b16? in an integra?
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From: Lunatic Fringe, ATX
Re: b16? in an integra? (RockyMtnTEG)
I'm going to answer the OP's question, instead of getting caught up in a worthless debate...
A turbo B16 will propel an Integra plenty well. Just think of a turbo Si.
There may be other solutions, but yours will work, and be fine.
There may be other, faster solutions too.
IF you have another engine to start with, it is worth considering a turbo non-vtec setup.
VTEC is NOT the end all, be all of Hondas. Especially once a turbo is factored into the equation.
Good luck with your setup, and don't buy into the anti-B16 hype.
A turbo B16 will propel an Integra plenty well. Just think of a turbo Si.
There may be other solutions, but yours will work, and be fine.
There may be other, faster solutions too.
IF you have another engine to start with, it is worth considering a turbo non-vtec setup.
VTEC is NOT the end all, be all of Hondas. Especially once a turbo is factored into the equation.
Good luck with your setup, and don't buy into the anti-B16 hype.
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From: Hamden, ct
Re: b16? in an integra? (Madness)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Madness »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm going to answer the OP's question, instead of getting caught up in a worthless debate...
A turbo B16 will propel an Integra plenty well. Just think of a turbo Si.
There may be other solutions, but yours will work, and be fine.
There may be other, faster solutions too.
IF you have another engine to start with, it is worth considering a turbo non-vtec setup.
VTEC is NOT the end all, be all of Hondas. Especially once a turbo is factored into the equation.
Good luck with your setup, and don't buy into the anti-B16 hype.</TD></TR></TABLE>
THANK YOU!!! Do what you want to do, nobody has to know whats under the hood b16, b18, h22 or fred flintstone! do you're homework, build what-ever motor and call it a day!
(personally I would buy a b16 head, complete gsr short block, take you LS crank, buy some forged LS rods and pistons put those into the gsr block,gsr tranny, hondata, p28 ecu, and turbo that) but again thats me, not worrying about what other people are going think or OVER ANALYZE!!!
A turbo B16 will propel an Integra plenty well. Just think of a turbo Si.
There may be other solutions, but yours will work, and be fine.
There may be other, faster solutions too.
IF you have another engine to start with, it is worth considering a turbo non-vtec setup.
VTEC is NOT the end all, be all of Hondas. Especially once a turbo is factored into the equation.
Good luck with your setup, and don't buy into the anti-B16 hype.</TD></TR></TABLE>
THANK YOU!!! Do what you want to do, nobody has to know whats under the hood b16, b18, h22 or fred flintstone! do you're homework, build what-ever motor and call it a day!
(personally I would buy a b16 head, complete gsr short block, take you LS crank, buy some forged LS rods and pistons put those into the gsr block,gsr tranny, hondata, p28 ecu, and turbo that) but again thats me, not worrying about what other people are going think or OVER ANALYZE!!!
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From: Tacoma, WA, United States
Re: b16? in an integra? (H Twenty Teg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by H Twenty Teg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
More LINEAR, less PEAK.
Who said I like to roll on race? I have a 12 second car thats slicks and 55 shot. Since its NA with LSD with a small shot, its not that much slower on street setup w no juice. Unlike turbo, who would drop a whole second from slicks. So therefore I prefer drag racing/dig.
Please point me to the way.
All I know is as long as I been in Hondas (about2001) LS has been the motor that people get just to say "I have a B series" and they open the hood, you see an LS, and you go "pfft" and walk away. That was a while ago. Maybe LS has more respect now?
Either way if someone shows me 2 white EJ8 one with a LS and one with a B16, I'll take the B16. Or 2 of the same car. Even an 94+ Integra.
Yeah, thats right, even if I was a fan of LSVTAK, (which I'm not if you want 1.8 liters get a GSR dammit) I would want the B16 more, why?
Useful B16 parts in a LSVTEC:
Head, pistons, transmission
Useful LS parts:
block
If you use LS pistons or tranny, your ***** going be as slow as stock LS anyway. And in my old EJ1 with a B16A with AUTO CAMS and a LS tranny, I ran down a LSVTEC DA with LS pistons and tranny.</TD></TR></TABLE>
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by H Twenty Teg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
shut up boi. Look up dyno of turbo LS an B16, stock motors, t3/t4.
