deanazoom

Hi Guys, I have a Honda Civic LX 98' Sedan automatic 187k
Bought it used one year ago, I was told I'm an idiot for buying a car from a smog technician. Lesson Learned. Only regular oil changes and breaks replaced so far.
-6 months ago the car started shutting off while I'm driving it and at lights (had to wait a while and turned back on). I put engine cleaner in while I pumped tank about 4 times, and was told to pump 91 from then on (from a car mechanic friend)
-For the next 2-4 months it also had rpm would fluctuate (they would go lower) like it wanted to die but then I would gas it hard and get it running again, this would happen while driving anywhere, freeway and residential.
-Last week it has ALSO on some days been shutting off right after starting it but doesn't shut off completely you can hear the engine trying to make connections, like a spark plug was bad.

I took it to mechanic one #1- claimed ignitor issue wanted 300$ and said i would have a new key for the engine after that.
Mechanic #2- had car for 3 days, 6 months ago took these notes:
1- Tank side evap code 11456 (i put in a new gas cap)
2- Spark can be your ignition coil or ignitor
3- Fuel PGM- FI main relay - controls fuel pump
#2 also proved there was nothing wrong with the key while driving it and turning on and off.
As of today: Mechanic #3: duplicated the rpm issue only. He said I should change: Coil: 140, ignitor: 290, dist. housing: 360. cap and rotor: 75. ignition wires: 90. main relay: 80. labor 177 plus 59 diagnosis. 1200$

I was told by civicforums to ask for your sincere help!
(my post : Engine Shut off and Start Issues 98' Civic - Honda Civic Forum )

I just wana figure out which part in the distributor is bad. I doubt the whole thing needs replacing. What questions can I ask Mech #3 to find out if hes fully tested it and the relay? (his first phone call he said he tested the fuel pump with no issues and i think this is the relay right? why does he want it changed now?) Hes asking for his maximum 120$ for a diagnosis, i am willing to pay it but it doesnt sound like hes doing much work here besides replacing all parts that could potentially be the problem.

Sorry for long post. Appreciate any advice.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>Is the CEL on? &nbsp;Does the CEL work? &nbsp;Is the problem consistent, or intermittent? &nbsp;Does it only happen during certain conditions, or always? &nbsp;Do you own a multimeter?</p><p>There's nothing wrong with your long post. &nbsp;Detail is good, and you're already leaps and bounds ahead of half the idiots that post around here </p>

Former User

Did you inspect the plugs, wires, cap, and rotor - or - have you done a full ignition system tune up?

Have you cleaned the IACV?

White_EG1

Sometimes its easier cost wise to just replace the whole part. I never heard of 290 for any OEM honda ignition coil, thats a rip. But OP, I highly recommend you DIY, that $1200 bill could be turned into a $350 job, and with a brand new OEM honda distributor! But you can buy aftermarket for even less about 150-200.

deanazoom

Sorry I forgot to mention CEL is on for catalytic converter I think it was code p.145.. Mech #2 detected that 6 months ago and #3 confirmed it yesterday. But thats the only code showing.

I am sociology graduate, so no I have no done any testing on this car and do not own any tools to do so. However, I am a researcher and If you guys help me learn the lingo and the right questions to ask, I can make sure the mechanic tells me the status of these parts exactly.

Problem #1- car dying on idle happens once a week or so
#2- rmp fluctuating and car wanting to die after driving it over 5-10 min , usually on hot engine happens rain or shine, its been a very hot season in california although
#3- car wanting to shut off after one minute of being on, was a cold engine sitting in underground garage.

I dont know what an IACV is, and no I have not done anything except regular oil changes and breaks so far. I does need a tune up and some love and care, I just happen to not have luck on this issue. I will however do the basic tune ups soon with mech #2 as soon as his schedule frees up.

Former User

Hire a mechanic knowledgeable enough not to require help from a forum.

Post actual CEL codes because I see no match to a cat converter code.

The IACV controls the idle speed.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>So, you might not like to hear what I'm about to tell you, but it's the truth. &nbsp;Do with it what you will.</p><p>This forum exists to help people in DIY repairs, maintenance, and upgrades. &nbsp;The key there being DIY. &nbsp;Mechanics at shops are (or at least, should be) professionals who already know this stuff. &nbsp;If they can't figure it out, or if you don't trust their answers, it's time to find another mechanic. &nbsp;If we tell you what spec X should be, you're going to go to your mechanic, and question his ability to do his job. &nbsp;If you actually think that's necessary, then rather than telling him how to do what he's been doing for years, it's just time to find a new mechanic.</p><p>If you're willing to actually put in the time, get your hands greasy (or just wear gloves), and do the work, we can definitely point you in the right direction, and I'd be willing to bet that we could have your problem solved over a weekend (if you have the motivation and time), for less than half of what any of those mechanics want to charge you. &nbsp;If you just want to second guess the mechanic, just find a new one. &nbsp;Ask friends who they trust. &nbsp;Ask co-workers. &nbsp;Someone is bound to point you to someone who knows their ****.</p>

Jimi Hondrix

Deana. I'm going to cut to the chase for you and I hope you and the HT members don't mind or get upset.

