Xian

d00d, your circumstances are the exception to the rule!

My wife is kosher with me and cars... But she doesn't want to hang at the track. And stuff like packing up the equipment... yeah, no.

Agreed on splitting costs *but* you've got to find someone who's the right fit. Someone who'll treat the equipment well, not crash the car, etc. And who is an experienced race but doesn't have or want their own car.

92integraVTECgsr

We currently have 8 signed up for HC at Road Atlanta in 2 weeks (5 HC1, 3 HC2 that will move up). And we're expecting another 2-4 to sign up.

HC is growing in the SE. Nationals is just too far and too much money to attend. I would have went last year but it was my first year in w2w and I wasn't ready for it.

I hope that next year they can come up with a better plan to accommodate more competitors.

w2w racing does cost a lot. It is not cheap.

rice_classic

Where are national's next year? I heard Laguna Seca but cannot confirm.

lwnslw

I really doubt it rice , I have not heard anything about it , besides with the noise restriction and the very few events with out it would be difficult .

rice_classic

I figured I'd wait before I got my hopes up. It didn't make sense to me either. I figured it'd go back to Mid Ohio, VIR, Road Atlanta or something like that.

Fast510

iTrader: (1)

I know that the SCCA Runoffs are going to be at Laguna Seca next year in September, unsure about NASA/HC though...

SCoupe 5sp

That is HC in NorCal for the past two years with little or no improvement in sight for 2014.

Earlier this year there was a fully sponsored HPD Fit that two of us pleaded with to run HC and activate contingency for the first time in two years...it ran in PTE or something. It ran right behind us. Very frustrating to experience that. They did not see supporting HC as one of their priorities. After that, neither do I.

dirty19

iTrader: (1)

Wow a Honda sponsored car not running in HC?
Im speachless David.

BlueTeg

iTrader: (2)

SMH...really??
As a whole I think HPD has been incredibly supportive to the HC community. Their contingency support is second to none. Name another company that's paying out $200 + $150 in contingency awards for only 3 starters. If your region can put together 5 racers, they're giving out close to $500 per weekend, per class!!

In Arizona they've given out $2,700 in Honda bucks to H2 competitors this year in our first 6 events.

Now they have to supply cars to help you meet the contingency minimum as well?? Cmon man...

Xian

Curious, but was the Fit in shakedown mode for the B-Spec series? If so, I can see why they'd be hesitant to switch to the spec Toyo's as they likely couldn't do much in the way of setup information gathering with that tire...

Hagakure

Come over to the dark side and run STU in SCCA with me next year David. No HC to speal of in Norcal, and USTCC is no place for old cars. There will be several STU cars out next year, S2000s, Mazdas, an Evo, etc...

SCoupe 5sp

Yes, it was. I'll fill in a few details I choose to leave out. There is no HC "Race Director" in NorCal. If there are two cars, (that day there were three possible), we are on a gentlemen's agreement that there will be no tech protests and no dis-harmony. So if something was not on perfect spec, no one would go running to Race Control, Impound, tech or anything else because someone ran that or had this.

The goal we had that day was all of us to run in HC2 regardless of car prep. For the first time in 2013 there would be a grand total of three Honda's grid for HC. Someone would have a shot at contin, but more importantly for us, all the Civics in the HPDE 3 & 4 might see us having some fun out there and see the light. The drivers of the Fit were included in that conversation and had the big pix presented. They opted out,yet were right there with us on grid anyhow.

I am not trying to blow this thing out of proportion. I'm over it and it was not a make or break thing for me. But is is indicative of the Nor Cal situation. I don't hold HPD responsible for it either. The drivers of the car just work there. I would have made a different choice though if I were the face of HPD that day.

SCoupe 5sp

You are right. Older cars are not really welcome and thanks for mentioning it. And it is true. There is No Place on the Podium, but we will be happy to take entry fees to fill out the field.

Funny how truth is not spoken anywhere. Thanks for saying it.

The real story of why NorCal HC got slammed, what really happens if you win in an older car in USTC and other things are word of mouth and who you know. Walking on rice paper is bullshit.

Censorship or afraid of speaking truth. WTF happened to us? I personally dont give a ****, I am having fun driving and don't need anyone's approval. Yet no one owes me an explanation and it would not change much of anything.

I also live with the truth that I don't have the skills, the time, the knowledge and the backing required to be a competitive front runner or competitor in the true sense of the word. But I seriously do have fun out there and have made fantastic friends and had a blast being there now and in the future, what ever comes.

turntable teknik

Club racing sounds really really expensive.

dirty19

iTrader: (1)

You read the whole two pages right?
It is.

vtecjj

Feels weird NOT racing at nationals this year. Racing at every NASA national championships since it's inception was always fun...even the year's where I finished poorly from going off in Thunder Valley at Mid-O (2007) and when my rear hub broke off at MMP (2009), they were still fun events. ****, even when I won H2 in 2010 and my engine was in tech for 8 1/2 hours, it STILL was a fun event.

Sad to see it's come to this for the type of event. I understand that it is alive in well in a few regions across the country, but racing at the championships was a whole different venture, a different atmosphere than any regional event. If you like the notion of racing against others in your class from different parts of the country to gauge or prove how fast you are, then the championships will be worth your time, money and experience. If you like to race w2w but don't have the ambition to be on top, then it might not be worth it for you.

All in all, we do it for the love and competition of the sport. It just depends how much YOU want it.

It's also sad to see how a series that was SO big and had SO much potential lose SO MUCH steam across the nation overall.