Peak wins on the freeway, which is basically the only place turbo FWD Hondas should run anyway, unless you like 13.5's at 120 MPH...</TD></TR></TABLE>
Uhmm, you just stated that you would keep your B16 over the LSVtec, yet you still ramble on the parts of an LSVtec motor. You really need to organize your thoughts and make some sense. Not only that, but you stated that using the LS pistons makes the LSVtec car slow. NO ****! Why do you think people swap in P30's into their swap
? Ever hear of compression?
Just because your rice car smokes someone driving a faster car than you doesn't mean squat. For all I know, the person that you were racing against could be some 80 year old lady with her cat hanging between her legs. Heck, if I was cruising and shifting at 3K rpm too, I might, just might, lose too.
More LINEAR, less PEAK.
Who said I like to roll on race? I have a 12 second car thats slicks and 55 shot. Since its NA with LSD with a small shot, its not that much slower on street setup w no juice. Unlike turbo, who would drop a whole second from slicks. So therefore I prefer drag racing/dig.
Please point me to the way.
All I know is as long as I been in Hondas (about2001) LS has been the motor that people get just to say "I have a B series" and they open the hood, you see an LS, and you go "pfft" and walk away. That was a while ago. Maybe LS has more respect now?
Either way if someone shows me 2 white EJ8 one with a LS and one with a B16, I'll take the B16. Or 2 of the same car. Even an 94+ Integra.
Yeah, thats right, even if I was a fan of LSVTAK, (which I'm not if you want 1.8 liters get a GSR dammit) I would want the B16 more, why?
Useful B16 parts in a LSVTEC:
Head, pistons, transmission
Useful LS parts:
block
If you use LS pistons or tranny, your ***** going be as slow as stock LS anyway. And in my old EJ1 with a B16A with AUTO CAMS and a LS tranny, I ran down a LSVTEC DA with LS pistons and tranny.</TD></TR></TABLE>
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by H Twenty Teg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
shut up boi. Look up dyno of turbo LS an B16, stock motors, t3/t4.
Peak wins on the freeway, which is basically the only place turbo FWD Hondas should run anyway, unless you like 13.5's at 120 MPH...</TD></TR></TABLE>
Uhmm, you just stated that you would keep your B16 over the LSVtec, yet you still ramble on the parts of an LSVtec motor. You really need to organize your thoughts and make some sense. Not only that, but you stated that using the LS pistons makes the LSVtec car slow. NO ****! Why do you think people swap in P30's into their swap
? Ever hear of compression?Just because your rice car smokes someone driving a faster car than you doesn't mean squat. For all I know, the person that you were racing against could be some 80 year old lady with her cat hanging between her legs. Heck, if I was cruising and shifting at 3K rpm too, I might, just might, lose too.
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From: Lunatic Fringe, ATX
Re: b16? in an integra? (god of war)
Me personally, I think it could be kind of fun to have a B16 turbo integra.
I'd let everyone know that it "only" has a B16.
Of course, it would "only" have 500+ hp too ..... but I'd keep that to myself.
Thats about as sleeper as a turbo teg could be.
I'd let everyone know that it "only" has a B16.
Of course, it would "only" have 500+ hp too ..... but I'd keep that to myself.
Thats about as sleeper as a turbo teg could be.
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From: Hamden, ct
Re: b16? in an integra? (LilKrnThugBoi253)
[If you use LS pistons or tranny, your ***** going be as slow as stock LS anyway. And in my old EJ1 with a B16A with AUTO CAMS and a LS tranny, I ran down a LSVTEC DA with LS pistons and tranny.
QUOTE=LilKrnThugBoi253]
Wow i want to know how you ran down another LSvtec, if your running the same set-up? And from this statement that you made, you can't launch or you just happen to happen to catch up to one that was unaware that they were in a race!
Oh and my LSvtec has the stock LS pistons and stock gsr has no problems against Type R's, but that probably because i have a JDM ITR Tranny with LSD and a 7.5lbs flywheel. I must be cheating!
QUOTE=LilKrnThugBoi253]
Wow i want to know how you ran down another LSvtec, if your running the same set-up? And from this statement that you made, you can't launch or you just happen to happen to catch up to one that was unaware that they were in a race!
Oh and my LSvtec has the stock LS pistons and stock gsr has no problems against Type R's, but that probably because i have a JDM ITR Tranny with LSD and a 7.5lbs flywheel. I must be cheating!
Re: (igopsss)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by igopsss »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">k20 over everything for and honda/acura</TD></TR></TABLE>
shut up..noob.
shut up..noob.
