JDMCivic95EG

I have a 95 Honda Civic EG 4dr Sedan, looking to replace the old stock rear lower control arms, not sure what kind to get, meaning a good name brand and does it matter what kind? Second, what sway bar thickness and subframe setup to get? Currently it is all stock, I already have lowering springs, just want it to ride nice. Any advice or suggestions? Thanks!

1998GsRIntegra

Lowering springs on stock shocks? If thats the case, you'll likely never get it to ride "nice" unless you put the stock springs back on. I previously had H&R sport lowering springs on stock replacement kyb gr-2 shocks and stock 16 year old bushings all the way around. For what it was, the car rode ok. Now, every bushing is a spherical bearing or solid bronze, I'm using race valved koni yellows, gc coils with 750lb springs in the front and 850's in the rear. ASR subframe brace and a stock itr rear sway bar. The car honestly rides better over small bumps now than it did before.

ej6fade

The ONLY aftermarket lower control arms to consider are Function7. Aside from that, the only quality option is keep your OEM lca's and get new bushings. Don't buy blox, junk2, megan racing, etc. All of that stuff is trash; buy once, cry once. As far as springs, riding on stock shocks is bad news. Buy some progress CS-IIs or Koni/GC, or put everything back to stock. For a daily driver (im assuming, correct?) its hard to say because a "nice ride" is a matter of opinion. Max I would say 500/lbs fr/rr, but do research. From what I have seen, most common set ups for Daily drivers range between 300-400fr/200-400rr, but again, do research. Sway bar options are all a matter of the user/driver and varies greatly by personal preference and goals. Do you want just enough sway bar to get rid of some body roll, or do you want your car to feel like it rides on rails? If you want all the body roll virtually gone, go with a big front/rear set up that compliments your spring rates, don't just buy the most expensive ones because you think that will automatically work best. Do you want neutral handling? oversteer bias? understeer bias?

Research, research, research

JDMCivic95EG

Yeah, I have Eibach prokit lowering springs on the stock shocks, had them on for 3 years now and still drives great, I store the car in the garage over winter so its basically mint summer driving. I replaced all the bushings possible and have no had a problem, drives nice. Im looking for the right setup meaning, what rear lower control arms to get, plus install a sway bar kit. I need a subframe brace if I got with a bigger diameter sway bar, I heard if you don't you will tear out the rear brace of the car from the driving and force over time.

JDMCivic95EG

I have eibach springs like I mentioned to 98gsr above, and yes riding on stock shocks have no problems. I replaced all bushings, only have lowering springs installed thats it. Rides really nice to my comfort, I only drive it in the summer, the car gets put away for the winter in the garage. I just want to stop the body rolling in the rear when I take a ramp fast, my rear end slides..i want it to be rigid and hold onto the road without the body roll. My question is, I know you mentioned function 7 rear lower control arms little expensive, I seen some on e-bay for $65-70 free shipping. with the 3 holes in the arm for adjust the sway bar. Now the subframe, which would you guys recommend along with a sway bar aftermarket of course. Thanks for all the advice and input, I appreciate it.

Kozy.

If your rear end is sliding out it's got **** all to do with the suspension. Put some decent tires on it before you do anything else.

ej6fade

I didn't see the post about the Eibach springs until now, so you should be fine on stock shocks. If you really want to ride on rails, my suggestion would be a 26mm CTR front sway bar or a 25mm ITR, and ASR rear 24mm sway bar, ASR spherical endlinks, and an ASR subframe brace. I have the ASR rear sway bar kit, ASR quality is top notch and I promise you wont be disappointed. Blackworks racing quality is iffy at best, so I would stay away. Function7 makes a rear subframe brace that is supposed to be top notch, and they have quality products, but I have no personal first hand experience there. If the ASR 24mm sway bar is too much, you could also pick up like a 22mm rear sway bar from the CTR or similar. Other companies also make quality sway bars, Eibach, Suspension Techniques, Whiteline, etc. The issue then becomes what spring rates do you have? Do you want more oversteer, understeer or neutral steering (50/50 approx.)? Sway bars should compliment your spring rates and driving style, not the other way around. More over steer is smaller bar front/bigger bar rear, more understeer smaller bar rear/bigger bar rear, but this again is affected by your spring rates. You need some new tires if you are sliding around, buy some sticky summer tires.

In regards to the lower control arms, the issue is quality control. My senior project for my Bachelors at Devry, my team and I developed a 346 page business plan for opening up an e-commerce based aftermarket import car parts retailer. After doing tons and tons of research, the issue of quality control is even more important to me now than before. Many lower control arms are made of T6061 or T7075 aluminum, but not all metal is created equal. are all the imperfections in the metal removed, or is it cast/forged/CNC'ed with minimal strength/integrity? torture/strength test of their products? real R&D or did they just copy another company's design and sell it without making sure it is safe? is it safe? will the company stand behind their product? The cheaper lower control arms, there is no way to tell how good they are. Same with bushings. Blox bushings are awful and never last long, and while you CAN replace the bushings, do you really want to pull em off and fix it a few months just after installing them? They may last 10 years but just need new bushings, or they may snap 2 weeks after putting them on your car in a hard turn. The point is, do you want to find out? haha. Follow the rule I learned in the firearms community: buy once, cry once. There is no replacement for quality. I would say Hardrace and PIC also make good lower control arms that are less expensive, but in the aftermarket Function 7 is still the best set up. My car is mostly a daily driver, but my suspension is worth about $3,000. It is 10 times worth it compared to the cheaper route, and you will be much happier with the end result.

