EJ8Squad919

Ok i came down to getting honda type 2 coolant and redline water wetter. I have a fully built ls vtec with all new components and want my new water pump to last. How should i mix the honda coolant and redline? Use the whole bottle of redline?

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

Whole bottle redline than 60/40 ish mix 60 water 40 coolant.

h22apwrd95

iTrader: (1)

Justin, I will agree that the shroud only comes into play when the fan is running, but it makes the fan that much more efficient when it is running. My fan is still cycled by the OEM switch. I have not used Neptune as an override for it. I am just amazed at how short the cycles are to pull heat out of the system back down below the activation point on the OEM switch.

spAdam

iTrader: (1)

Just for fun, the ten commandments for maximum cooling from Griffin:

1. Thou shall make room for an adequate cooling system in the design of your engine compartment.
First things first. When planning your performance vehicle, remember that you're building it to drive, not to sit and steam. Plan adequate space for the cooling system including the radiator, fan, shroud, over flow tank and mounting brackets. Talk with a cooling specialist to help you size the system for your vehicle, engine and driving habits. Consider the investment compared to the total cost of the car.

2. Thou shall shroud thy radiator when using a fan.
Fans move air through the radiator assisting in cooling the engine. A fan without a shroud is better than no fan. But, consider this. At idle or cruising speeds, you need the entire cooling system working at its optimum. An unshrouded fan is moving air through only the portion of the radiator equal to the surface area of the fan. For example, on a '32 Ford, the area of a 15.50" fan is about 189 sq. in.; the core of the radiator is approximately 371 sq. in. This means that almost 49% of the unshrouded radiator is not receiving any benefits of the fan. Shrouding your radiator lets the fan pull air through the entire core.

3. Thou shall use an electric fan.
Rule of thumb. Only choose a mechanical fan over an electric fan if it's your farm tractor. An electric fan is preferred because when you need a fan the most (at idle or cruising speeds) an electric fan is delivering maximum air independent of engine RPM's. Fans that move 2000-2300 CFM's are worth the investment. Preference should be given to a "pull" vs. a "push" fan. Mounted on the engine side of the radiator, a pull fan does not interfere with air flow at highway speeds. All shrouded fans should be on the engine side of the radiator.

4. Thou shall consider airflow or how a radiator cools.
Without adequate air flow, a radiator is just a reservoir for hot water. Coolant transfers heat to the tubes; the tubes transfer heat to the fins; air moving through the fins dissipates the heat from the radiator. You need sufficient openings to the radiator that channel adequate air to the entire surface of the radiator. You must have a radiator design that allows the air to pass effectively through the radiator (wider and taller is better than thicker). You must consider how the heat will be evacuated from the engine compartment.

5. Thou shall use the proper water pump pulley ratio.
To obtain the maximum operating efficiency rate for your water pump at highway speeds, you should overdrive the pump by 30-35%. Check your pulley selection. Most after market pulleys are a 1:1 ratio. For a 30-35% overdrive, the crank pulley should be approximately 7 7/8" and the water pump pulley approximately 5 3/4". This overdrive provides proper coolant flow from the engine and through the radiator.

6. Thou shall consider the effects of the pressure cap.
The higher rated the pressure cap, the hotter the water has to get to boil. One pound of pressure raises the boiling temperature 3°F. A 16-pound cap raises the boiling point to 268°F. If your engine is designed to run at 200°F, a 14-16-pound cap should be sufficient. Running a higher pressure cap to prevent boil over is putting a band aid on another problem that needs to be fixed. Higher operating pressure places additional stress on the entire engine system and increases the potential of hoses bursting and possible injury.

7. Thou shall understand the operating temperatures of today's modern engines.
All engines have "normal" operating temperatures. Running engine temperatures well above or below recommended temperatures could cause damage. Most of today's engines operate in the 180°-210°F range. Pollution laws, new oil blends and higher combustion gasoline have forced engine design changes that have increased operating temperatures over the past decade. Consider your engine's normal operating temperatures when selecting your radiator's cooling capacity.

8. Thou shall always use a thermostat.
The thermostat controls engine coolant temperature. It stops the flow of coolant through the radiator until the coolant reaches the thermostat's preset temperature. Operating your engine within its temperature parameters reduces wear, helps control emissions and turns any moisture in the crankcase to steam where it is removed by the PCV system. Select the right thermostat for your engine's operating temperature range.

