Civic44

As some of you may know, we have a new series in Quebec this year called the Echo Cup http://www.echocup.com/. The car used is the Toyota Echo 2-door hatch (aka Yaris, aka Vitz). The series is a success as over 25 cars were sold (already prepped when you buy them) and there are usually over 20 cars at each event. For those who are wondering, ot one of them has flipped over yet! The spec of the car is quite simple: aftermarket springs, 16-inch Dai wheels with Pirelli P-Zero Corso, AEM intake, non-stock muffler, brake pads. That's it! The other mods are for safety. The cars are not gutted and most are street registered (sounds alot like the old Honda Michelin series, doesn't it?).

Well, after seeing them race, practice, and having instructed many of the drivers, I finally got a chance to take one of them out for a few laps yesterday as Stephane Trahan, owner of TRAC Racing Depot let me take out his own personal car:


The four Racing Depot cars.

Anyway, I thought it was quite a fun car. It had surprising acceleration, considering it's only a 1.5 and it just feels right (not unlike my old 1.5 1988 Honda Michelin Challenge Civic just felt right). The handling is good, although there is alot of body roll. The car rotates extremely well and even someone unfamiliar with the car can steer with the throttle with confidence. Think of it as a much taller CRX. I can see Echo Cup owners are having a blast with these cars. As in all one-make series, you really have to wring the car out if you want to win. It's not uncommon to see these cars on two wheels (I think in my few short laps, I had it briefly on two wheels after riding the turtles). So over all, I think the car is surprisingly fun on the track and easy to drive. I think it would make a great enduro car as well. For one who can afford it, it would be ideal to have one of these and a "real" race car for other events so that you could be sure you've always got at least one track car available to you.

To summarize: two thumbs up.

Honda318dx

Sweet!!!! Sounds like a good time!

kablamo

looks like a lot of fun

i had heard about the echo cup while in quebec, how many race venues do they have?

you said you were an instructor for some of the drivers...do you teach at a track regularly? (Mt Tremblant?)

Civic44

The Echos run at St-Eustache, Sanair, the Trois Rivieres GP (street course) and Tremblant.

Currently, I'm an instructor at the TLC lapping club at St-Eustache and the weekend schools that TRAC Racing Depot holds 4-5 times a year, also at St-Eustache. I've never instructed at Tremblant, as the only clubs that go there much are Prosche and BMW clubs, of which I am not a member. If someone wants to do HPDE at Tremblant, there is a Jim Russell event coming up August 9th for 395$CAD.

Sean O'Gorman

Why don't we get those Echos here?

jsi

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sean O’Gorman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why don't we get those Echos here?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I guess Toyota figures that there is no market for such a small car in the US. I mean this thing is tiny by today's standards. As small as the Echo sedan is already, this thing is like 2 feet shorter. Imagine an 8-10 inch taller CRX and you get the idea...

Historically, for a long while at least, Canada has a much stronger market for smaller cars, and especially so in Quebec. Mostly due to higher gas prices.

These are fun and peppy little cars. With some good shocks and springs to control rollover tendencies, these would make excellent STS cars for Solo2. If Toyota brings them to the US, i'm setting one up for STS. I dont feel like buying one only to run Canadian events as it would fall in DMOD at SCCA events right now.

jsi

And did I mention they are really cheap? Like $10,000USD for the 3-dr base hatch (not the echo-cup version)...

CRX Lee

Gee, I wonder if they would be interested in performance dampers for them. We have a really good Echo/Yaris Koni Sport that I'd bet would make a nice handling improvement for little money. Who organizes the series? Is there any single vendor who supplies parts to them?

When we did the R&D test confirmation on the Echo, we used my stepmother's Echao sedan automatic. I was honestly amazed at what a great all around little car package that it was. As much as the car guy in me wanted in advance to hate it, I'd say for commuter kind of utilitarian use it has to be one of the best all around packages that I have seen. It was sharp and nimble, not horribly underpowered actually for what it is, roomy, etc. and the gas mileage is obscenely high. So long as you keep it in context and don't mistake it for a hot rod, I think you'd be hard pressed to be very critical. That same week we had the BMW E46 M3 in for testing too and I can honestly say the Echo's stock suspension was a better match to the car then was the M3's stock suspension.

Civic44

The series is overseen by the Quebec Auto Federation and is pretty much run on its own. They're sponsored by Pirelli and other companies, but AFAIK, there is no company that makes shocks among the sponsors and no official supplier of all parts (although you might say Toyota Canada is the official supplier as the cars are bought at Toyota dealers ready to race).

typer_801

Check out the weight on these...

