Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend?
08-31-2005, 01:39 PM
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (fireant)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fireant »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Heh, sound like the party is over. We should all be glad we're in Hondas.</TD></TR></TABLE>
or fuel efficient V-dubbs
or fuel efficient V-dubbs
08-31-2005, 01:40 PM
#28
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (RexRacer19)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RexRacer19 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
That is a good way of thinking about it...that probably explains why there was at least a $.20 price difference across the side of town that I live on. Every man for himself. One guy goes for it and the other says "damnit I should have charged $.10 more..."
I guess that I have a hard time understanding that there is zero buffer between refineries and the pump.
All this really makes me want to work on swaping the motor out of my dead civic std...I could more than double my gas mileage.</TD></TR></TABLE>
here is alittle information about how gas stations set there prices.
Most of them are franchises and you buy into it, BUT your gas price is still set by the company you buy from, be it BP Arco, chevron, who ever, they set your gas prices.
Also they have "pricing zones" which means that every gas station in that zone has to sell gas at the same price. (for the same supplier of course).
Those "pricing zone" maps are FREAKIN nutty looking.
That is a good way of thinking about it...that probably explains why there was at least a $.20 price difference across the side of town that I live on. Every man for himself. One guy goes for it and the other says "damnit I should have charged $.10 more..."
I guess that I have a hard time understanding that there is zero buffer between refineries and the pump.
All this really makes me want to work on swaping the motor out of my dead civic std...I could more than double my gas mileage.</TD></TR></TABLE>
here is alittle information about how gas stations set there prices.
Most of them are franchises and you buy into it, BUT your gas price is still set by the company you buy from, be it BP Arco, chevron, who ever, they set your gas prices.
Also they have "pricing zones" which means that every gas station in that zone has to sell gas at the same price. (for the same supplier of course).
Those "pricing zone" maps are FREAKIN nutty looking.
08-31-2005, 01:40 PM
#29
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Johnny Tran)
Premium in Jacksonville was $2.99 this morning... my brother in law in Ohio said that mid-grade went up to $3.09 this morning 
Christian, who's wife is going to start driving his "fuel efficient" Cooper S b/c she has a longer commute...
Christian, who's wife is going to start driving his "fuel efficient" Cooper S b/c she has a longer commute...
08-31-2005, 01:44 PM
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Xian)
Technically almost ANYTHING you do for entertainment is wasting precious natural resources.
TV, computer, planes, boats, guns..
Arguably even sports, since they can make you tired and hungry, and you will eat more food.
I'm not for sitting around only doing what's necessary, so I say go for it!
I guess it's just expensive!
TV, computer, planes, boats, guns..
Arguably even sports, since they can make you tired and hungry, and you will eat more food.
I'm not for sitting around only doing what's necessary, so I say go for it!
I guess it's just expensive!
08-31-2005, 01:47 PM
#31
Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (BA5)
<-- [Goes to garage with downloaded plans for making a crossbow before the End Times get into full swing]
08-31-2005, 02:01 PM
#32
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Johnny Tran)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Johnny Tran »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">2.99 a gallon in Charlotte, as of 1.00pm Wed.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Mother of pearl.
That puts a fillup of the Excusion at roughly $120.
It was starting to feel excessive to use this as a commuter (I'm unmarried with no kids BTW), now it's even more so. At least it gets 20mpg - if I still had my 454 Suburban, I'd be broke at 11mpg...
Mother of pearl.
That puts a fillup of the Excusion at roughly $120.
It was starting to feel excessive to use this as a commuter (I'm unmarried with no kids BTW), now it's even more so. At least it gets 20mpg - if I still had my 454 Suburban, I'd be broke at 11mpg...
08-31-2005, 02:12 PM
#33
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Xian)
quite frankly..........i hope it stays at $3+/gallon.
necessity is the mother of invention. in case you haven't noticed, we've been in the second coming of the horsepower wars between manufacturers for about the last 10 years. if you don't believe me, just check how much power a friggin accord makes.
also, you'll remember some strict government regulations on emissions and fuel efficiency back in the 70's during the energy crisis. it took about 5 years to catch back up, but in the end, society is better off. same deal here, until the gov't mandates a new set of standards (and doesn't give in to palm-greasing lobbyists), fuel efficiency isn't going to change much more than the current rate. sure things are constantly getting better, but just enough to keep the greenies off their backs, power is increasing at a much faster rate.
the technology and knowledge is there to make cars drastically more fuel efficient, but nobody does it because that's not what the market demands. i'm as big of a right-wing republican as you'll find on liberal economies, but in this case, i think it's time for the gov't to step in like they did 30 years ago.