Deana post this first on CF: Engine Shut off and Start Issues 98' Civic - Honda Civic Forum
She is not a mechanic and if you read through her post the last mechanic she brought it to seems to be trying to gouge her. I am a member on both sites and know what a great resource both, as well as other honda forums are. I referred in hopes that an HT member that lives in her area (San Jose,CA) may be able to help her directly or refer her to a reasonable, knowledgeable mechanic. This is the first time I've taken this liberty and not something I plan to repeat. I live in Florida and have never met or affiliated with Deana in any way. If admin deletes my response I fully understand.

Former User

OP should post in the NorCal regional forum if you wants help locating a Honda-knowledgeable mechanic in her area.

Northern California - Honda-Tech

Jimi Hondrix

Thanks Ron

deanazoom

I will ask tomorrow when I pick up the car what the exact code is. Sorry I couldnt remember off the top of my head.

Yeah I really want to DIY now that 3 mechanics are guessing at the car. I finally spoke to mech #2 who is a pro at honda's, hes just super busy I will have to wait two weeks before he will look at the car. He originally couldnt narrow down the problem because he couldnt duplicate the issue. So now its happening more frequently he feels he will be able to help.

He said based on my information that there is an air issue. Because when the rpms are jumpy and hitting the gas keeps the car going, it shows him that the ignitor and coil are responding.

But now Ill have to just wait for him to take a look at it. I was hoping to get more insight on forums so I can force mech #3 to diagnose the car, i'll have to pay him 120$ tomorrow. I wanted him to narrow down the problem, he knew already the issue has something to do with the distributor or relay, asking to just replace the whole lot is not very diagnostic IMO. I just wish i can be more assertive and talk car to get him to do meter tests and ohm's and find out where the fault is.

Former User

Probably just a dirty IACV. Pretty easy to clean. See FAQs sticky.

Fire him and don't look back.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>+1. &nbsp;If he can't figure out the difference between a relay problem and a distributor problem, he has no rights working at a shop.</p>

deanazoom

Lol I will tell him you said that! let's see his face change colors.
Acura Honda Connection - 12 Photos - Auto Repair - Downtown - San Jose, CA - Reviews - Yelp

I found him on yelp, I'm guessing they're fake ratings. =/

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>The most recent one was from over a year ago, 3APR14. &nbsp;That being said, though, even if they aren't fake, and even if they were all posted yesterday, not all shops treat all customers (or their cars) the same. &nbsp;Car people have biases. &nbsp;We all have something we're good with, and we all have stuff that we're **** with. &nbsp;Beyond that, we all have stuff we enjoy doing, and stuff that we hate doing. &nbsp;Maybe they're **** with ignition diagnostics, or maybe they just hate doing it.</p><p>Realistically, though, the tests you need to do are easy. &nbsp;The tools are cheap. &nbsp;The processes are easy. &nbsp;If you're interested in learning, we can walk you through it. &nbsp;Otherwise, check out the Northern California subforum that RonJ pointed you towards.</p>

Former User

Keen observation. Maybe the original owners sold the business and the new ones...aren't so good.

deanazoom

ahh you have to click show newest ratings first then it will show 2015. I just think with the rising cost of rent, mechanics here will try to rip anyone they can. Even I hate trying to survive this place, I am an overpriced babysitter, but I do quality work for what I charge. I just think its sad that its this hard to find a decent mechanic. and the ones that are good have waiting times for weeks. #firstworldproblems

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>Or the previous staff was actually good with Hondas, and the new staff are idiots. &nbsp;It could happen either way, but it definitely sounds like it happened one way or the other. &nbsp;Unfortunately, it's time to just cut your losses and find another shop, or pick up some simple tools and start the DIY&nbsp;</p>

Former User

Oops

Seems like you need to choose between waiting in line or learning work on your Civic. The latter this forum can help you with. For the former, you're on your own.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

<p>Well that's absolutely stupid. &nbsp;It defaults to newest first, but doesn't actually show newest until you tell it to show newest first?</p><p>Too bad that even with all of those reviews, they can't diagnose an ignition problem though </p>

Jimi Hondrix

Deana.. you are in good hands here. Good luck and hope you get the issue sorted soon.

deanazoom

Thanks for all your help guys. I feel very confident that I can fix this car soon without spending a bagillion bucks. Mech #3 only charged me 60$ bucks yesterday and told me none of the parts tested as defective and that the tach being sporatic is something electrical in his opinion. He kept saying you can't test relay and coil and other parts. He was definitely being lazy. He did say some parts were aftermarket on distributor and that the wires were OEM.
Mech #2 put me on the waiting list and I'm certain it will get solved.
The car ran perfectly today haha. I just wish it would fail so It can be easier to diagnose!

Former User

Tach issue may point to ICM. Call some AutoZone stores to see if they'll test it for you.

deanazoom

will go to autozone right now for that! the CEL code p 420 catalytic converter, its aftermarket, can that be repaired? is it all one piece with manifold (muffler shop was asking me)

Former User

You need to remove ICM, if they will test it.