JDMCivic95EG

Yea I get where your coming from. I just want a 50/50 ride in the rear, just have a nice sway bar with lower control arm setup. Nothing way to expensive but still yet does its job. What do you think of the rear lower control arms I posted up above, there about $80 and have adjustment holes for sway bar link positions instead of the other control arms without the holes.

JDMCivic95EG

I have new tires with not even 100 miles on them, brand new nitto 450 195/50/R15's they drive and handle great. That's not a issue, what I meant by sliding is when I take a turn hard I get the read end to roll little, that's why Im looking for a nice sway bar setup in the rear. Looking for good rear lower control arms for start, then sway bar and subframe...

ej6fade

If you really want to go the inexpensive route, get Blox lower control arms and just get new bushings; IIRC Blox lower control arms can usually be had for under $120. I would still say save up and don't cheap out. I wouldn't trust my life to any "ebay" parts.

JDMCivic95EG

Yea I might save up some money and get the better ones with
polyurethane bushings. For now I'll drive around with the stock ones. Thanks for the advice thou!

egsleepercivic

start out with oem LCA of any 94-01 integra except for type r and a 14mm gsr bar, no reinforcement needed, if you need more you can upgrade the rear bar to type r spec and throw on an ASR subframe brace, hard to beat OEM

you can probably get the oem lcas and rear bar and brakets for $100 or less at a junk yard or craigslist. you can also use an ls bar but the older ones I believe are 13mm vs 14mm

ej6fade

No problem

This is actually not a bad idea. You can always start small and go bigger. For the rear bar, i started at 13mm civic SI in the rear, no front. Improvement, but it sucked imo. Then got the CTR 22mm rear, then it felt too rear biased. Got the ITR 25mm in front, definite improvement, but then the rear felt lacking. There was a big difference between the 22mm vs 24mm sway bar in the rear, the 24mm was definitely an upgrade in my own experience and driving style, my car is approximately 55% front/ 45% rear bias (butt dyno), very close to neutral. I have found the 25mm ITR bar in front and the ASR 24mm rear is absolute perfection with my 450fr/350rr koni/gc set up while eliminating virtually all body roll and my car rides on rails. OP also emphasized want of aftermarket control arms which is why I negated OEM lca's from further discussion.

OP, a lot of testing set ups and finding what works best for you starting small or you can just start big, that decision is completely up to you.

jvr

If by "the rear end slides" you mean it's oversteering, then a thicker rear sway bar is just going to make the problem worse. If you have a super stiff rear sway bar, the back end will slide out if you lift off the throttle too abruptly going into a corner. Apologies if you meant something else but it sounds like you're describing oversteer.

ribal_gh

hey man,

i am really wondering what is missing in my set up!
I got koni/GC 430f/300R with 26mm front bar and 22mm rear bar on my civic si 00. (lowered about 1.5 inches)

I was expecting a neutral handling car when recently upgrading the rear bar from 13mm to 22mm but the result was terrible.

The car is hell over steering, it is really feels unsafe to drive and always feels like the tail wanna loose traction.

IS there any main issue that i can look after ?

thx

ej6fade

loose traction? what kind of tires do you have? good sticky tires are a must!
I almost always exclusively run Yokohama S-Drives for my daily set of wheels, but I was strapped for cash last time I bought tires, so I decided to try Hankook Ventus V2 Concept H437 in 195/55r15 since they were on sale at America's Tire for $330 installed + tax, so far I love em, great traction dry and wet.

My set up:
Koni Yellows/Ground Control Coilovers, 450fr/350r
shocks 75% stiff front/50% rear for DD
Not sure on exact drop, no gap (not tucking) front, 1 finger gap rear
Neuspeed front strut bar
NRG front H-Brace,
Private Label rear X-bar
ITR 25mm front sway bar w/ Hardrace bushings & endlinks
ASR 24mm rear sway bar w/ ASR spherical endlinks & subframe brace
Function7 lower control arms
Buddy Club rear camber kit
Hardrace rear trailing arm bushing
All new bushings throughout (Hardrace/OEM) all hard rubber, no poly.
I run -2 degrees of camber all around, 0 toe, stock setting for caster.

It is interesting that you have stiffer lbs/rate in the front and a larger sway bar yet have over steer, I haven't heard of that issue before. How are all of your bushings, new, ok, bad? condition of endlinks? is your alignment up to par? condition of tires? Can you tell if it is your car or is it throttle control? I'm guilty of putting off new tires on my last set, rear end swung out and I spun out on a big residential canyon road, flat spots on all 4 tires, never again will I let tires get that bald haha.

ribal_gh

nice reply bro.