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From: Margaritaville, USA
Re: (Lewy. Dee Ayy)
This debate will never end, just like the Joe Montana-Dan Marino debate. What do you like more? Super bowl rings or flashy records? Similar to.. what do you like more low end power or high end power?
In the world of cars the ruling factor will always be displacement, but that only matters to the car enthusiasts who plan on going ***** out on a motor. The powerband on an LS is much more even on a B18B and if you just want a daily driver that feels pretty beefy then go for that. If you want a motor that makes its power up top, and want respect in DA HOOD with your VTEC, go for a B16.
When you slap a turbo on either motor the torque is going to be so much higher in relation to everything that a 13tq difference between the motors isn't going to even really matter anymore. A B18B without turbo has ~127tq and a B16 without turbo has ~113tq, that 14tq difference is a lot bigger than when they are turbo'd and the B18B has 230tq and the LS has 215tq, but the B18 will have about 260hp versus the B16s 310hp (These are rough numbers assuming you use a medium sized turbo don't murder me over them, it's just an example). You also have to take into account that the B18 will spool a same sized turbo a little faster than the B16 as it is a bigger motor.
IMO a Turbo stock B16 will out perform a Turbo stock B18 simply because you will have much higher hp, and only slightly less torque. Once you turbo either setup it's going to feel fine either way, but LS-Ts are pretty cool cars to see around, especially with some head work you can make up the difference. Sometimes having a non-VTEC Turbo set up can be a blessing as when mixing Turbo and VTEC it does require a little more tuning.
Moral of the story: Do what ever you want as the power and price aren't going to be that far apart once you run FI on either motor, just don't street race.
In the world of cars the ruling factor will always be displacement, but that only matters to the car enthusiasts who plan on going ***** out on a motor. The powerband on an LS is much more even on a B18B and if you just want a daily driver that feels pretty beefy then go for that. If you want a motor that makes its power up top, and want respect in DA HOOD with your VTEC, go for a B16.
When you slap a turbo on either motor the torque is going to be so much higher in relation to everything that a 13tq difference between the motors isn't going to even really matter anymore. A B18B without turbo has ~127tq and a B16 without turbo has ~113tq, that 14tq difference is a lot bigger than when they are turbo'd and the B18B has 230tq and the LS has 215tq, but the B18 will have about 260hp versus the B16s 310hp (These are rough numbers assuming you use a medium sized turbo don't murder me over them, it's just an example). You also have to take into account that the B18 will spool a same sized turbo a little faster than the B16 as it is a bigger motor.
IMO a Turbo stock B16 will out perform a Turbo stock B18 simply because you will have much higher hp, and only slightly less torque. Once you turbo either setup it's going to feel fine either way, but LS-Ts are pretty cool cars to see around, especially with some head work you can make up the difference. Sometimes having a non-VTEC Turbo set up can be a blessing as when mixing Turbo and VTEC it does require a little more tuning.
Moral of the story: Do what ever you want as the power and price aren't going to be that far apart once you run FI on either motor, just don't street race.
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From: Margaritaville, USA
Re: b16? in an integra? (H Twenty Teg)
Not to be an ***, but Flywheels don't make your car faster. Lighter flywheels actually cause faster RPM drops between shifts. It seems that this topic has spawned into a B16 vs B18 vs LSVTEC thread. The OP asked about stock applications. OP also said he doesn't want to do an LSVTEC setup, and I can't really blame him.
Modified by ABCVTEC at 1:16 PM 5/31/2007
Modified by ABCVTEC at 1:16 PM 5/31/2007
Joined: Mar 2007
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From: Hamden, ct
Re: b16? in an integra? (ABCVTEC)
I know your not being an ***, but a lighter FW does help you get to your mid and high RPM ranges faster where it matters in hondas although it does as you said make your rpm drop faster too!
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ABCVTEC »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Not to be an ***, but Flywheels don't make your car faster. Lighter flywheels actually cause faster RPM drops between shifts. It seems that this topic has spawned into a B16 vs B18 vs LSVTEC thread. The OP asked about stock applications. OP also said he doesn't want to do an LSVTEC setup, and I can't really blame him.
Modified by ABCVTEC at 1:16 PM 5/31/2007</TD></TR></TABLE>
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ABCVTEC »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Not to be an ***, but Flywheels don't make your car faster. Lighter flywheels actually cause faster RPM drops between shifts. It seems that this topic has spawned into a B16 vs B18 vs LSVTEC thread. The OP asked about stock applications. OP also said he doesn't want to do an LSVTEC setup, and I can't really blame him.
