking, that is a simple task. Generally, people are using ITR specific parts for the added performance benefit. Regardless of the chassis somebody intends to use, a B18C5 is still a B18C5 and questions can be best answered by fellow owners. If it's beneficial to the collective effort to establish/maintain/update a database of information specifically related to the ITR or it's OEM parts, it belongs here, IMO.

Is this a tech forum intended to focus on ITR related research? Or, is this a forum for ITR owners where anything goes, as long as you own an ITR?

 

I agree with no clone picture threads.

Now clone tech threads are a different story if the tech is directly applicable to an ITR. For example, "what is a good header choice for a B18C5 in my DC4" is a technically pertinent question to the ITR community, as there is no technical difference between the two chassis for the point of the question. Quite simply, the answer would not change at all if the chassis VIN started with JH4DC231.

 

I quoted myself from the other thread because i feel it's just as relevant. I bolded what i feel is the most important issue.

If you are asking what header is best for your b18C5 in your DC4,CRX,Civic...etc.. that is why we have the All Motor forum. If you are wondering if you should turbo your b18c5 swapped civic that is why we have the Forced Induction forum. If you are wondering what you need to put an ITR 5 lug setup on your integra, that is why we have the suspension forum. ETC... ETC...

 

The only part I disagree with is the DC4, because for the given framework, the chassis are identical and the technical result is directly pertinent to ITR owners. The others should centainly be in their respective chassis forums, hybrid, all motor, etc. forums.

Would a dyno from a B18C5 swapped DC2 GSR be applicable to the ITR community?

 

The hayday of this section is long gone. It had nothing to do with the thread topics but yet the people that occupied /zeroforum/8. The ITR section almost had a charter that it could run OT or whatever but it always stayed relevant to the community and not the car itself. Personally I never had much of an interest to venture out of the ITR section to socialize with all of the jdmfanboy kids with shitty grammar.

 

Would that be the same question as 'Would a dyno from a B18C5 swapped 3 Gen Integra be applicable to the ITR community?' Not just DC2 GS-R? But like we discussed in the other thread, Us as ITR owners share the same intrests as those with non-ITR Integra's with B18C5 swaps, though we tend to hesitate on answering questions with those kind of parts in a chassis that isn't an ITR because they were most likely stolen at one point..

 

100% agree. The ITR forum should not be a "catch-all" for any and all ITR parts. We have other forums--USE them; that's their purpose.

If someone puts a B18C5 in their whatever, then ask all-motor or hybrid. It's not like we're going to learn anything new here when it comes to B18C5 headers that isn't in the archives.

Dogginator, do you understand the theft issues with ITR's and how many of the folks here it has impacted? I don't think any of the older members will put up with newbs asking random questions about sketchy B18C5 swaps, nor should we make it easy for thieves or folks who purchase these parts.

 

As far as dyno numbers/results/tuning it would be similar, but would still technically belong in the all motor forum/hybrid/FI or whatever the case may be, regardless of the similar chassis design.

The thread title would likely read "Dyno Results From My Type R swapped Integra" or something similar. If the title wasn't a giveaway surely what's inside would be. You let stuff like that go on, you may as well give the forum to the CATS.

 

This. That community kept this place on topic when it needed to be and under control when it wasn't. All the tech about these cars was here and there was a plethora of people willing and wanting to help those that needed it. The tech of this site has always been within the people that occupy it. Unfortunately, most of that is gone now with only what remains hidden in the archives to carry that on. It seems that this new crop of ITR owners is just taking this place way too seriously and spending most of their time bitching because they don't think someone who doesn't have the right VIN should be allowed to exist here. It's been joked about for over a decade now that ITR owners are elitist ********, but it's finally becoming less of a joke and more of the truth.

I agree with most of what you've suggested in here Dogginator and stuff that is pertinent to ITRs and ITR owners is definitely acceptable even if it does exist in a non-R. I just don't see the need to really lay out guidelines for what is and isn't allowed here.

I've owned an R before, but its heart now resides in my LS. Am I now an outcast? Just doesn't make sense to destroy the draw of this forum (the people that are the tech in honda-tech) and ensure that that community that has always made this place valuable will not want to bother. (not aiming that at the OP, but at the attitude of the bulk of threads/posts I've seen here lately).

 

IIRC it may have been you that was at the ITR meet last June with your LS, no one told you to GTFO (aside from the fact you've been friends with most of the people for a long time anyway)

Had you been some random weird dude coming up to everyone asking us how you can put ITR parts on your LS it may have been a different story, one of suspicion and annoyance. Think of it that way. Just my .02

 

I'm not really worried about myself, but I'm just saying making these sorts of guidelines IMO is just turning this place into more of an over-regulated library than a useful forum full of people enjoying cars and sharing info about them. We all do this because we love the cars and have fun with them. This is the ITR forum and it should have ITR information, no question, but kill the fun and enjoyment of it and run off the people that make it fun and enjoyable and what are you left with? a cold empty forum with a handful of people talking about the same old chit that's been talked about for years with the occasional new owner coming in to ask about their new car and everyone telling them to **** off and search.

maybe I'm alone on this, but I highly doubt it.

 

So they should use the All Motor forum? In that case, SO SHOULD ITR OWNERS! Same with the turbo question, even ITR guys that want turbos are correctly directed to the FI forum, but not for header choices and crap like that. That's not really what All Motor is for. At least last time I checked it was more dedicated toward NA build techniques and internal engine components, but I haven't read it lately.

