firstgenrex

why? is the gsr head harder to use on an ls block? ok thanks

ghost_ryder35

its not necicarly harder... it just costs a little bit more money

phatrick2332

The reason you should use the b16 head is becuz its the exact same casting as the Type R. The b16 head will most likely cost you less money to attain one also.

crx_88_si

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by phatrick2332 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The reason you should use the b16 head is becuz its the exact same casting as the Type R. The b16 head will most likely cost you less money to attain one also.</TD></TR></TABLE>

basically if you use a GSR head you are limited in your options.
1. costs more
2. must use a GSR intake manifold or a skunk2 or similar designed for the GSR head.

GSRCRXsi

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by crx_88_si &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
2. must use a GSR intake manifold or a skunk2 or similar designed for the GSR head.</TD></TR></TABLE>

your point? the skunk2 manifold is a damn fine manifold. people use them on b16 heads too. if you were gonna get an aftermarket manifold, wouldnt you buy it for the right application anyway?

people always whine about the bolt patter on the GSR IM, blah blah blah, wah wah wah. all you have to do is get it for a GSR rather then a B16

the only reason you should get the B16 head over the GSR head is if you are pressed for cash. GSR heads can be pricey, but they are a very nice head to use.

-KangaRod-

you should not use a Type R intake manifold (or any copy there of) on a head that was not designed for it IMHO. Get a custom manifold if porting is not a viable option. GsR heads and B16 heads are different, why would you use the same manifold.
The only reason people choose b16 heads over GsR heads is availability/cost.

ThefirstPACT

From what i have heard the b16 flows better than the GSR! i could be wrong but i am pretty sure i am right!

kaosbob

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ThefirstPACT &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">From what i have heard the b16 flows better than the GSR! i could be wrong but i am pretty sure i am right!</TD></TR></TABLE>

This is correct. The B16 is probably the best flowing head Honda had made. Not exactly sure how it rates up to the K-series.

CRexcellence

i have heard that too but i have also heard that the gsr head has better combustion characteristics.

*Boostwerks*

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by firstgenrex &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">why? is the gsr head harder to use on an ls block? ok thanks</TD></TR></TABLE>

- Cheaper
- Easier to fit in the 4th gens because of the intake mani
- OBD0 - wiring simplicity
- Flows better (to which is the reason they used it on the ITR)

ls_vtec_crx

i hope no one hates on me for this but i dont really like the look of the gsr manifold....just my opinion ...its not like i'll go up to you and say thats and ugly *** manifold....its just that i would rather have the simple b16 one

crx_88_si

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSRCRXsi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

your point? the skunk2 manifold is a damn fine manifold. people use them on b16 heads too. if you were gonna get an aftermarket manifold, wouldnt you buy it for the right application anyway?

people always whine about the bolt patter on the GSR IM, blah blah blah, wah wah wah. all you have to do is get it for a GSR rather then a B16

the only reason you should get the B16 head over the GSR head is if you are pressed for cash. GSR heads can be pricey, but they are a very nice head to use.</TD></TR></TABLE>

because the skunk2 manifold costs how much? a b16 IM can be had for MUCH less money. Personally, I'd rather save the few hundred dollars and get the b16 IM with ITR cams.

firstgenrex

i know of a gsrhead i can get for a decent price from a buddy and i wanna use it for ls/vtec. will the gsr head bolt up to the ls block fine? i heard there was differences but im not sure what they are and if they even matter. would i have more hp using a gsr head or a b16? i know gsr can rev higher... but i dont know if the power differences between a gsr and a b16 is in the block or the head because the compression is different, but they have different cams and etc... Also, the gsr manifold is tougher to put in a 4th gen? is it bigger or just more complicated? thanks

Targa250R

B16A heads are cheaper and easier to find. For 4th-gen Civics, they can be had with a pre-OBD ECU and wiring.

GSR head will make more power initially however, due to a better intake manifold and higher compression. P72 OBD-1 or OBD-2 ECU and some extra wiring are required for the intake manifold to work properly.

B16A head will make more power in the long run because it is designed to flow better with heavy modification (i.e. large cams, port & polish). Compression can be upped with better pistons and thinner head gasket.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by kaosbob &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

This is correct. The B16 is probably the best flowing head Honda had made. Not exactly sure how it rates up to the K-series.</TD></TR></TABLE>
B16A head doesn't even compare with K20A and F20C. Here are some flowbench charts:

Stock trim B16A and GSR heads:



B16A and GSR heads with "competition head work:"



B16A vs. K20A vs. F20C:



<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ls_vtec_crx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i hope no one hates on me for this but i dont really like the look of the gsr manifold....just my opinion ...its not like i'll go up to you and say thats and ugly *** manifold....its just that i would rather have the simple b16 one</TD></TR></TABLE>
Who cares what it looks like . . . the GSR manifold is superior to the B16A manifold, allowing for a significant increase in midrange torque.

alloutmotor

a properly ported gsr manifold should be good enough to flow enough air for alot of horsepower, plus u cant beat the stock look on the outside......

the reason why more people use b16 head is because they are easier to find and cheaper. also because the casting is the same used in the type R head, (the r is SLIGHTLY ported from the Factory)

GSR benefits because it has tighter combustion chamber leading to slightly higher compression numbers, in my opinion the b16 doesnt flow a whole lot more than the gsr head........

basically.....anyone u find in good condition for a good price take it.....

MassScene

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CRexcellence &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i have heard that too but i have also heard that the gsr head has better combustion characteristics. </TD></TR></TABLE> true

91sihatchback

im with bryson on this one

LS7

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ls_vtec_crx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i hope no one hates on me for this but i dont really like the look of the gsr manifold....just my opinion ...its not like i'll go up to you and say thats and ugly *** manifold....its just that i would rather have the simple b16 one</TD></TR></TABLE>
SO DOSE THIS WORLDS FASTEST ALL MOTOR ERIC's RACING.. LOL ALL GSR BABY!!!! oh by the way i got a b16a1 long block for sale. $700 shipped. or $600 pick up..with dizzy obd0 BRAND NEW timing belt and head gasket.


GSR ROCKS

Westrock2000

The heads flow differently. The B16 ports (as well as C5) are almost a straight shot from the intake port to the combustion chamber, meaning you can look in one and see out the other. This is excellent for high RPM. However the LS block is designed for a lower torque band and the GSR head builds upon that by having a head that flows between a B16 and the LS. The ports aren't as curved as an LS (which are super curved), thus allowing higher RPM capabilites then an LS, but still allows some low end torque. The Intake Manifold helps too, with dual runner profiles.

But yes it usually comes down to the fact that the B16 heads are usually cheaper, probably because there are a whole lot more, and most are usually older ones, where as GSR heads didn't become plentifull till 94-95. B16A3's still fetch a pretty penny you know.


Although the S2000 motor seems to flow better, it doesn't really perform that well especially when compared to a B18C5, only about 15-20 more HP for a much more advanced motor. Course some of that may be due to losses in a RWD vs a FWD.

XEF-9X

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mugen982 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
SO DOSE THIS WORLDS FASTEST ALL MOTOR ERIC's RACING.. LOL ALL GSR BABY!!!! oh by the way i got a b16a1 long block for sale. $700 shipped. or $600 pick up..with dizzy obd0 BRAND NEW timing belt and head gasket.


GSR ROCKS </TD></TR></TABLE>


erics racing dosent have the fastest all motor honda anymore.
They got beat!