VtecCarHauler

any turbo road race cars out ther? I am trying to build a dual purpose Eg H/B to road race and street/strip. Just wanted to see if anyone has pics or seen any setups. The only car that I have seen so far is Jeff Evans car. I don't know if that car really counts because that video of it might have been a one time thing.

CRX Toad

It is going to be hard to set a car up for RR/Street/Drag and do any of them good.

VtecCarHauler

yeah I hear u. Might end up doing what I always do (street/strip). Really wanted to get into the road race thing but I still want my turbo power.


Modified by VtecCarHauler at 5:37 PM 2/2/2008

nater_1

cooling... make sure you have tons of cooling.. Biggest/baddest radiator you can find. Big oil cooler (not OEM honda).

texrex2002

so I hve the same question as the OP. how do the turbo EG's hold up to 30 straight minutes of wide open throttle?

how about the b18c5 swaps? is there a lot of extra work to do to get these to do well as reliable HPDE cars?

Thanks!

RagingAngel

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nater_1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">cooling... make sure you have tons of cooling.. Biggest/baddest radiator you can find. Big oil cooler (not OEM honda). </TD></TR></TABLE>

I would also put high temp coatings/wraps on the list along with a vented hood.

A high capacity oil pan is also necessary in my opinion. In terms of keeping the heat under control, I don't believe there is really an overkill in this situation.

Proper ducting/sealing of the radiator to force air through the intercooler/radiator also becomes important. Some have even gone further and cut the rad support and/or had a custom radiator fitted so it is not only positioned further away from the source of heat, but closer to the intercooler for more efficient overall cooling.

JDM_JNKY

iTrader: (4)

do you guys reccomend the oil cooler for both N/A & FI Cars?

I was curious because spoon builds track beast all day that spin 11k rev's & never once have I ran across one with an oil cooler. Just want to be pointed in the right direction w/ logic that's all.

navin

iTrader: (1)

I'm sure Spoon uses OEM honda oil coolers, if not something better.

Chris F

It's a really really bad idea unless you like working on your car all the time and not driving it.

HPDE'ing and road racing my R, I burned the bearings on a turbo, cracked a cast iron exhaust manifold, caught my timing belt cover on fire, broke a transmission, broke an axle, went through $150 in brakes every weekend, cooked front tires, spent a lot of money on 100-octane every weekend (20+ gallons a weekend), cracked ringlands on my stock B18C5 (and rebuild with forged), melted about a dozen dipsticks, burned pipes on my A/C enough times for me to remove it altogether, etc.

The car *was* an awesome street car until the rollbar went in. And then the cage made it unstreetable (no driver side window anymore with NASCAR bars). I sold it at a loss.

Search archives for posts by me or other people that've done it.

texrex2002

ChrisF: so in your opinion turbos ruin the car for HPDE, or the whole platform isn't up to the task?

serious question.

thanks

RagingAngel

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM_JNKY &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I was curious because spoon builds track beast all day that spin 11k rev's & never once have I ran across one with an oil cooler. Just want to be pointed in the right direction w/ logic that's all.</TD></TR></TABLE>

specifically to the B18/B16 N1 motors which allow for very little in terms of internal modifications, they only use the OEM oil cooler which is, of course a type that has coolant that flows through it.

They use a massive radiator with ducting and feel this is the best in terms of not having to deal with a oil pressure loss. Some of their race cars also use a 5quart pan.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by texrex2002 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ChrisF: so in your opinion turbos ruin the car for HPDE, or the whole platform isn't up to the task?

serious question.

thanks</TD></TR></TABLE>

I think Chris F is just too hardcore... but seriously, some of those issues he experienced may have been addressed a little better if the cooling was taken care of before all the fires

Sure the broken parts really suck (especially the transmission) but you have to expect it - the motor might now survive due to the forged internals, but the gears are still cast.... that's the thing with cars I guess.. you upgrade one thing ...and you've got to upgrade another and another...and another....and another....