9. Thou shall protect thy cooling system with recommended coolant.
It is essential to use a premium coolant that protects the radiator, other metal parts and seals. Today's coolants are a scientific blend that normally includes water wetter and corrosion inhibitors. Use of a coolant that contains no silicate is recommended. Silicate is an abrasive and can cause gel formation and water pump failure. A 50/50 mix of coolant and distilled water provides the best overall cooling efficiency. Proper maintenance (regular flushing and changing of coolant) will extend the life of your system.

10. Thou shall spend thy money wisely.
If you are having cooling problems, begin by looking at the least expensive fixes first. 1) Add an electric fan. 2) Shroud your fan. 3) Check your belts and hoses. Slipping belts or collapsed hoses mean trouble. 4) Check your radiator cap. 5) Flush and refill with premium coolant. 6) Use the proper thermostat. 7) Clean the radiator of foreign materials. 8) Overdrive the water pump 20-30%. 9) Check your water pump. Should cooling problems persist, it may be time for a new performance radiator from Griffin. Call the Griffin Customer Service Department at 1-800-722-3723 for assistance in selecting the correct radiator for your requirements.

** WARNING: Improper wiring can cause electrolysis and destroy the radiator. Please make sure radiator is not used as a ground. **

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

That's the advantage to using the software to activate the cooling fans. They come in sooner and stay on longer after the thermostat does it's job. Generally I have mine set to 188 which usually comes in at 190 and turns off at 186. Way better than stock coming on at almost 200 and turning off at 196. Your not oulling enough heat out of the exchanged coolant IMO

Sheet cake style shrouds don't work IMO either. If your not doing a tapered shroud I see no point in using one. Also with a half core radiator running a 13-14" fan will cover just about the complete surface if the radiator thus acting as a shroud. I don't run on due to room constrains and I don't have an issue.

KevinEF7

non taperred shrouds work just fine. I ran a 12" spal and was having heat issues, made a square cake pan shroud and cut the temps drastically.

Im not sure how good they are compared to a tapered shroud, but they are definetely a big improvement over no shroud at all

turbohatch96y7

iTrader: (15)

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

I put one on my setup and it made it worse. Restricted natural airflow through the radiator and I don't run my fan constantly. I did try that and it didn't help any so I took that **** off and just have the 12" fan and it works. My half core radiator I used to run has a 14" Zirgo fan and that fan covers entire surface area so that worked well. Having wider radiator is working out well not even with the one small fan an no shroud.

My car was running got when making back to back passes at IFO but that was a heat soak issue. I've synced wrapped my manifold and dump tubes and got rid of that heat soak now it doesn't get over 205 and comes right back down.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Yea the cake pan shrouds aren't tall enough to let air flow through the core. a 1/4" tall shroud isn't tall enough and ends up restricting airflow through the core even when the fan is on

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

I used an aluminum cookie sheet which is 3/4" depth. Still didn't work. If I had a break and a bead roller I would make my self a nice one. But my setup works. Plenty if airflow and surface area.

KevinEF7

Mine is about 3/4" deep aswell, fan only comes on when Im idling. I used to run the higher end Spal 12" and it flowed an incredible ammount of air compared to the Go-Autoworks cheaper 12" I run now. But the Spal actually annoyed me with how loud it was, really does sound like a jet engine

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

I have the spal 12" on my car. I have the one step below the most expensive unit. Wishing I purchased the most expensive one for the added airflow but this works. My 14" Zirgo would blow the dirt from under the car and would Suck leaves to the intercooler. That thing was a bad bitch lol

ls joker

you guys runnin higher amp relays. im ordering a twelve inch spal tuesday.

my fan died

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

I can probably make you a nice tapered shroud on the cheap out of aluminum. I might make a tapered shroud out of carbon fiber since it's an easy mold to make. plus if I end up using a scirocco radiator I know I can sell them to the vw crowd lol (can you say profit?)

