rynoracer32

Hi Guys,
I have been racing on and off with NASA for a couple years and I keep hearing about SCCA , I was wondering if anyone (who knows both organizations pretty well) could give me a non-biased opinion about the differences between the 2 organizations.

Xian

It's very region specific. I'm in FL and there's little NASA presence here. West Coast or parts of the mid-west and NASA is huge. What I've seen is that, in broad terms, SCCA does better Solo/AutoX and competitive/structured club racing. NASA does way better "run what ya' brung" classes and TT. NASA does have some cool classes but, in general, doesn't always have the same depth of talent that I've seen in the SE.

This is also a little like Pepsi vs. Coke, Bud vs. good beer, Chevy vs. Ford, etc, etc.

TaskmasterH2

I have been racing with NASA for years in SoCal they put on great events with a easy to work with staff and very competitive race can wait for the event at button willow in April. Honda Challange H2 k20 powered civic hb

ScottBell

iTrader: (1)

So what's your definition of racing? Do you have a NASA competition license?

The easy button for you question it to take your NASA comp license and go try out some SCCA "regional" races, because your NASA license is accepted by SCCA for regional races.

If you are not to the point where you are an experienced wheel to wheel racer, then let me point out the difference in how the two organizations get you on track.

NASA works a lot like the various marque clubs (Porsche, BMW, etc.) in that you start off in a drivers education program and work up through the various levels with an in car instructor for DE1, signed off for solo, do that a while and work up to a Time Trial license, go to a NASA competition school, then get to wheel to wheel.

In SCCA you show up to a driver's school in a safety legal car with your drivers gear, do a couple of days at the drivers school all by your self in the car, and if you don't hit anything you get your "novice permit." Then you run some races without hitting anything and move up the ladder from "regional license" to "national license"

Basically SCCA is the very old school way that people got into road racing; "figure most of it out yourself." NASA is the new way of drivers education programs; "In car instructor, and when it looks like you won't kill yourself or others we let you go." Both approaches have their advantages and drawbacks. If you are "the man" and want to get immediately to swapping paint, then SCCA is probably the way to go. If your are over 17 and want a little more guidance on how this stuff works the the NASA program is more a structured learning environment.

known

iTrader: (1)

SCCA has its head up its *** and a bunch of ***-hats doing rules (we will make xyz brand car people happy, and oh well for others, and it took them 15 years to figure out people wanted a swapped motor class below Sx, GT prep). If NASA had a better presence here I would run with them, but they dont and probably never will.

Chump will probably put them all out of business. Im so over SCCA, I might run a couple more events and say f it and run chump. At least Ill have fun.


If Honda Chal. was bigger here I would run that strictly.

ScottBell

iTrader: (1)

Everyone will one day acknowledge the glory of Performance Touring as the best road racing class structure.

FlewByU352

Holy **** this! After the stupid **** rules they were making up at Daytona for the V8SC class and GT2 cars my neighbor said never again with SCCA.

gramkrackers

Any idea how either organization handles drivers with a reasonably extensive karting background, or racing and time trial history in Canada? I am looking to run a NASA event in Mid-Ohio or Watkins Glen this year.....

ScottBell

iTrader: (1)

With NASA karting gets you no where. If you have current w2w experience in a car then gather up license/logbook/event results and fax that along with a license application and your medical to HQ. It was a very painless process for me.

Xian

SCCA also has an "alternate licensing" program that relies on your prior racing experience/resume.

qtevafrb

I might run a couple more events and say f it and run chump. At least Ill have fun.

Calif_Kid

I suggest contacting the Nasa director for your region - see http://www.nasaproracing.com/aboutnasa/regions.html. If you haven't driven with Nasa before, and don't have a competition license, then they should still look at whatever experience you have, and probably would do a checkout ride to make sure that you drive well, are aware of other drivers plus flag station workers etc. Were you thinking of driving in Nasa HPDE, TT, or W2W? - Jim

miamirice

This! I am coming from years of chump, getting into NASA and SCCA, just to do something less than 14 hours and there are only 3-4 chump events that are within a 1 day drive. What I have seen so far at NASA in my area is there is very little wheel to wheel action. HC has been 6-8 cars over 3-4 classes. Chump can be very entertaining to go wheel to wheel with an equal for 2 hours while picking through traffic.

gramkrackers

I have never driven with NASA before, and I am planning on contacting the local director as well, just thought I would post the question in here. I held an ASN-FIA International karting licence for 3 years, and last year I had an ASN-FIA Class B licence which allow's me to compete in everything up here except w2w. The process to become licenced w2w up here requires you to go to a race school and then be on probation for a number of races and then be signed off by the competition director. Although I have been told by a friend who is involved in the process he thinks I will be exempt from the school because of the karting experience.

I am just hoping to compete in NASA Time Trials for the time being, which is the equivalent to what I do now.

BLU CIVIC

Jon Felton is now the Florida Region Director for NASA. I know they're starting to become more active down there. You can contact him on FB or through www.getfastevents.com for up and coming events.

known

iTrader: (1)

7 cars in HC1 in Oct. at Sebring last year and 3 at Homestead earlier this year for H1....no H2.