Chris F

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by texrex2002 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ChrisF: so in your opinion turbos ruin the car for HPDE, or the whole platform isn't up to the task?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm saying that I have a lot more fun at the track with an NA car and it's a lot cheaper too. I'm always worried about something breaking with the extra parts of the turbo.

My R in top form would almost run out of gear at Road America, stock gears. That's pretty fun. But when I have to pull off early because my water temps are creeping, or the car starts running like crap after 2-3 laps because the intercooler heat soaks, etc., and the front tires are overheating and get greasy, and the brakes pedal always feels like crap because they're so hot, that's no fun. I would see EGT's above 1600 and oil temps above 300F pretty regularly even with a big C&R radiator and an oil cooler.

track1646

i am curently building a time attack turbo honda. My build is a little diffrent from a full on road race turbo car (limited on track laping time no 30 min full throttle runs) but i have tried to address some of the heat issues. Aside from the normal duct work and venting:

I am running a large oil cooler that will have duct work to chanel air directly to it. It was a pain to find space to mount a large enouigh cooler..but it was well worth the work.

I also am running E85 because of its ability to avoid preignition and for its "cooling" effects. During shake downs the car has stayed very very cool (for a turbo honda)

I am using a love fab mini EQ a GT2871 and a tial 44mm gate. On a stock GSR motor. The car put down 352 whp @ 11lbs
I have the largest brakes you can fit under a 15inch wheel (11.75in 6piston wilwoods) and am running 225/45/15 toyo ra1

other than shakedown info ill have more to report during the spring when we can really punish her.

B18CXr

search user:


Mrlegoman



P.S. OEM cooler is fine for an FI Honda....

coneheadsracing

I have a 92 hatch, i had it turboed for a year and a half. Stock y8 basically, 5 quart oil pan, oil cooler. It was a piece together kit. Make sure your turbo is a good match, you don't want to be over boosting it, but you want enough low end boost also. I never had any issues with heat really. Maybe it was the smaller motor. I remembre one track day was 95 degrees, lots of humidity, and the group i was with was doing at least twenty minute runs. The car was getting hot, but didn't hurt anything. N/A is def. easier though, you will always have something to work on with a turbo car. I can tell you though i will be going back to boost.

I also did drag my car too. Never put on slicks though, but it went 13.003 and 13.004 on Khumo 712's. So, in my opinion you can do both, i personaly built the car for HPDE's but with a good suspension setup, you can still take it to the drag strip and have lots of fun there too.

Good luck have fun

kb58

I don't doubt the problems, but they have to be stated within the context of the amount of power and boost being produced. For example, 300whp from a B16 isn't the same as 300whp from a K24A2. The B16 will need around 50% higher boost for the same output, so everything's going to be that much more critical, charge temp, intercooler operation, oil temp, fuel octane, etc, etc.

I'm currently designing the successor to Kimini (see sig) and am strongly drawn toward a turbo setup. The trick is, I believe, a very low boost setup on a large displacement engine. That, and as said, a big-*** radiator and oil cooler. Then again maybe I don't know what I'm talking about, as I've never run a turbo car at an HPDE...

SkimN

I know the OP is talking about turbos, but what about superchargers, roots or centrifigul

mrlegoman

Helz yeah! Check sig for links.
Extra money will be required for brakes............

turboteener

I just ran a season of Time trial with my turboZ6. The only problem I had was the hood release cable broke. Never melted anything, never cracked a manifold, etc. I also drove the car daily most of the time. My temps seemed reasonable after each run. Water was in the 200 range, not sure about oil, but I was running synthetic so I wouldn't be concerned if it reached 250+. I am running a half width radiator with a full width intercooler on an EF.

Heat management would be an issue on a full blown road race car. You will want to run stainless tubing for the exhaust, an oil cooler, a decent radiator, etc. I am ducting air to the turbo itself just to help keep it cooler while running.

I have done hill climbs in 100+ degree heat without problem. Just leave the hood up when you are done, and make sure you warm the oil up properly. Change your oil frequently. Make sure you have good T-bolt clamps securing the charge plumbing. Also make spend good money on stainless mechanical locking fasteners for the turbo system. Nothing like having your turbo loosen up half way through the weekend.