gobutai

I have a 1996 Integra RS dubbed Project Nicholas, build thread here: https://honda-tech.com/forums/acura-integra-6/project-nicholas-2662751/ , that I need to rebuild or replace the steering rack, tie rods etc.

To the road racers and auto-x-ers what advice could you give me. I have been looking at a rebuilt rack like this:
http://www.partsgeek.com/gbproducts/...ek+Google+Base

or this from ebay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2000-...Q5fAccessories

One of our local mechanics with rgvpca.org adviced me, "just replace the inner/outer tie rods and boots, if nothing is leaking." I am a little weary since the seals and all are 13+ years old.

What are your thoughts?
1) Buy a rebuilt one like the ones shown above
2) Rebuild oem steering rack with local auto store parts i.e. oreilly, autozone etc.
3) Rebuild oem steering rack with oem parts

Does it matter for road racing / auto cross / time attacks?

Either way I will be doing the re-looping of ps lines with the breather for Project Nicholas.

dirty19

iTrader: (1)

Nice build and well documented thread. Great way to honor your grandfather!
Questions for you.
Swaybar 23mm.... wheres your subframe brace?
If you havent invested in one of those put if high on your need it now list!
You dont want to end up having to get the subframe welded back in.
In fact id take a look at it now and see if anything is starting to separate.
Tires... how many events have you run with those new azenis?
Are you rotating them, and if so after how many runs?
They look a bit worn out for only being run on 9/19?

As far as the mechanics advice... Take it! 90% of us use OEM steering racks anyway.
Looks like your putting a lot of money into this, and you should concentrate on the most important thing "seat time"
Too many changes, and buying new parts. Your money will be better spent on seat time and not more parts that may or may not have a positive effect on the car.

Stinkycheezmonky

The racks themselves generally don't go bad. +1 for just replacing the tie rod ends. I know plenty of guys racing with 13+ year old racks that have no issues. It is not a common Honda failure point.

gobutai

Thank you so much Dirty19; that means a lot...

So far I only have the Beaks Mounting Kit for 23mm bar; are the subframe such as ASR's a must? The mounting kit on there are the gold Beak's Kit but got painted black to look oem.
Beaks Subframe Reinforcement Kit - 92-95 Civic, 94-01 Integra

Initially designed for use with the DC-Integra Type-R 22mm rear anti-sway bar, the SRK-EG/DC is proven effective in safeguarding the vehicle's subframe structure. Due to thin construction of the sheet metal, mounting hardware often shear off and destroy the swaybar mounting points, resulting in expensive repairs.
The SRK-EG/DC provides reinforcement from both the front and the backside of the mounting points. Loads are distributed over a large area, which helps reduce the stress and effectively prevents sheet metal failure.

The tires: the ones on the rear now have 6 x 20 minutes Runs, so 2 hours all out runs; with each lap from 1:29 - 1:37 depending of the layout. The ones in the front now have 3 full out runs, and they use to be the rear. Plus they are my daily driven tires!

I am definitely concentrating on seat time, but I am just replacing what was worn or needs replacing. I bought her used as the 3rd or 4th owner in April 2009. Other than suspension work, I have not done anything to the car. Stock engine and on. I just want to do preventive maintenance with parts that will last since I don't like too many changes either. I learned this the hard way with the belts!

gobutai

That sounds good; just wanted to verify this with guys doing this longer than me. Thanks! Any suggestion on what brand or local store company to go with??? I had a bad experience with auto-zone axles!

Stinkycheezmonky

Axles you'll want OEM generally, and are typically asking for trouble if using Autozone remans or whatever. If you want to spend more money than that, Raxles are great, and Marty (the owner) knows how to deal with roadrace guys all the time. Tie rod ends and stuff I've always just used generic Autozone/Advance Auto/whatever stuff, but I also replace them rarely. Someone who does more regular maintenance in that department can answer better than me.

gobutai

Yeah actually ended up returning the auto-zone axles and going with Raxles. Marty is a stand-up guy with an excellent product!

Does anyone have any experience with MOOG? They seem to be significantly be more than the rest of aftermarket tie rods and boots. Are they worth it? Oreilly carries them...

89civicdx

the mood tie rod ends and lower balljoints are nice but the upper ball joints use this cast cup and its not very good.....and i wouldn't use the cheaper stuff they are junk...like those ebay or aftermarket kits

K20A_EH

if your going to loop the rack anyway, why not just gut the rack of all hydro seals... fill it with grease cap the PS line holes with bolts... i have been told it will turn easier .. more like a manual rack... i have'nt seen any "HOW TO" articles yet... but it sounds like a good option probably way cheaper

and of course new OEM tie rods

PS: if anyone has a HOW TO on the rack mod im talking about please post a LINK

dirty19

iTrader: (1)

You definately want to get a subframe brace. (sooner than later)
I have the beaks kit too but its been altered to fit my EG with the Comptech subframe brace. The beaks kit isnt enough with a swaybar that big.
ASR is just as good. I happen to have a friend who got me the Comptech cheap when they were re-organizing.

If your tires are wearing that fast your either overdriving the hell out of the car or your alignment is way way way way off.
To be almost bald after 6 runs?
I make it a point to rotate after every two runs. I use the Toyo R888's R compound, and they dont look anywhere near as bad as those.
If indeed the tires are being driven daily you need to get your alignment checked too.
Thats way too much inner tire wear.
Dont concentrate on timing yourself... concentrate on the being smooth on the course.

gobutai

Yeah, I'm probably driving the hell out of the car. I'm really trying to squeeze that last second or 0.xxx out of it. The car has been aligned after every event. The main reason they look like that, was that my line was shi* when the layout was switched for this last event. I was cutting the corners way to early in unfamiliar areas. One of the veterans when they got behind me told me that the car was partically going sideways from lateral g's and looked like I was doing a "burnout" fighting for grip... When I reviewed the data from the performance box, I was way quicker when I took the wider line and was smooth about things. The tire aspect was definitely my fault... Ohh yeah, I'm on stock UCA's, so limited on camber changes. I think I was -1.7 or so throughout.

Has anyone done what K20A_EH was talking about; gutting the seals and all and regreasing the internals of rack??? Any pros and/or cons to this?

dirty19

iTrader: (1)

Driving the sh** out of it trying to eek out every second wears out your equipment faster.
Your in hpde you shouldnt be timing yourself.
Being smooth all over the track instead of going like hell here, and there
If the instructor is telling your out of shape then you are overdriving.
Dont try and over drive a car when your not familiar with the track.
I know this first hand from my experiences you end up off course on an agricultural excursion.


Nope... never seen sealing up a hydro, and dont know if it would help anything.
Best to leave it stock, or if you want to change the stock unit out for one of those electro steering deals.
But those arent cheap to put together.
I hear good things about those, but i like the manual feel on my EG.
Are you just doing time trials or just hpde? If only hpde what class? 1,2 3, 4

gobutai

Your right, I guess I just have a competitive nature; especially when it comes to competing against myself. The reason I bought a gps, is so that I can see what made a fast run vs. a slower run. I'm somewhat of a visual learner, graphs just makes sense to me. I'm in XC2A class that 185 hp or less; don't know what that translates to.

I'm skipping on that electric steering thing... I really wanted to see what way would be the most inexpensive yet be the most reliable and last.

dirty19

iTrader: (1)

Stay as stock as you can for now, and get lots of seat time!
Upgrades dont always translate into faster times.
Some things can actually have a negative effect rather than showing gains.
Its a proven fact that you can run fast times, and not be at the front of the pack.
Unless your only doing time trials.
Keep up the good work!