SCoupe 5sp

And you very well may be able to do that. Once you've established some things.

All due respect, I know nothing more about you than you've stated here, so no offense. Play along, let's reverse the question. If I said I never had been in a cart before but had extensive Race car w2w how you would react? Would you really want me on the track with you and your experienced friends the first time? I think not. Both backgrounds are helpful in cross over, but you really need seat time to adjust to either discipline and not look like a newb.

To get into Time Trials, you will have to at a minimum request and receive a sign off evaluation by an instructor in HPDE4 group. That is if you are actually qualified to be in that group4, as a great deal is expected of you right off the bat. You may be fine and get OK'd to go TT or just as equally find yourself kicked the hell out of G4 and sent to G1-2. Don't think that hasn't happened, I've seen that happen in NorCal.

Another thing, I enjoyed every step of the driving journey. Those first sessions many years ago in G1/2 were insane fun. Just as G3 and G4. I had no business short changing myself all the fun and learning experiences I had and the friends I made along the way. For me, Time Trials was interesting, but HPDE4 is closer to racing provided a lot of fun. TT is like qualifying, one good lap, done, and a number of people treat it that way. It is not like racing.

Xian

I'm sure you already know this but SCCA is the way to go for wheel to wheel in FL. Ton's more events and way bigger/deeper fields.

I'll also say that the "racing" in Chump is kinda applesranges with SCCA sprint racing. Don't get me wrong, I'm not slamming Chump (I really enjoy it, for what it is) but what constitutes "racing" in most of Chump is closer to DE/trackday driving than what you'll see at the pointy end of SCCA sprint racing. Since Chump events truly are "endurance" races, it makes sense to not race quite as hard for position and not run the car 10/10th's everywhere on track. You're also more apt to leave a little room for someone on the inside of a turn b/c the penalty for potentially breaking something is much larger than in a Sprint race (you've got a team of folks who are also driving with you, much more invested in logistics, entry fees, etc, etc).

The possible exception to this ^^^ in Chump are the top ~5-10 teams that have seasoned drivers and a car that can take 10/10th's for the entire race. And even those teams have to peddle the car around slower traffic driving 7/10th's and leave extra room just in case a n00b has brain fade. Most SCCA drivers are seasoned enough that less room is left because you can trust them not to make the wrong move...

beastiebomb

QFT. Since it's more of a regional organization with national oversight (instead of the opposite) you're really at the mercy of whoever is running your local group. Our SCCA only does autoX, and our NASA officials and drivers are amazing.

gramkrackers

Personally, I would have absolutely no issues with you going on track with me in a go-kart if it was indeed the above scenario. I dont think you would be as quick right away but in terms of driver awareness for flags, other around you, how to safely pass etc.... I can't see a problem if you had an extensive background in cars. There are exceptions, an ***-hat in a car is an ***-hat in a kart and vise-versa, but thats for the instructors to decide.

If I can come down to Mid-Ohio or Watkins Glen this summer I would have no issues starting at the bottom of the ladder. I just wouldn't climb it because I would only be attending one event every now and then. I am just hoping to get on the track and run as many laps as I can, if HPDE4 lets me get the most bang for my buck then great, if the instructors dont think I can handle it and drop me to group 1 or 2, then that is okay aswell.

For our time trial series we get 3 timed runs that have 4 laps each, plus mornig lapping so we get good track time and some fun racing the clock too. If NASA is a one and done thing I would probably run in an HPDE group because I am coming down for the experience first, and competion second for now. I have plenty of time to go back wheel to wheel racing (I would like to race in the US as well when I do) and will cross that bridge when I come to it.

rice_classic

Run both?

Calif_Kid

In Northern California, the Nasa HPDE and TT sessions are usually 20'. In TT, the first lap is very slow to allow all of the cars on track, but you can then stay out for the entire session if you want to. In Norcal, I believe that HPDE-3 is setup for limited passing on Saturday morning, and they then allow more and more passing areas and is then open track (passing anywhere) by late Saturday plus Sunday, but I'm not sure about Mid Ohio. In Norcal, HPDE-4 is open passing anywhere without a point by. Best thing would be to contact the regional director with your track experience, and see what group they suggest - I am guessing either HPDE-3 or possibly HPDE-4. If they put you in HPDE-3 and you're doing great, then you could ask for a check out ride to get to HPDE-4. If you're running HPDE-4 and really want to go to TT, then just ask for a check out ride. - Jim

miamirice

Agree totally on chump. I am in the process for SCCA and look forward to it.

gramkrackers

Excellent, thanks for the advice. That sounds pretty reasonable, and what I expected. I will contact the regional director and talk with more of the guys that I race with up here because I know many of them have been down to The Glen and Mid-Ohio before, just not sure how they went about it.

known

iTrader: (1)

No penalty for destroying someones car in SCCA... people are allowed to chopper away...

In my few races with SCCA, I have had some pretty idiotic driving by seasoned drivers. This was also running in a class mixed with prod. etc..

I look forward to ITB this year, outside of SM its probably the best or one of the best classes to run in our region. I know almost half the field and can trust racing with them.