category5

Well 429 miles into the break in on my 06 rc51 and I think it has spun a bearing, this sucks a$$. It was pretty nice weather today, I had just headed out and planned on putting another hundred or so miles on it when all of the sudden the squealing started. I knew it wasn't gonna be good, as soon as I heard the squealing start It quickly worsened. I immediatly made my way to the side of the road and before I could make it to the shoulder it died. I tried to hit first and pop start it quick while I was still rolling...it had already siezed pretty good though. Let it cool off and tried to restart it but the starter wouldn't even turn it over. So, I had someone come get me with my truck and a ramp. Once I got her back home we tried to jump it with a more powerfull battery and that horible squaling sound was still there and it locked again. The dealership isn't open till tuesday, I'm gonna have them come get it then I guess.

rdblckSV650S

Yikes, had you been doing the oil changes and breaking in and what not?
That sucks terribly

bad-monkey

i hope the warranty takes care of you.

category5

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by slvrblckrdRC51 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yikes, had you been doing the oil changes and breaking in and what not?
That sucks terribly</TD></TR></TABLE>

That's the ironic thing...the honda dealership just did the first oil change and all that yesterday afternoon. In fact to oil still looks pristine. I have spun a bearing in one of my cars before and it never happened quite like this...this happened fast, like started making noise and within seconds locked up.

Ive been searching around and havn't found anything on the interweb about this happening...anyone ever heard of something like this happening so soon?

category5

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bad-monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

i hope the warranty takes care of you.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks dood...me too! Good news is, it looks like it well under the 1yr mark I'm just thankful that I have been pretty patient and havn't started modding it yet.

rdblckSV650S

Yea, i definitely think the dealership should take care of you. If they did the oil change, that's the only factor here. The bike was fine, then they changed the oil, then you spun a bearing. It makes me think maybe they didn't put enough oil in, or put the wrong weight in or something.

jungletronic

Sorry Lee
You've been talking about getting that bike for so long, and then this. I'm interested to see what caused it- let me know when they pull the engine apart. I know you were breaking it in right; I'm thinking assembly error. However, the proximity of the seizing to the dealership service is just too coincidental.

falcongsr

thats really strange. i'm tending to lean towards the dealer screwing something up over being something wrong from the factory.

i can't recall ever hearing or reading about something as catastrophic as early bearing failure from ANY manufacturer for YEARS.

category5

We'll see what happens...the dealership opens at 9am, so I'll keep everyone updated on how they handle everything If they let me I'll be there with the nikon when they crack the case open.

falcongsr

cervezas? (survey-says?)

category5

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by falcongsr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">cervezas? (survey-says?)
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Initial diagnosis was close, but no cigar...it was a seized cam journal on the top or, most upright cylinder caused by lack of oil. Service manager said that it chewed up the inside of the head pretty good and that they have ordered a new head and are in the process of checking and clearing all the oil passages. Should have her back middle of next week.

If I wasn't so sick right now I would go up there and take some pics...maybe friday if I'm feeling better.

The dealership has been really great, they have taken very good care of me...When I spoke to them on the phone yesterday and explained what happened they immediatly sent someone out and picked it up from my house. When the service manager called back first thing this morning the first thing he said was "This goes without saying but, this is all warranty work and of no cost to you whatsoever". Yeah Honda

falcongsr

I hope you feel better. Thanks for the detailed update. Sounds like a clogged oil passage killed the head. It could have been a lot worse.

I am glad the dealer is manning up and jumping on this. They know Honda's reputation as having dead reliable products is at stake. Not to mention it is likely the engine was fine before the oil change and something might have gotten into the engine during servicing to block a passage.

Matty.

for the update. I was pretty curious of the turnout. Sounds to me like they didn't put enough oil in, did not put oil in the new filter during replacement agravating a ticking time bomb, or maybe the wrong oil? I guess one could speculate forever but its nice that it all happened under warranty.

You should push for compensation of inconvience to tow the bike home and the time for not having a bike. Free oil changes for life is obviously out of the question.

jungletronic

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by falcongsr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Sounds like a clogged oil passage killed the head. It could have been a lot worse.

I am glad the dealer is manning up and jumping on this. They know Honda's reputation as having dead reliable products is at stake.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You are correct. As it turns out, it was a run of bad head gaskets from the factory; an oil passage hole in the gasket was perforated but not punched out. The dealer kept ordering new head gaskets (3 total, I believe) until they got one that was punched out properly. New head is on, Lee's back in action.

Kusai.Nihonjin.Desu

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jungletronic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
a run of bad head gaskets from the factory; an oil passage hole in the gasket was perforated but not punched out. The dealer kept ordering new head gaskets (3 total, I believe) until they got one that was punched out properly. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Wow. Crazy.

liam821

crazy glad you got your bike fixed though. Enjoy the RC51 thats a great bike!

