imzjustplayin

http://www.slate.com/id/2182076/

Is this person a dumbass? This article has "written for and by the dumbass masses" written (I know a pun) all over it. For one thing, I have seen vehicles perform better with premium fuel than regular despite what the owners manual says. For a vehicle to get better mileage on premium over regular would seem to suggest that running that vehicle on premium would reduce the # of HC being emitted because of more complete combustion. Also last time I checked, people ran premium fuel in their vehicles before getting smog checked in order to pass their tests.

inspyral

The article is essentially correct. You don't gain any direct performance benefit with higher octane fuel, it just has a higher resistance to pre-ignition or detonation than lower octane ratings(octane rates resistance to burning, not energy potential). Any increase in fuel mileage associated with running higher octane fuel than recommended can usually be attributed to changes in driving style, which alone can affect fuel economy by up to 20-30%, rather than the fuel itself. Actually, running a higher octane rating than needed results in a less complete burn, and therefore higher emissions since the combustion process isn't burning all the fuel in the cylinder. As such, your last assumption is also inaccurate, since most people will run lower octane fuel prior to emissions/SMOG testing.

imzjustplayin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by inspyral &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The article is essentially correct. You don't gain any direct performance benefit with higher octane fuel, it just has a higher resistance to pre-ignition or detonation than lower octane ratings(octane rates resistance to burning, not energy potential). Any increase in fuel mileage associated with running higher octane fuel than recommended can usually be attributed to changes in driving style, which alone can affect fuel economy by up to 20-30%, rather than the fuel itself. Actually, running a higher octane rating than needed results in a less complete burn, and therefore higher emissions since the combustion process isn't burning all the fuel in the cylinder. As such, your last assumption is also inaccurate, since most people will run lower octane fuel prior to emissions/SMOG testing.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You are absolutely wrong. Just read this thread and my replies: http://genmay.com/showthread.php?t=793451

teg_95

i don't understand a damn thing. i have a stock ls and i usually run 93. but this time i put 2 gallons of 110 on a full tank. im not worried about smog test or anything im just kinda wherry about the life of my motor. so my question is, if i run a higher octane (93 that is) then the car is called for, i know it will hurt my wallet, but will it hurt my motor?

imzjustplayin

Well it has been said that E85 will hurt seals that aren't designed for them, causing them to fail and will also oxidize aluminum. So if you're getting that high octane value from alcohol, then it may be a problem, otherwise you're probably not getting the performance benefit unless you modify the ECU settings.

teg_95

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by imzjustplayin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well it has been said that E85 will hurt seals that aren't designed for them, causing them to fail and will also oxidize aluminum. So if you're getting that high octane value from alcohol, then it may be a problem, otherwise you're probably not getting the performance benefit unless you modify the ECU settings.</TD></TR></TABLE>

to tell you the truth i got the 110 octane for a local gas station. it was a Mobile gas station. you know like the oil, mobile. considering the fact i got it from a gastation does it still have the alochol. and that one time will it hurt?

imzjustplayin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by teg_95 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">to tell you the truth i got the 110 octane for a local gas station. it was a Mobile gas station. you know like the oil, mobile. considering the fact i got it from a gastation does it still have the alochol. and that one time will it hurt?</TD></TR></TABLE>
I have no idea, but in california and I think the rest of the united states, stations are putting E10 into all the fuels in order to meet emissions standards. I don't know how you got 110 octane fuel from a station unless it's designated as "racing fuel" only, you're in another country, or they just put a bunch of xylene in the fuel in order to attain that octane rating.

teg_95

yea im in south Carolina. and the pump said "racing fuel". but by the actual pump, it said "110 octane, leaded fuel" so will that one time hurt?

imzjustplayin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by teg_95 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">yea im in south Carolina. and the pump said "racing fuel". but by the actual pump, it said "110 octane, leaded fuel" so will that one time hurt? </TD></TR></TABLE>Leaded fuel? First of all they don't even sell leaded fuel anymore, especially in the developed world and secondly leaded fuel will [freak] up any car made in the 70s or later. I can't imagine that is leaded fuel but if it is (which it shouldn't since they dont' make it in the US or any developed country for quite some time) then you'll destroy your catalyst and O2 sensors and probably the engine itself as it's not designed for it.

teg_95

so pretty much since i ran those 2 gallons my motor is F****d?

imzjustplayin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by teg_95 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so pretty much since i ran those 2 gallons my motor is F****d?</TD></TR></TABLE>That must be a really old pump for it to say it has leaded fuel in it. Maybe you should go to the station and ask the guy if they really do have leaded fuel in there. I can't imagine them selling leaded fuel since most of the cars on the road today (including race vehicles) use unleaded fuel. Just go to the station and ask the guy if they really do sell leaded fuel there as indicated by the pump.

ddd4114

It seems to me that you have all the answers. You've outsmarted all of us and proven that higher octane fuel improves power and fuel economy all by itself. Good job. What is the point of this thread?