Well i am sure that the ride got worse after upgrading the rear bar.
Also i crashed in the into the side walk and damaged my front lip and bumper.

I got same ride height as urs.
I am running 195/55 R15 toyo t1r (2.5 years old) tread is ok.
about -2 front camber and -3.2 rear camber, i wanted to reduce the rear camber but i read that less rear camber will induce over steer so i didn't do any adjustment!

oem end links and bushings are in a good condition.
It is worth getting Hard race bushing kit? will the difference be well noticeable!

ladies_first

"Do you want just enough sway bar to get rid of some body roll, or do you want your car to feel like it rides on rails? If you want all the body roll virtually gone, go with a big front/rear set up that compliments your spring rates, don't just buy the most expensive ones because you think that will automatically work best. Do you want neutral handling? oversteer bias? understeer bias? "

Is there anyone that can "dumb that down" for me ...
i have 95 eg coupe and i wanna change the suspension all around . this IS the research im doing , but bc im XP level is at a 10 right now im completely clueless to what those terms above mean. Im looking towards suspension improvements bc the previous owner put lowering springs on stock suspension and the ride is TERRIBLE. any other advice relating to this would be appreciated.

ladies_first

"Do you want just enough sway bar to get rid of some body roll, or do you want your car to feel like it rides on rails? If you want all the body roll virtually gone, go with a big front/rear set up that compliments your spring rates, don't just buy the most expensive ones because you think that will automatically work best. Do you want neutral handling? oversteer bias? understeer bias? "

Is there anyone that can "dumb that down" for me ...
i have 95 eg coupe and i wanna change the suspension all around . this IS the research im doing , but bc im XP level is at a 10 right now im completely clueless to what those terms above mean. Im looking towards suspension improvements bc the previous owner put lowering springs on stock suspension and the ride is TERRIBLE. any other advice relating to this would be appreciated.

ej6fade

I'm sort of stumped as to why your car would have so much oversteer. Not sure about the less rear camber causing oversteer; it affects handling but I can't see it really doing that unless wheels were at positive camber, maybe someone more knowledgable than I can chime in? When you crashed did it just affect lip/bumper or did it throw your car out of spec, or slightly bend a LCA or something?

As far as the hard race bushings, I would definitely say it is worth it, my car felt more responsive, but I admit my OEM bushings on my car were only in OK condition when I replaced them

ej6fade

There is no need to post the same thing in multiple threads.

I'll be nice since I am in an educational mood. Neutral handing is when the car feels, neutral, 50/50 balance between the front and rear. Oversteer is when the rear of the car wants to slide out in a turn (tail happy rear). Understeer is when the front of the car is harder to turn in a corner, it feels as if it will keep going straight, more or less, as opposed to turning the corner.

"Understeer and oversteer are vehicle dynamics terms used to describe the sensitivity of a vehicle to steering. Simply put, oversteer is what occurs when a car turns (steers) by more than (over) the amount commanded by the driver. Conversely, understeer is what occurs when a car steers less than (under) the amount commanded by the driver."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Understeer_and_oversteer-------




Understeer: the car does not turn enough and leaves the road

--------




Oversteer: the car turns more sharply than intended and could get into a spin

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Sway bars affect body roll on your car, reducing it by increasing sway bar size, or increasing it by decreasing sway bar size. Size of the sway bar affects how the car handles, and should be chosen according to what springs/coilovers/shocks you have depending on their spring rate, how you want your car to feel, and what the purpose of the car is. Smaller sway bars = less body roll but still some there, big sway bars = much less body roll. Having a bigger sway bar on the rear can increase oversteer, or having a bigger sway bar on the front can increase understeer, everything depends on YOUR individual set up, use, and preferences. This is not a "one size fits all" answer, and anyone that tells you that imho is leading you wrong. Many people may have the same exact set up, with the same exact parts, with the same exact spring rates/sway bar sizes, etc., BUT everyone has their own driving preference/style, and only YOUR perfect set up can be found by YOU through testing parts/set ups accordingly.

Occulus

Hi guys,
I'm new to Honda-Tech and I've already read a lot of threads about swaybars and set-ups.
But still I can't seem to find the info I'm looking for.
I own a '97 coupe ej6 with a 22mm front swaybar and I want to place a rear swaybar. I already have an asr brace on the way which will be fitted very soon. But I just don't know what size rear sway I need. Bigger or smaller than the 22mm front one. I'm just looking for a bit of better handling.
All tips are welcome.
Thnx!

grumblemarc

iTrader: (4)

Define "better handling"!!!! I don't know what "better handling" means to YOU. No one does! After this whole thread, which you didn't read, you need to provide much more info. Do you want more oversteer? Understeer. A more neutral feel? What? How is this car being driven? Track? Daily? What?

In the future try to ask more informed questions.

Occulus

Okay maybe I wasn't that clear. I want more oversteer, the car is driven daily and I don't give jack about comfort seeing as I'm the only one who ever rides in it. (girlfriend has a bad back)

GagnarTheUnruly

iTrader: (3)

ITR rear is a no-brainer.