another argument for the "i hope gas prices stay high" goes as follows.
in theory, if you have a decent job your salary will at minimum be adjusted for inflation each year. not really inflation, but the CPI index. the CPI index is a sum, the sum of things which the treasury (i think) deems are needed to live an average life. things like bread, home prices, water, electricity, and owning and operating a vehicle are typically included in the price basket. as the price of gas goes up, so will the CPI, and thus your salary.
for example -
if i drive 15000 miles/yr, then with an SUV like a tahoe i would use about 882 gallons of fuel/yr (assuming 17mpg).
if i drive an integra, i would use around 555 gallons/yr (assuming 27mpg).
under the old fuel prices of say, $2/gallon, it would cost me $1764/yr to fuel the tahoe, vs $1110/yr for the integra. a savings of $654.
with prices at $3/gallon, i spent $2646 on the tahoe, and $1665 on the integra. now i've saved almost $1000.
not only this, but since the CPI factors are aggregates, the guy that drives the tahoe drives up the average cost of owning/operating a vehicle, increasing CPI, and giving me bigger raises each year, while my cost of living decreases relative to the average. this brings us to the most important point, the REAL WAGES of people who drive smaller cars increase with each price hike in fuel.
so...
restrict production, tax the hell out of fuel, and keep our domestic reserves closed, because i'm getting rich!
(this is all theoretical of course)
necessity is the mother of invention. in case you haven't noticed, we've been in the second coming of the horsepower wars between manufacturers for about the last 10 years. if you don't believe me, just check how much power a friggin accord makes.
also, you'll remember some strict government regulations on emissions and fuel efficiency back in the 70's during the energy crisis. it took about 5 years to catch back up, but in the end, society is better off. same deal here, until the gov't mandates a new set of standards (and doesn't give in to palm-greasing lobbyists), fuel efficiency isn't going to change much more than the current rate. sure things are constantly getting better, but just enough to keep the greenies off their backs, power is increasing at a much faster rate.
the technology and knowledge is there to make cars drastically more fuel efficient, but nobody does it because that's not what the market demands. i'm as big of a right-wing republican as you'll find on liberal economies, but in this case, i think it's time for the gov't to step in like they did 30 years ago.
another argument for the "i hope gas prices stay high" goes as follows.
in theory, if you have a decent job your salary will at minimum be adjusted for inflation each year. not really inflation, but the CPI index. the CPI index is a sum, the sum of things which the treasury (i think) deems are needed to live an average life. things like bread, home prices, water, electricity, and owning and operating a vehicle are typically included in the price basket. as the price of gas goes up, so will the CPI, and thus your salary.
for example -
if i drive 15000 miles/yr, then with an SUV like a tahoe i would use about 882 gallons of fuel/yr (assuming 17mpg).
if i drive an integra, i would use around 555 gallons/yr (assuming 27mpg).
under the old fuel prices of say, $2/gallon, it would cost me $1764/yr to fuel the tahoe, vs $1110/yr for the integra. a savings of $654.
with prices at $3/gallon, i spent $2646 on the tahoe, and $1665 on the integra. now i've saved almost $1000.
not only this, but since the CPI factors are aggregates, the guy that drives the tahoe drives up the average cost of owning/operating a vehicle, increasing CPI, and giving me bigger raises each year, while my cost of living decreases relative to the average. this brings us to the most important point, the REAL WAGES of people who drive smaller cars increase with each price hike in fuel.
so...
restrict production, tax the hell out of fuel, and keep our domestic reserves closed, because i'm getting rich!
(this is all theoretical of course)
08-31-2005, 02:49 PM
#34
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (tnord)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tnord »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">quite frankly..........i hope it stays at $3+/gallon.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I agree!!! Although it would have been good if I had filled up yesterday instead of today... damn.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I agree!!! Although it would have been good if I had filled up yesterday instead of today... damn.
08-31-2005, 02:54 PM
#35
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Markus)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Markus »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Meanwhile I'm getting ready for this weekend's NASA event at Beaverun. Should I feel guilty about wasting precious natural resources to indulge in my hobby? I don't feel too bad....even though my mileage drops dramatically on track I figure it's probably still better than most people's SUV's. Is that right?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Damn straight. I averaged 18.8mpg on track when I did VIR Grand East earlier this year. A Honda Pilot will barely do that on the street, if at all.
I get 37mpg on the street - I
my EF.
Damn straight. I averaged 18.8mpg on track when I did VIR Grand East earlier this year. A Honda Pilot will barely do that on the street, if at all.
I get 37mpg on the street - I
my EF.