I just need to wait until I get my new manifold and turbo to determine clearance so I can figure out shroud depth/height/thickness, whatever you want to call it and if I can run one fan or two. I think two would be better IMO, smaller fans are cheaper and I can have the ecu run one or both depending on temp and engine load so I don't tax the electrical system so much unless it's needed.

turbo ls, do you have an engine bay pic showing clearance between the radiator and the intercooler inlet/outlet as well as chassis clearance? I'm going to be using Wiggins clamps so I need to get an idea of clearance before I commit to the scirocco radiator. I'm not sure if I'm going to run 2.5" or 3" hot side piping, I'll probably run 3" cold given my huge displacement (almost 2.3l)

Although I know my intercooler wont be as wide as the bumper opening, since a vertical core is more efficient and therefore can be much smaller in height and width. I'll be using carbon fiber plates to take up the space between the intercooler ends and the bumper opening that will have 2 ducts each on either side for my oil and trans coolers as well as brake cooling ducts. hopefully the intercooler allows enough air through to keep the coolant temps in check. I'll use at least 2 12" fans or one 14" fan (spal or zirgo) if I go scirocco.

since I have a 96-00 civic the upper grill opening is going to be an airbox for the turbo inlet, that way I get the coldest intake air possible and thus slightly lower compressor outlet temps ( airbox and intake piping will be coated or wrapped to eliminate any heat absorption through radiation from the intercooler, radiator, and engine) but I can also add a duct to the bottom of the airbox to supply more air to the radiator if the airflow through the intercooler and whatever the fan can pull isn't sufficient.

the front splitter is effectively going to eliminate any airflow reaching the radiator and engine bay from under the car since it will extend under the car to the subframe or more so I think the radiator duct in the airbox might be needed. but since the car will be flat bottomed a good 4-5 inches from the bottom of the unibody I might have enough airflow through the intercooler and engine bay at speed from the vacuum effect through the flat bottom to keep coolant temps in check, it's only sitting and low speed that worries me. the back of the hood is also going to be raised slightly to promote better airflow through the engine bay to keep underhood temps down and thus reduce any radiant heat (at least that's the theory hopefully)

<3

sorry for the long post and semi threadjack but I think it is a good thread to discuss these issues

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

With a high flow fan it's a must. with the high current and amperage draw of most 12"+ flex-a-lite/spal/zirgo fans you must hardwire the fans like you do with high flow fuel pumps.

a high current relay and a minimum of 8-10awg wire is needed to power the fan and to allow the fan to draw the amperage it needs to operate properly. I would personally say use 8awg. it's not too big or too small and should allow sufficient amperage draw regardless of fan operation rpm and airflow.

ls joker

damn i forgot all bout the thicker wiring. what higher amp relay are were you runnin.

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

I out a higher amp fuse in stock location and have been running it this way for 8 years. Lol. Is it correct no but it's working.

ls joker

lol

spAdam

iTrader: (1)

Do Spal/etc give you a wattage in their specs? It's really easy to calculate wire size required once you know power consumption and the length of your run.

turbohatch96y7

iTrader: (15)

This is FI we do whatever we are told

spAdam

iTrader: (1)

Good point. No engineering allowed on H-T, my bad.

KevinEF7

They do give you the amperage rating, most in the honda sizing are 12-17amps

Running a dedicated power on a relay is pretty easy though, using the stock switch to trigger it. To much for the stock circuits safely

m4xwellmurd3r

Im pretty damn happy with my scirocco radiator on My da. Its from an 84 and fits the rad support opening perfectly. I was even able to use the stock bushings on the bottom of the radiator. I had my car idle for around 30 minutes in 90+ degree temps and the fan came on a couple times at 202, then cut off after maybe 30 seconds at 199. Im not boosted yet, its a rebuilt ls with 10.7:1 comp.
Im using a cheap mishimoto fan, and a 25/75 coolant/water mix with water wetter.

Temp gauge never seems to move. Ill have to check the few data logs I have from driving but iirc coolant temps stay real low even after beating on it.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

I can't seem to find a solid core size for the eBay scirocco radiator cores, they all list something different.

the vr6 radiator has the same design as the scirocco radiator as far as the endtanks and the inlet/outlet but it has a slightly larger core



Overall Size: 30.00" x 15.50" x 2.00"
Core Size: 24.75" x 14.50" x 1.50"

It's roughly 4 inches wider than the scirocco core and 2 inches taller, at least based off the largest eBay scirocco core measurements.

asuuming I can still fit my intercooler inlet/outlet on either side of the radiator I'm going to run the vr6 radiator. I can get a generic aluminum unit for 108 shipped or a mishimoto for 225

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

Get the scirocco radiator that's why I said that one In particular. Gives you enough room to tuck it in the rad support otherwise you'll have issues. But measure your car to be sure.