Maybe a new racing series that is based on Honda production cars will emerge and take off better than HC, although will the older DC2's, EG's, EK's dying off and with other options of newer manufacturers and models to choose from, I think it's unlikely, sadly.

azVTECaccord

Club racing is expensive, but it also can be VERY rewarding. W2W is unlike & on a completely different level than lapping/track days. I remember my years of just track days & most of the time I was more frustrated with other drivers than I was learning. Instruction & wide open track without traffic was my favorite. Now my favorite time is with traffic, Sometimes I purposely won't qualify just so I can start in the very back & move foward, enjoying & working for each & every pass. Passes are earned, not given with racing. I usually run with a small feild 5-15 cars per class, 10-30 per session, & every times I'm racing, I'm having fun & pushing myself & it's very rewarding. Track driving before racing was so unrewarding for me, the learning curve was fun, but after the basics I got bored & just wanted to go racing!

This past weekend I went to INDE Inde Motorsports Ranch, spent about $1000, & had an amazing weekend. Great racing battling my H4 civic against rx7's, miata's, & civic's. many close calls, quite a few offs, some bump & minor paint swaps, killed a set of R6's, took first in my class both races & had a blast kicking it with the guys, bs'n about cars, racing, the track etc. Racing is very rewarding to me & there isn't anything else i would have rather spend that $1000 doing.

I fund & justify racing only through sidework, I simply don't have the dispoable income with my day job, but I find a way to fund it because I enjoy the hell out of it!

turntable teknik

@dirty19 yeah read the whole thing. It's interesting to see the inner workings of the HC series coming from you guys, the guys that actually compete. I don't mean to get all personal but I'm assuming you guys have families as well? It must be super tough to balance family, work and racing. I can imagine how long it takes to prep these cars and have them ready for a season and maintaining that car the whole season.

turntable teknik

@azVTECaccord is that a sanctioned event from scca or nasa? Are there any series where you just mod your car to what you want and run against anybody and anything? lol. I've been doing some slight reading on the different classes offered in the scca and nasa and I am beginning to understand the basis of those rules. I guess it's to have a level playing field and keep the races close. There is always that saying though right, if you ain't cheating you ain't trying!

Fast510

iTrader: (1)

I'm kind of in the same boat as you azVTEC. Do I want to be competitive? Hell yes. Will I be a poor sport if I'm not? Not a chance.

I think that the closest to 'unregulated' you could get would be a GT class for w2w racing. Tube frame RX-7's and 240's and VG30 turbo swapped 510's.

I think that this thread should get stickied and renamed: So, you really want to go racing, huh? Lol.

Xian

Look at it from their side... how would it look if HPD *was* found to have a non-compliant car running in HC? Regardless of any "Gentleman's Agreement" that's not going to end well for them. Did it suck for you and the other guy? Of course. Is there a reason behind their actions? Yep. The way it was initially presented made it appear that they just didn't want to run HC... that doesn't look to have been the case. They'd have had to run an illegal car which, IMO, isn't kosher.

rice_classic

Agreed. Just take it and make it non-Honda specific.

NASA (or any Sanctioning body) needs a class that is like SCCA's Improved Touring but that reaps the benefits of the improvements that the HC made to the rule set with the exception of being Make-Specific. Basically make HC open to other makes (and change the name of course).

I know there's already PT, however I don't think Performance Touring is the solution even though it's hard to ignore the growth of PT. PTE was quite appealing to me but adding up points, doing a dyno reclass and all the other things about it made it seem overly complicated for entry level production car racing and also seemed like it would lend itself to cheating more so than a ruleset that doesn't allow as much "creativity". I have a feeling that PT will see a good deal of cheating and it's popularity will decline but I also hope I'm wrong because it is a pretty broad spectrum and inviting rule set despite it's complexity.

92integraVTECgsr

PT/TT is all about cheating. The points are stupid and the not many look for everything. PT is dead in the the SE.

mattbatson

chumpcar allows you to run almost anything against anybody and anything...

however, it is endurance racing, which isn't for everyone, and you will need to find a team to split costs and labor with...and that isn't easy to do.

back in 04 I knew I wanted to get into road racing cars after road racing motorcycles for several years, so I picked up an SCCA rule book and started looking at classes and cars.

During my reading I happened to notice the Suzuki swift Gti in Improved touring B class.
Reason being that my dad had three in his backyard, none of them running, and a junkyard engine in the garage that supposedly ran several years ago.

So, I did the math. The weight on that car was less than any other car in ITB. The engine put out 100hp stock. The car came with disc brakes all around, and something like 9.5 inchers up front (on a 1700 lb car).

I ended up building that car up and racing it and doing pretty darn well with it all.

I raced on the cheap too. I ran toyo RA-1's when everyone else ran ho-ho's...and I ran them down to the cords.
I never cracked open the junkyard engine, and it ran for the four years I raced with the SCCA...at which point my son was born, and I quit (2008)

My brake pads would last three or so weekends and I out braked EVERYONE in that car...

I never had the most power, or the best handling (ran the koni's that you had to remove to adjust...with stock rubber top hats), ran a welded diff because I couldn't afford a 1000 dollar LSD, etc, etc, etc.


I never had a 1000 dollar weekend...ever...

I towed an open trailer with a 4runner, so gas wasn't too bad.

Oh, and because of my good car choice (nobody else ran that car), I ran at the pointy end of the field. Even running cheap, I could hang with the fast guys...even won a race or two.

It can be done inexpensively, and sometimes just not eating out for a couple of months will pay for a race event...you have to make cuts to afford it...but in the end it is very doable.

azVTECaccord

I actually run with ASA / ProAutoSports most of the time. Classing is very simple & done by p:w + tire & brake limitations. ProAutoSports.com for more info. I race PS4 in my ex ITA/H4 Crx.