08-31-2005, 03:23 PM
#36
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i say enjoy gas while it's still available and at relatively low prices. it's only going to get worse. live like there's no tomorrow.
08-31-2005, 03:53 PM
#37
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Markus)
There's no shortage of oil.
The Province of Alberta has enough oil in the tar sands to feed the demands of the USA well into the next century. There's actually more oil in the tar sands than there is in the Middle East.
You'll just have to pay for it of course.
The Province of Alberta has enough oil in the tar sands to feed the demands of the USA well into the next century. There's actually more oil in the tar sands than there is in the Middle East.
You'll just have to pay for it of course.
08-31-2005, 03:58 PM
#38
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (tnord)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tnord »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">quite frankly..........i hope it stays at $3+/gallon.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I also hope it does.
I am lucky that I get paid mileage (~40.5 cents/mile) from work... that helps a bunch.
The fact that I spend every weekend on the road (on my own dollar) does not help.
Since the ITR has been parked and the 242TI has been made the main steed... the boost was turned down along with the timing. A strict diet of 87 octane is all she will get from now on.
Last tank (heading back down Rt. 29) = 28.7mpg. Not too bad for a 20 year old car with 297,000 miles and mechanical fuel injection.
I also hope it does.
I am lucky that I get paid mileage (~40.5 cents/mile) from work... that helps a bunch.
The fact that I spend every weekend on the road (on my own dollar) does not help.
Since the ITR has been parked and the 242TI has been made the main steed... the boost was turned down along with the timing. A strict diet of 87 octane is all she will get from now on.
Last tank (heading back down Rt. 29) = 28.7mpg. Not too bad for a 20 year old car with 297,000 miles and mechanical fuel injection.
08-31-2005, 04:05 PM
#39
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Big Phat R)
Yes you have the mother load of tar sands, but you have to burn two barrels of it to release one barrel to refine. That's going to be very expensive oil!
On another note, one of our company's plants is down there, and word is that over 60% of the employees don't have homes anymore, gone poof, flattened to the ground. There is no phone or cell phone service, and the company is trying to fly in satellite phones, but there is no airport open to fly them into. The plant may have to house the employees... no one knows for sure the real situation.
I too am thinking things may be much worse than we are aware of...
BTW, I just had a talk with my kids, and said if the prez calls a national emergency and conservation of gasoline, I am shutting their car down, and the only driving the family will do is the wife and I too and from work and grocery shopping. The kids will be dropped off at our convenience, and all trips will be minimized... maybe its just me... but this is not a manipulated shortage, this appears to be a national crisis in the making.
That said, I would say enjoy your race, unless the prez calls for national conservation and declares it a time of "national emergency" If it is a "national emergency" then me thinks, we all need to do our part to help.
BTW, New Orleans is our largest port, reportidly with 1.6 million sacks of coffee sitting in a warehouse. How good do you think those coffee beans still are? I have to admit I will probably grab a few sacks of coffee tomorrow. I can't live without it!
On another note, one of our company's plants is down there, and word is that over 60% of the employees don't have homes anymore, gone poof, flattened to the ground. There is no phone or cell phone service, and the company is trying to fly in satellite phones, but there is no airport open to fly them into. The plant may have to house the employees... no one knows for sure the real situation.
I too am thinking things may be much worse than we are aware of...
BTW, I just had a talk with my kids, and said if the prez calls a national emergency and conservation of gasoline, I am shutting their car down, and the only driving the family will do is the wife and I too and from work and grocery shopping. The kids will be dropped off at our convenience, and all trips will be minimized... maybe its just me... but this is not a manipulated shortage, this appears to be a national crisis in the making.
That said, I would say enjoy your race, unless the prez calls for national conservation and declares it a time of "national emergency" If it is a "national emergency" then me thinks, we all need to do our part to help.
BTW, New Orleans is our largest port, reportidly with 1.6 million sacks of coffee sitting in a warehouse. How good do you think those coffee beans still are? I have to admit I will probably grab a few sacks of coffee tomorrow. I can't live without it!
08-31-2005, 04:09 PM
#40
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (BigMoose)
I JUST SPENT 90 GODDAMN DOLLARS AT THE GAS STATION!!!!!!!
Last MONTH...I repeat MONTH, including a tow to and from VIR I spent a TOTAL of $175. All month.
ONE TRIP. $90!!!!!
Ninety US dollars.
FUUUUCK!!!!!
We're in trouble. Seriously. I can see $4/gallon before Labor Day is over.....
Last MONTH...I repeat MONTH, including a tow to and from VIR I spent a TOTAL of $175. All month.
ONE TRIP. $90!!!!!
Ninety US dollars.
