EJAYATE

Why are there no %100 copper intercoolers? I make copper heat exchangers all day for various uses, and decided that I'm going to make a nearly 100% copper IC. I plan to use gold foil for the fins. Is there any reason besides cost that I shouldn't do this?

ScorpioMk

weight?


Marcus

QuangAlang

The specific heat capacities of Al, Cu, and Au are different...

jzz30

weight.
copper is about 3 times heavier than aluminum

chimmike

Uh, I thought that expense was the more concerning factor, more so than the weight of copper. Aside from the fact that every thief in your area will be homing in on your copper IC. That and copper will corrode quickly in that environment.

EJAYATE

The whole reasoning was smaller package and side mount with the same capabilities of a larger front mount style.

chimmike

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EJAYATE &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The whole reasoning was smaller package and side mount with the same capabilities of a larger front mount style.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I don't think copper is going to be that much more thermally efficient for you to decrease the size that much and expect it to be as effective as a larger aluminum IC.

EJAYATE

Intercoolers with just copper fins are usually 6-8% more efficient than ones with Al fins. I'm playing with a different fin design that I think will transfer the heat better than this style/\/\/\/\/\/\. Where the points touch the plates it will be flat so there is more surface area on the plates. [][][][][][][][][][][] is what im going for.


Quick question. I know that silver conducts electricity better than gold, does it also conduct heat better?

chimmike

the fins in the /\/\/\/\/\/\ design is for airflow through the intercooler, not for contact cooling. Those little super thin fins don't act as the heat exchanger elements as much as make sure the air flows smoothly through and between the turbulators.

EJAYATE

Al
Thermal Properties
Coefficient of thermal expansion @0-100C ( x10-6 K-1 ) 23.5
Latent heat of evaporation ( J g-1 ) 10800
Latent heat of fusion ( J g-1 ) 388
Specific heat @25C ( J K-1 kg-1 ) 900
Thermal conductivity @0-100C ( W m-1 K-1 ) 237

Cu
Thermal Properties
Coefficient of thermal expansion @0-100C ( x10-6 K-1 ) 17.0
Latent heat of evaporation ( J g-1 ) 4796
Latent heat of fusion ( J g-1 ) 205
Specific heat @25C ( J K-1 kg-1 ) 385
Thermal conductivity @0-100C ( W m-1 K-1 ) 401

Ag
Thermal Properties
Coefficient of thermal expansion @0-100C ( x10-6 K-1 ) 19.1
Latent heat of evaporation ( J g-1 ) 2390
Latent heat of fusion ( J g-1 ) 103
Specific heat @25C ( J K-1 kg-1 ) 237
Thermal conductivity @0-100C ( W m-1 K-1 ) 429


Au
Thermal Properties
Coefficient of thermal expansion @0-100C ( x10-6 K-1 ) 14.1
Latent heat of evaporation ( J g-1 ) 1738
Latent heat of fusion ( J g-1 ) 64.9
Specific heat @25C ( J K-1 kg-1 ) 129
Thermal conductivity @0-100C ( W m-1 K-1 ) 318

jzz30

a copper intercooler isnt all that out of this world of an idea. remember when every car had a copper radiator? it must have been cost which made everyone change. but still it is heavier.
try make a greddy type R intercooler for a supra in copper that thing would weigh like a 120 pounds!!

HiProfile

The problem with copper is not just weight, but for an FMIC, corrosion. It will first tarnish blackish, then parts will corrode cyan-greenish. And since the fins are very hard to polish...it would be very ugly. Silver is just too expensive, as well as heavy. The 'crazy' people who watercool their computers use silver waterblocks.

Aluminum has the very thin oxide coating that doesn't corrode easily, is light, and decently conductive thermally. THe other thing is you can just increase the size and fin density on the aluminum FMIC to come close to that of a copper-based FMIC. You also can get greater strength at the same weight, since you can use much thicker walls. A cheap copper/silver FMIC would either weigh a lot, or be paper-thin and be torn open by a small rock.

FYI the fins aren't /\/\/\, they are supposed to be U^U^U (straight up, 180* curve, straight down, 180* curve, etc) with small serations about 3/8" from the leading/trailing edge to help create turbulance. Believe me when I say they've optimized the design for the best balance of pressure drop and turbulance, at least on spearco/garret/precision/etc cores.

carchitect

Gold is not a better conductor than silver. Gold plating is used on enhancing a corrosion proof connection in important connectiors , like air bag systems , to ensure a good contact for a prolonged periods of time.

Copper is the second best electrical conductor. Silver is the best but it tarnishes and the cost is significantly higher than the second choice.

As far as the heat conduction goes I'm not so sure. It could be found in the thermal properties data.

Shawn C

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by carchitect &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Gold is not a better conductor than silver....</TD></TR></TABLE>
i thought gold was a better conductor than silver......
if you could keep a copper i/c blingin, it would def be cool, though

digdug18

because the price of copper is soo high right now, someone will steal it just for the value of it as scrap metal...

90blackcrx

Why are people mentioning weight, weight up front is not always a bad thing.

Not saying copper is better to use here, but I know some people want more weight up front.

HiProfile

In very few cases does extra weight help. You gain some better 60ft's in the 1/4 mile, but after 1st gear it costs you. For auto-x you only use extra weight to cross-weight you car. A couple lbs dead center in the front bumper will not help at all in a FWD car (unless its the course was designed for go karts, super short w/sharp corners).

I'll add a turbo kit on my car and take the 60lbs penalty for 200-400% increase in power, but I won't add 20lbs+ for a 5% increase, especially for what it would cost. AFAIK, professional racers don't use copper or silver intercoolers.