Modified by ABCVTEC at 1:16 PM 5/31/2007</TD></TR></TABLE>
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From: Lunatic Fringe, ATX
Re: b16? in an integra? (god of war)
Actually, although a lighter flywheel won't make your car faster, it will make it quicker, because there is less rotating mass to accelerate. It is very similar to the effect of lighter wheels.
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From: Margaritaville, USA
Re: (Lauj87)
Oh please. The compression difference between a B16 and a B18 is only .6:1 depending on which specs you compare. You can more than make up for that with a better tune. Also the B16 internals are much better than the B18s and can handle more boost just because of that.
The only thing the B18 has on the B16 when it comes to FI is that it is a large motor so it will spool the turbo a little quicker, and if you're lazy you only need one map for the turbo since the B18 is a non-VTEC motor.
The only thing the B18 has on the B16 when it comes to FI is that it is a large motor so it will spool the turbo a little quicker, and if you're lazy you only need one map for the turbo since the B18 is a non-VTEC motor.
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From: DFW, TX, USA
an internally stock b16 turbo will or at least should be making more power than an internally stock LS turbo
to the OP its really your choice...both motors have potential...theres always going to be people who are biased against the other
to the OP its really your choice...both motors have potential...theres always going to be people who are biased against the other
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From: somewhere up north, WA
Re: (Emg)
isnt h 22 teg the same guy with the salmon color car?
rice
and so are your debating skills
"mAD vTaK yO " wtf
and with the whole "cutting corners" on LS/B20vtec ...hybrid swaps are ment to be tested...cutting corners are only if you wanna be fast.....people have the option to either build it reliable, or fast....maybe even both if you got the money.
but tell me this....why would someone do a mini me swap? its obviously not ment to be, but it has the ability to beat LS's and b16s....and if you build it right...it can be reliable, and fast
rice
and so are your debating skills
"mAD vTaK yO " wtfand with the whole "cutting corners" on LS/B20vtec ...hybrid swaps are ment to be tested...cutting corners are only if you wanna be fast.....people have the option to either build it reliable, or fast....maybe even both if you got the money.
but tell me this....why would someone do a mini me swap? its obviously not ment to be, but it has the ability to beat LS's and b16s....and if you build it right...it can be reliable, and fast
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From: Lunatic Fringe, ATX
Re: (spideymangDC4)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by spideymangDC4 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">isnt h 22 teg the same guy with the salmon color car?
rice
</TD></TR></TABLE>
WTF? No, He's not. Now STFU.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by spideymangDC4 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
and with the whole "cutting corners" on LS/B20vtec ...hybrid swaps are ment to be tested...cutting corners are only if you wanna be fast.....people have the option to either build it reliable, or fast....maybe even both if you got the money.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Again WTF? The expression is "Cheap, Fast or Reliable. Pick Any Two."
Cutting corners if you want to be fast?
Where did you come up with y0uR MaD D-Bate sKillZ y0?
rice
</TD></TR></TABLE>
WTF? No, He's not. Now STFU.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by spideymangDC4 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
and with the whole "cutting corners" on LS/B20vtec ...hybrid swaps are ment to be tested...cutting corners are only if you wanna be fast.....people have the option to either build it reliable, or fast....maybe even both if you got the money.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Again WTF? The expression is "Cheap, Fast or Reliable. Pick Any Two."
Cutting corners if you want to be fast?
Where did you come up with y0uR MaD D-Bate sKillZ y0?
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From: Lunatic Fringe, ATX
Re: (Emg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Emg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I had an Si motor in my 94 teg Ls and it SUCKED sooooo bad but never got around to boosting it I reaked it one and a half months later.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I'm pretty sure everyone agrees that stock LS's and B16's are turds. Thats why there have been 3 pages of discussion about turbos.
I'm pretty sure everyone agrees that stock LS's and B16's are turds. Thats why there have been 3 pages of discussion about turbos.
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From: Modesto, ca
Re: (Emg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Emg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I had an Si motor in my 94 teg Ls and it SUCKED sooooo bad but never got around to boosting it I reaked it one and a half months later.</TD></TR></TABLE>
u prob had a LS tranny or poor driving...
u prob had a LS tranny or poor driving...