To paraphrase my point, as it's been since this forum was started in late 1999: If the topic is relevant to ITR owners then it belongs in the ITR forum. Doesn't matter which chassis, etc. Otherwise as an ITR owner I'd have to search 10 different forums to gather the best opinion/options for something specific to the ITR, which is just plain stupid. Everything that is relevant to ITRs (it, ITR interior, brakes, engine, trans, etc) should be in here.

Hell, back in the "golden days" I would post issues/questions about my GS-R and people would answer them. The few who would object would always be told to STFU. Why? Because I was "OG"? Yet, when unknowns would post ITR part specific questions they would get flamed. Some even got answered first before they mentioned it was a swap, then shunned when they said it was a swap later.

It shouldn't make a difference as long as the information is useful to ITR owners, period.

 

What about JDM swaps? While most are likely stolen as well, I've always thought it was funny that no one seemed concerned about that, even ITR guys who blew up their engines would put a JDM swap in at times.

Anyways, a B18C5 dyno, regardless of chassis, which parts lists, tuning info, etc is 100% relevant to ITR owners. How in the heck could it not be?

 

100% with Dave-ROR and Erik above.
...
I think some people need to remember it's just a car and not let it get to their head (and to the keyboard apparently too). Like I said, if these are the kind of people who are the "new" ITR community, they can start planning ITR Expo after this year. I don't want to keep doing it for a group that is not welcome to new people. I owned a GSR for almost 10 yrs, have been working with Expo for a majority of that time, and never once was told that I wasn't welcome. I have a feeling that if I entered into this today with the same situation, I would flamed and kicked out by crabby people behind a screen.

Maybe I'm getting too old for all this, but it seems that some people should grow up a bit. Life's too short to make enemies and skip the chance to meet some great people. This community is harsher than the NSX or S2K communities I've read. That's not a good trend.

On a positive note, the people who have been around and are welcoming are arguably some of my best friends to this date. They...are the reason I struggle yearly to setup Expo with a few others.

 

Why is a B18C5 Dyno or what not allowed here just because it's in a JH4DC231 chassis? How in the world is the information not DIRECTLY relevant to an ITR owner looking for information on cams, etc. The greatest thing about this forum in the past was that you *COULD* find all of that information in *one* spot, not 3-4 different forums. Kinda seems *** backwards to make people post ITR part specific information in multiple forums. If anything, that just means you should remove the ITR forum because it losses it's purpose.

 

Why do you keep bringing that up? I think EVERYONE has agreed that swap fitment/requirements questions do NOT belong here, yet you constantly bring that up as evidence for a completely different topic.

 

As a ZF global mod and a vB super mod, one would think I know a thing or two about thieves and determining the legitimacy of parts. I see no problem in asking for block stamps, etc. My car has only has two ITR unique parts on it: the front shock tower bar and the intake camshaft. The camshaft was purchased first-hand by me in 2000 from the Honda dealer in Nagasaki. The bar was purchased from Yahoo auctions in Japan.

 

The people that I met at Expo 9 all seemed well founded and it was a great time. Many of the R owners were drooling over my parts.

 

I stole my ITR exhaust out of Asspenny's garage, and stole his ITR shiftknob. Tempted to drive a few hours can grab his spoon calipers too, but since that's not an "ITR part" that's ok anyways

 

There's a fine line between what belongs and what doesn't...

If I have a suspension question about my R, does that mean that I should post in the suspension section? Same goes with questions about my motor, if Im boosted, if I autox etc...so then what can we post?

So the only thing that we could post here would be old R brochures, motortrend video's from the 90's, and who's car just got stolen?

All non-R content should be removed like pictures, swap questions etc...

If someone comes on here and has a question about their b18c5, I say we help them (even though somedays I think the only way you should post here should be to enter your VIN number when you log in...)

 

you should really be talking about that in the brake forum....

 

What about tech threads for gen 3 universal parts that have a greater interest to ITR owners? For example, the FLP shifter.

 

That pertained to drivetrain as well, i just wasn't being specific.

Erik, the point i was making was NOT directed specifically at you or anyone in general. It was to make the point that no one is unwelcome, atleast i don't feel that way.

Guys, let's just stop for a second. Take the "ITR Forum" COMPLETELY out of this. Is it OK to post about your Accord in the Prelude Forum? Is it OK to post about your NSX in the S2000 Forum? Is it OK to post about your 88-91 Civic/CRX in the 92-2000 Civic/Del Sol forum? Hey while we're at the "chassis similarites" should 94-01 Integra swap questions belong in the 92-2000 civic forum? What if heaven forbid they were to put a b16a2 from a 99-00 Civic Si in their integra, or a b16a3 out of a del sol, is it NOW relevant to that forum?

This isn't about who is who, it's about what is what.

There should be no enemies made from this, regardless of whether they own an ITR or not, hell i don't care if they own a peugot. This is a place where ITR owners/enthusiasts can talk about ITRs, not ITR swaps in other chassis's.

Like i said, it isn't a big deal it's just about saving some of the sanctity of honda-tech, it's already taken a major blow. Atleast if we can keep this forum under control we can help weed out the very reason why i like this forum so much, no 16 year olds that spell "one" by replacing it with "1" and "you're" with "ur".

Anyway, there's no reason to get upset about anything, in fact, i'm all for breaking a guinness world record at Expo 10, for worlds largest group hug

Note: In 2009, what's clearest is the very deep and abiding pride that the local residents have in their city which is why, on Friday, 29 May, nearly 10,000 citizens of Alba Iulia and its surrounding townships gathered in a circle stretching over 3.4 km (2.1 miles) and literally embraced their city. It was the largest group hug ever recorded by Guinness World Records™