FUUUUCK!!!!!
We're in trouble. Seriously. I can see $4/gallon before Labor Day is over.....
08-31-2005, 04:16 PM
#41
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (MaddMatt)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MaddMatt »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I JUST SPENT 90 GODDAMN DOLLARS AT THE GAS STATION!!!!!!!</TD></TR></TABLE>
At least you don't have a Hummer
Imagine having to drive one of those while there is an oil shortage - I'm sure people would be throwing rotten eggs at you.
At least you don't have a Hummer
Imagine having to drive one of those while there is an oil shortage - I'm sure people would be throwing rotten eggs at you.
08-31-2005, 04:33 PM
#42
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (MaddMatt)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MaddMatt »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I JUST SPENT 90 GODDAMN DOLLARS AT THE GAS STATION!!!!!!!
We're in trouble. Seriously. I can see $4/gallon before Labor Day is over.....</TD></TR></TABLE>
some analysts anticipate 20-30 cent increases each day for the next 4-5 days.
<----wishes he still had the GSR, but glad he bought a legend, or else it would be the truck to class and back 30 miles away.
We're in trouble. Seriously. I can see $4/gallon before Labor Day is over.....</TD></TR></TABLE>
some analysts anticipate 20-30 cent increases each day for the next 4-5 days.
<----wishes he still had the GSR, but glad he bought a legend, or else it would be the truck to class and back 30 miles away.
08-31-2005, 04:37 PM
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Markus)
I don't feel guilty about racing, but I'd like to suggest that, if possible, anyone who can might contribute a race weekend's worth of bucks (or whatever you can afford) to the American Red Cross relief effort, or something similar.
08-31-2005, 04:46 PM
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Geezer)
I don't feel guilty about using gas for racing, in the least. I burn less doing that than a family of 4 would do, taking the Expedition to a college ball game on the other side of the state.
K
K
08-31-2005, 04:48 PM
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (tnord)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tnord »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
some analysts anticipate 20-30 cent increases each day for the next 4-5 days.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
The same gas station that went up $.20/g on Monday, and $.10 on Tuesday, went up $.54 this afternoon, to $3.29 for Regular.
BTW, I will be making a donation to the Red Cross relief fund.
Keith, who decided a couple of weeks ago to buy gas in the mornings...
some analysts anticipate 20-30 cent increases each day for the next 4-5 days.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
The same gas station that went up $.20/g on Monday, and $.10 on Tuesday, went up $.54 this afternoon, to $3.29 for Regular.
BTW, I will be making a donation to the Red Cross relief fund.
Keith, who decided a couple of weeks ago to buy gas in the mornings...
08-31-2005, 04:54 PM
#46
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (tnord)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tnord »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">some analysts anticipate 20-30 cent increases each day for the next 4-5 days. </TD></TR></TABLE>
That wouldn't surprise me. I run two Tahoes, so I topped $100 today in one truck. We are likely headed into a bit of a panic driven spike.
I agree we will see $4/gal before low $2's. However at $4/gal the economy is going to start to tank... and at $5 we will be headed towards our biggest recession in history.
That wouldn't surprise me. I run two Tahoes, so I topped $100 today in one truck. We are likely headed into a bit of a panic driven spike.
I agree we will see $4/gal before low $2's. However at $4/gal the economy is going to start to tank... and at $5 we will be headed towards our biggest recession in history.
08-31-2005, 05:02 PM
#47
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (BigMoose)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BigMoose »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
That wouldn't surprise me. I run two Tahoes, so I topped $100 today in one truck. We are likely headed into a bit of a panic driven spike.
I agree we will see $4/gal before low $2's. However at $4/gal the economy is going to start to tank... and at $5 we will be headed towards our biggest economic restructure in history. </TD></TR></TABLE>
i fixed it for you.
That wouldn't surprise me. I run two Tahoes, so I topped $100 today in one truck. We are likely headed into a bit of a panic driven spike.
I agree we will see $4/gal before low $2's. However at $4/gal the economy is going to start to tank... and at $5 we will be headed towards our biggest economic restructure in history. </TD></TR></TABLE>
i fixed it for you.
08-31-2005, 05:13 PM
#48
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (tnord)
Tnord... actually I liked what you fixed!
I wrote the following, but erased it thinking I may have gone over the edge, however since you thought it also, let me add what I erased:
"After watching the video from NO, and the folks walking thru one of OUR cities with AK47's, I am starting to wonder if we have created an unsustainable societal structure based on cheap energy and allowing way too dense a population." Which was quickly followed by the thought, "Now what do we do?"