PGK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SHORTBUS. &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> for the update. I was pretty curious of the turnout. Sounds to me like they didn't put enough oil in, did not put oil in the new filter during replacement agravating a ticking time bomb, or maybe the wrong oil? I guess one could speculate forever but its nice that it all happened under warranty.

You should push for compensation of inconvience to tow the bike home and the time for not having a bike. Free oil changes for life is obviously out of the question.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Let me preface my post by saying that I work at a dealership. Not a Honda dealership, but a dealership nonetheless.

I didn't want to throw up a post sooner because I didn't want to start a flame war, but what's with the "hate on dealers" bandwagon? I'm kind of curious. did you get shafted at some point? His dealership did nothing wrong. Not changing the filter isn't going to cause a cam journal to lunch itself, much less a rod bearing to spin. Putting in the 'wrong' oil isn't going to cause this kind of damage either. to some extent, oil is oil. naturally, engines are designed to use a specific grade of oil, but many are still made to be able to handle cold and warm weather oils—20/50 and 10/50, 10/50 and 5/50, whatever. putting in a thicker oil can cause oil pump cavitation, but that's a high-rpm problem, and in the break-in period, according to the manufacturer, high rpms are to be avoided. OEM's like to make oils pretty standard across a range of models anyways, making it difficult to put in the wrong oil—contrary to popular belief, they make it hard for techs to expletive up.

My point is that while blaming the dealership is easy, it is not correct. these people are here to help, not hinder. Most problems like this are due to manufacturing errors, hence warranties. Changing oil is not hard. Changing a filter is not hard. And that's basically the extent of a break-in service....

My first instinct, when i read this thread, was "something in the manufacturing was not right". I want to know why your instinct was "something at the dealership what not right". That's all really. I just want to know why youir first thought was that the dealership fucked up.

jungletronic

Aw man, take it easy...he was just stating the obvious: human error is a more likely scenario than Honda error.

Maybe even you thought he might be right, since you waited until now to post ("flame war" or not).

But it's all good, the humans ended up doing what the machines couldn't; your team won.

category5

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jungletronic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Aw man, take it easy...he was just stating the obvious: human error is a more likely scenario than Honda error.

Maybe even you thought he might be right, since you waited until now to post ("flame war" or not).

But it's all good, the humans ended up doing what the machines couldn't; your team won. </TD></TR></TABLE>

True, The dealership was great...the didn't have it very long at all. They did a great job from what I could tell.

Honda headgasket press: 1
RC51 Cam & Head: 0

I'm just glad to have it back!

falcongsr

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jungletronic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Aw man, take it easy...he was just stating the obvious: human error is a more likely scenario than Honda error. </TD></TR></TABLE>



Yeah I just hate on dealer mechanics because most are recent 20 yr old MMI grads that I wouldn't trust to know how to lace up sneakers let alone rip open my engine. I got to know the service dept at several local dealers and the majority of the mechanics downright scared me. But then again I am an overly **** engineer who works in defense and I think that skews my expectations of service. Its my *** out there when **** goes wrong, not theirs is all.

Matty.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PGK &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Let me preface my post by saying that I work at a dealership. Not a Honda dealership, but a dealership nonetheless.

I didn't want to throw up a post sooner because I didn't want to start a flame war, but what's with the "hate on dealers" bandwagon? I'm kind of curious. did you get shafted at some point? His dealership did nothing wrong. Not changing the filter isn't going to cause a cam journal to lunch itself, much less a rod bearing to spin. Putting in the 'wrong' oil isn't going to cause this kind of damage either. to some extent, oil is oil. naturally, engines are designed to use a specific grade of oil, but many are still made to be able to handle cold and warm weather oils—20/50 and 10/50, 10/50 and 5/50, whatever. putting in a thicker oil can cause oil pump cavitation, but that's a high-rpm problem, and in the break-in period, according to the manufacturer, high rpms are to be avoided. OEM's like to make oils pretty standard across a range of models anyways, making it difficult to put in the wrong oil—contrary to popular belief, they make it hard for techs to expletive up.

My point is that while blaming the dealership is easy, it is not correct. these people are here to help, not hinder. Most problems like this are due to manufacturing errors, hence warranties. Changing oil is not hard. Changing a filter is not hard. And that's basically the extent of a break-in service....

My first instinct, when i read this thread, was "something in the manufacturing was not right". I want to know why your instinct was "something at the dealership what not right". That's all really. I just want to know why youir first thought was that the dealership fucked up. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Bandwagon? Dealership fawked my **** in the past that's all. Ouch, salt on my wound...feel better now?

Jasper_db1

The incompetence at most of the local dealerships has been astounding. The shops that have a clue tend to service the European brands.

I can't stand going to Mission Motorsports