imzjustplayin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ddd4114 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It seems to me that you have all the answers. You've outsmarted all of us and proven that higher octane fuel improves power and fuel economy all by itself. Good job. What is the point of this thread?</TD></TR></TABLE>Usually when people make threads such as this, they're looking for people who know more about the subject than they do.
This is akin to someone asking about a terrorist attack and saying, "Hey, does anybody know what happened to those people in the bus that blew up?" With everybody responding, "What bus? What happened? There was a terrorist attack on a bus?" and you say, "Yeah, there was a terrorist attack on a bus just last night, didn't you hear?" with their reply being, "oh no, I had no idea, so is everybody alright?" and with you saying "I don't know, that's why I was asking you!".

teg_95

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by imzjustplayin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That must be a really old pump for it to say it has leaded fuel in it. Maybe you should go to the station and ask the guy if they really do have leaded fuel in there. I can't imagine them selling leaded fuel since most of the cars on the road today (including race vehicles) use unleaded fuel. Just go to the station and ask the guy if they really do sell leaded fuel there as indicated by the pump.</TD></TR></TABLE>
i mean the gas station was built maybe 2 months ago, because me and my friend went to go pick up a pack of cigarettes and i noticed it and we went and look at it.

ddd4114

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by imzjustplayin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Usually when people make threads such as this, they're looking for people who know more about the subject than they do.
This is akin to someone asking about a terrorist attack and saying, "Hey, does anybody know what happened to those people in the bus that blew up?" With everybody responding, "What bus? What happened? There was a terrorist attack on a bus?" and you say, "Yeah, there was a terrorist attack on a bus just last night, didn't you hear?" with their reply being, "oh no, I had no idea, so is everybody alright?" and with you saying "I don't know, that's why I was asking you!".</TD></TR></TABLE>
If you're trying to gather information from people via online forums, it's not advisable to criticize them and say they're "absolutely wrong".

imzjustplayin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by teg_95 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i mean the gas station was built maybe 2 months ago, because me and my friend went to go pick up a pack of cigarettes and i noticed it and we went and look at it. </TD></TR></TABLE>Well apparently leaded fuel is still being used in fuels that are 100+ octane but using that with your street car will definitely screw it up so I advise you to stay away from it.

TunerN00b

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by imzjustplayin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well apparently leaded fuel is still being used in fuels that are 100+ octane but using that with your street car will definitely screw it up so I advise you to stay away from it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes. Lead was removed from pump fuel to allow catalytic converters to be used. The lead in the fuel destroys the catalyst within the converter, rendering it useless quickly.

For a race car without smog equipment, the lead is a benefit to the engine and valves. For a street car, it will result in an expensive repair bill.

teg_95

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by imzjustplayin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well apparently leaded fuel is still being used in fuels that are 100+ octane but using that with your street car will definitely screw it up so I advise you to stay away from it.</TD></TR></TABLE>
thanks man. but will that one time screw it up?

imzjustplayin

How many miles do you have left on the catalyst?

teg_95

i dont have a cat?

K2e2vin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by imzjustplayin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

You are absolutely wrong. Just read this thread and my replies: http://genmay.com/showthread.php?t=793451

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Actually he's right. You should look it up and it makes sense. The only way you're getting more power is if you're tuning to take advantage of the higher octane(advancing timing). I believe not much cars do this(I know that some, or maybe all, newer Subarus do).

Most people that need to run higher octane are those vehicles that are more prone to detonation with lower octanes.

Check out "Gasoline FAQ" by Bruce Hamilton.


Modified by K2e2vin at 1:01 PM 7/29/2008

TunerN00b

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by teg_95 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
thanks man. but will that one time screw it up?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yes, 1 tank of leaded fuel will destroy a catalytic converter.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by teg_95 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i dont have a cat?</TD></TR></TABLE>
If you don't have a cat, then you don't have a legal street vehicle, and don't need to concern yourself with this.

teg_95

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TunerN00b &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Yes, 1 tank of leaded fuel will destroy a catalytic converter.


If you don't have a cat, then you don't have a legal street vehicle, and don't need to concern yourself with this.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
sorry man, i didnt know thats what it affected. just wanted to see how it ran, and wanted to read up on it.

NmaynarD

In south carolina we don't have emissions... THANK GOD!!! So it's street legal in SC.

imzjustplayin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by K2e2vin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Actually he's right. You should look it up and it makes sense. The only way you're getting more power is if you're tuning to take advantage of the higher octane(advancing timing). I believe not much cars do this(I know that some, or maybe all, newer Subarus do).

Most people that need to run higher octane are those vehicles that are more prone to detonation with lower octanes.

Check out "Gasoline FAQ" by Bruce Hamilton.


Modified by K2e2vin at 1:01 PM 7/29/2008</TD></TR></TABLE>

But even vehicles that do not necessarily knock on lower octane fuel and the manual says "87 recommended", it does not mean they're incapable of benefitting from higher octane fuel. This point was already explained in the thread I linked to.