I wrote the following, but erased it thinking I may have gone over the edge, however since you thought it also, let me add what I erased:
"After watching the video from NO, and the folks walking thru one of OUR cities with AK47's, I am starting to wonder if we have created an unsustainable societal structure based on cheap energy and allowing way too dense a population." Which was quickly followed by the thought, "Now what do we do?"
08-31-2005, 05:18 PM
#49
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (Geezer)
Matt's fuel check...
SE-R #1: 1/2 tank, about 7 gallons, 93 octane.
SE-R #2: 3/4 tank, about 10 gallons, 87 octane.
E350: both tanks slam damn full of biodoesel, about 33 gallons. This was the bulk of the $90 I just spent.
Lawn mower: full
Track gas can: full, 5 gallons, 87 octane.
Lawn mower gas can: 2 gallons, 87 octane (emergency reserve!)
I have 57 gallons of fuel on hand. I'm good to go for a few weeks.....
SE-R #1: 1/2 tank, about 7 gallons, 93 octane.
SE-R #2: 3/4 tank, about 10 gallons, 87 octane.
E350: both tanks slam damn full of biodoesel, about 33 gallons. This was the bulk of the $90 I just spent.
Lawn mower: full
Track gas can: full, 5 gallons, 87 octane.
Lawn mower gas can: 2 gallons, 87 octane (emergency reserve!)
I have 57 gallons of fuel on hand. I'm good to go for a few weeks.....
08-31-2005, 05:33 PM
#50
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Re: Gas over $3, possible shortages, do you feel guilty racing this weekend? (BigMoose)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BigMoose »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Tnord... actually I liked what you fixed!
I wrote the following, but erased it thinking I may have gone over the edge, however since you thought it also, let me add what I erased:
"After watching the video from NO, and the folks walking thru one of OUR cities with AK47's, I am starting to wonder if we have created an unsustainable societal structure based on cheap energy and allowing way too dense a population." Which was quickly followed by the thought, "Now what do we do?"
</TD></TR></TABLE>
cheap transportation of goods is an extremely large part of the global economy. drastically higher fuel costs (which is not going to happen on a permanent basis the world over because of one little storm) will not be the end of the global marketplace, it will just be restructured. for example, the marginal cost advantage of manufacturing a product on foreign soil where cheap labor is plentiful, but actual consumption of the product is low, will be hit hard. that's not to say that things like this will cease to exist, they will just get shuffled around to somewhere that's a compromise between cheap labor, and limited shipping costs of raw materials and goods.
now, since the US is probably the nation that takes best advantage of free flowing capital outside of our county, we are the ones who are home to many corporations with overseas plants, thus our economy could be "restructured," the most. the outflow of capital from developing countries could be quite significant, thus hurting their very small economies a hugely relative amount. this will be the anti-globalists call to arms for the end of globalization. the ironic part of the argument is that it's their own gov'ts reluctance to accept and attempts to limit their countries involvement in the global economy in the first place which gave birth to this scenario.
cheap energy isn't the most important factor in the global economy, free-flowing and fast moving information is. as long as there is electricity, this will not be a problem should the host nation choose to embrace it.
the world isn't ending, but it may be changing.
I wrote the following, but erased it thinking I may have gone over the edge, however since you thought it also, let me add what I erased:
"After watching the video from NO, and the folks walking thru one of OUR cities with AK47's, I am starting to wonder if we have created an unsustainable societal structure based on cheap energy and allowing way too dense a population." Which was quickly followed by the thought, "Now what do we do?"
</TD></TR></TABLE>cheap transportation of goods is an extremely large part of the global economy. drastically higher fuel costs (which is not going to happen on a permanent basis the world over because of one little storm) will not be the end of the global marketplace, it will just be restructured. for example, the marginal cost advantage of manufacturing a product on foreign soil where cheap labor is plentiful, but actual consumption of the product is low, will be hit hard. that's not to say that things like this will cease to exist, they will just get shuffled around to somewhere that's a compromise between cheap labor, and limited shipping costs of raw materials and goods.
now, since the US is probably the nation that takes best advantage of free flowing capital outside of our county, we are the ones who are home to many corporations with overseas plants, thus our economy could be "restructured," the most. the outflow of capital from developing countries could be quite significant, thus hurting their very small economies a hugely relative amount. this will be the anti-globalists call to arms for the end of globalization. the ironic part of the argument is that it's their own gov'ts reluctance to accept and attempts to limit their countries involvement in the global economy in the first place which gave birth to this scenario.
cheap energy isn't the most important factor in the global economy, free-flowing and fast moving information is. as long as there is electricity, this will not be a problem should the host nation choose to embrace it.
the world isn't ending, but it may be changing.