Looked a 2 door Echo up on Edmuds and came back with a curb weight of 2035. Not bad, then did the same with a 1990 Civic Si and came back with 2291. Gulp!

Is this the new potential challenger to the Civic in STS?!? Weighs less than a Civic, same 108hp. Sounds like it has some potential.

kablamo

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Civic44 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The Echos run at St-Eustache, Sanair, the Trois Rivieres GP (street course) and Tremblant.

Currently, I'm an instructor at the TLC lapping club at St-Eustache and the weekend schools that TRAC Racing Depot holds 4-5 times a year, also at St-Eustache. I've never instructed at Tremblant, as the only clubs that go there much are Prosche and BMW clubs, of which I am not a member. If someone wants to do HPDE at Tremblant, there is a Jim Russell event coming up August 9th for 395$CAD.</TD></TR></TABLE>

395$ ?? what a deal!!

Why is it so cheap? I was hoping to go sometime in september, and i was ready to pay 595$... is this a one-time deal or what?

Evan55

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sean O’Gorman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why don't we get those Echos here?</TD></TR></TABLE>
I believe they are the same car as the Scion Xa

Crack Monkey

xa = 4 door.

Civic44

There is no version of the Echo hatch in the USA. 395$ is for one day, during the week I believe. The events that cost 595$ are for two days or weekends.

black3door

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sean O’Gorman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why don't we get those Echos here?</TD></TR></TABLE>

the same reason why we canucks don't get the ZZW30 (MR2) up here:

corporate stupidity

Knestis

Canadians get all the cool one-make series. It's telling that Trahan has abandoned the WC Touring effort for four of the Toyotas. I'll bet you that at least two of them are customer rentals, making the math work out WAY better for the team.

K

Civic44

K's right, one car is for Steph, one is for his brother JF and the other two are customers/fellow racers racing under the TRAC Racing Depot banner.

BTW, Steph still has the WC Beetle and two of his mechanics now own the other two ex WC cars (one of them, Yves Bedard, was Quebec GTU champion with the Golf III in 2003 and has since removed the VR6 to put in a 20-valve N/A 2.0 liter... I thought you would appreciate that ).

FormulaIntegra

From my Gran Turismo days, I was always under the impression that the Vitz was the JDM inception of the USDM Toyota Matrix. I guess I was always wrong.

AKADriver

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by typer_801 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Looked a 2 door Echo up on Edmuds and came back with a curb weight of 2035. Not bad, then did the same with a 1990 Civic Si and came back with 2291. Gulp!</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well, it depends how it's ordered. That 2035lb is with manual steering and no A/C. These things can add up quickly. I'd order mine without, but it's a thought.

Of course I can't get the hatch, because Toyota hates us. I'd love to own this car, though. Almost 45mpg without the aid of whizbang technology or diesel fuel! I'd replicate that cup suspension setup, throw in some decent seats, and go terrorize the streets in my wee beastie.

I can't wait until the Honda Fit/Jazz sees US shores. Mugen has already shown they can take a K-series.

jsi

Vince, any idea on what the cup-cars actually weigh in race-trim?

Civic44

They weigh 2300 or 2350 with driver, I forget which, but it's a minimum weight.

CRX Lee

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Civic44 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The series is overseen by the Quebec Auto Federation and is pretty much run on its own. They're sponsored by Pirelli and other companies, but AFAIK, there is no company that makes shocks among the sponsors and no official supplier of all parts (although you might say Toyota Canada is the official supplier as the cars are bought at Toyota dealers ready to race).</TD></TR></TABLE>

I checked out the website it is all in the funny furrin Frainch writin' sO I couldn't make sense of any contact info. I know that Trac Racing in Montreal has sold Koni for many years but my last contact is no longer there.

Can you suggest a contact at either place? If Trac both were active participants and dealers, then we might have a better shot it for next season.

Knestis

S. Trahan is a nice guy, it seems. I had some correspondence with him through VWVortex. A cold call fact-finding mission wouldn't likely be a problem if you can't find a know-who.

K

kablamo

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FormulaIntegra &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">From my Gran Turismo days, I was always under the impression that the Vitz was the JDM inception of the USDM Toyota Matrix. I guess I was always wrong. </TD></TR></TABLE>

nope Vitz = Yaris = Echo hatchback.

The Scion xA is based off the same platform (so is the xB), but it's not the same car.

Knestis

The Yaris is FIA homologated but with a 1300cc engine. Are we sure that the Canadian one is a 1.5?

K