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I've been looking for some new track pads for my S2000. I run several HPDEs per year. Last year, I used EBC yellows with very good results. The car has KW coilovers, Dunlop Direezasport Z1 starspecs (sticky street tires) mounted on 17x7.5 and 17x9 ADVANs. The only engine mod is an intake. I'll be getting an exhaust also...but honestly, those two put together might add maybe 10-20whp max. I also use high temp brake fluid. I used wilwood last year. But I might use Synpower this year since the temp ratings are around the same but the Synpower is available at autoparts stores around here and it's cheaper.

The EBC pads worked great at Gingerman, Road America, and the Autobahn CC's sub courses. They lasted, IIRC, around 4-6 track days (I can't remember exactly). They ate my rotors up minimally. The rotors look kind of like an old record lol. I use stock pads for the street.

Anyway, the only reason I thought to switch pads is because the EBCs faded a bit at Autobahn CC's full course. That course is really hard on brakes! They were still pretty damn good...but there was definately some fade that bordered on scary. I brake as late as possible.

I've thought about the Carbotech XP10 front and XP8 rear. I've heard lots of good things about them, but not too many people said much about wear. There was one guy claiming that they wore out within ONE track day on his 99 Si. I have a 99 Si also...and it's nowhere near as demanding on the brakes as the S2000 is on a track day. So this put me off a bit.

As I said, others said they were very satisfied with the brakes, but not many people said much about the wear rates on them.

Who uses them on S2000s or similarly fast cars of similar weights? How long do they typically last?

Can anyone recommend another type of good pad? The Hawk blue is reported by many sources to leave a caustic layer of dust. I'm not a hard parker by any means...but I don't really want my ADVANs and my black car's fenders pitted. It's still a dual duty car. Not a DD, though.

Lastly, I'd like to specify that I use my stock pads for the street...but I don't swap out or want to swap out rotors. I heard that this is not really an issue with the carbotechs. I like that.

Let me know what you guys think about the carbotechs. If there are too many negative reviews, I'll go with the EBCs again. Maybe I'll add some ducting to aid with the brake fade when I go back to Autobahn CC full course.

Andrie Hartanto

It is important to know what kind of Carbotech pads the guy use for his 99 Si?
There is a correct tool for each task, and I doubt if he uses Carbotech XP10, he will toast the brake in 1 day. Unless of course he is dragging his brake all the way the course.

I uses Carbotech XP10 and also XP12, depending on the race track, and demand. With either on my TSX, we see about 6 race days of use. Now, my TSX is heavy.

With the S2K, we see the pads last about the same time on stock caliper.

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He was using xp10s on his Si, IIRC. People were pretty amazed at how bad/fast his pads wore and he was the only one claiming such results. 6 days is not bad at all. I am using the stock calipers.

Andrie Hartanto

Keep in mind that is 6 race days. For track days, it potentially will have more life.

.:Made in OC:.

I personally dont have any experience with Carbotech pads but what i would recommend you do is upgrade to MOTUL RBF600 brake fluid as you go along and do more braking.

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Does the RBF600 work with ABS? I've heard really good things about the Motul fluids.

NTCustoms

I am using both Carbotech XP10 and Motul RBF600. I'm unsure of what ABS has to do with the brake fluid but so far, nothing has gone wrong. The XP10's work great, and aren't too harsh on the rotors. Keep in mind i'm only using XP10's on the front, you don't need to run as aggressive a pad in the rear.

Another company you'd want to check out is Performance Friction. I don't have any personal experience with it yet, but if race schools are using it then

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I used perf. friction on my GSR. I was planning on using X010F and XP8R.

Some brake fluids are dot 5, which say "NOT COMPATIBLE WITH ABS SYSTEMS" on the bottle.

.:Made in OC:.

MOTUL RBF600 hasn't been a problem. Iv used it on several abs equipped cars.

Im not speaking on behalf of a marketing or sponsored standpoint, but so far, MOTUL fluids are great! I run all their fluids.

Charles

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Cool. Good to know. I know Sport Compact car did a writeup on one of the Motul brake fluids. They said they had to flush the fluid way less than usual and the fade was hugely improved.

They sold me at "you have to flush the fluid less often" lol.

Slow*Jim

This may be getting off topic, but I've found that ATE Superblue is quite a bit cheaper than RBF600 and is rated at something like 550 degrees - more than enough for my 3300lb car with puny little 12.8" rotors and Hawk HP+ pads

kommon_sense

how quickly does motul absorb moisture? is it ok to run on the street for an hpde car? I've been considering switching from the ate to the motul.

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I'm sure running it on the street is fine. Don't some German cars come with the Motul stuff in there from the factory?

granracing

I've been using Carbotech pads for a few years now and love them. They are very rotor friendly, last quite a long time, and work well. I've also tried Porterfield and Hawk pads in the past and wouldn't go back.

I'm also an ATE / SuperBlue user. Nice having two different colored brake fluids to ensure a good flush of the system.

NTCustoms

i dont know about motul being "you have to flush the fluid less often." maybe in a performance perspective, the higher boiling point reduces the amount of times you have to flush the fluid. you still have to bleed after every event though (or this is always the case with me). I wouldn't use Motul on the street though, the higher boiling point means that it also has a higher rate of water absorption.

FerreiraCompetitions

A common mistake people make is to always look at the "dry" boiling point on brake fluids, which is a big mistake. You should always look for the highest "wet" boiling point. Brake fluid will start to adsorb moisture as soon as you open the bottle. Hence why you always see pro teams flush theirs systems with a freshly opened bottle. As for which brake fluid is best, Castrol SRF is the BEST. And its what Grand Am, IRL, Champcar, Nascar, teams use. But as with all things, the best doesnt come cheap. $80/liter.

As for pads and or rotors, Performance Friction offers the best. Pads last longer, with higer coeficients of friction and higher lockup treshold. But dont expect them to cost the same as some of the cheappies commonly used ones here. Another good brand would be Pagid or Ferodo but dont know if they have them for you car and they dont last long. Although Pagids tend to eat rotors in a couple of hundred hard race miles.

As for running a less aggressive rear pads, I would recomend against it unless you have a properly setup brake system with a balance bar pedal box, and have your masters setup for the piston sizes. The reason is, the stock MC and F/R caliper pistons are designed to give you an already heavy front bias. So running a less aggressive rear pad would only increase your front bias.

mgerth

I switched from Yellows to XP10s up front and I'll never go back. The Carbotechs are miles ahead in grip. I've only done one day on them though, so its tough to comment on the wear.

Motul is the best fluid to go with if you can't afford the Castrol SRF IMO.

FerreiraCompetitions

Thats a vague comment, care to explain?

slofu

I think he's referring to EBC yellows, not Pagid.

mgerth

I'm not sure what is vauge about it... I've found the XP10s have a higher coefficient of friction compared to EBC Yellows. Is there a particular word that confused you?

mattbatson

I also use carbotech and love them. Great feel, great power, low rotor abuse.
I also use motul 600 and love it. I never have brake fade, and only bleed the brakes every other race.
Never had a problem.

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Sport compact car was claiming to only have to bleed the brakes on their EVO once every SEASON with Motul stuff. Hmm...

kommon_sense

I don't know that any of us should consider sport compact car to be an authority on anything Its good practice to bleed before every event regardless of how awesome the fluid is.

vansprinkle

I love my XP10 and XP8 setup on my Prelude. After about 5 track weekends (10 days @ 80 minutes a day) I still have plenty of pad left. And I like both the ATE blue and Motul 600. However, I am a little easier on my brakes than I would like to be and the track I am running is pretty fast in the corners.

From the results on this thread and my personal experience, I would say you are safe with XP10s and ATE or Motul.

hondachick81

[["Can anyone recommend another type of good pad? The Hawk blue is reported by many sources to leave a caustic layer of dust."]]

LMFAO!! how about the pad itself turns to dust after one track day....Hahaha

But A++++ for Carbotech XP10s!!