ttcheung97

spent a good hour or so combing the previous posts on "not starting," but not sure if my scenario is the same as the other posters.

I recently converted my 94 EX wagon from automatic to manual, and it's been running fine for the past week. I even hooked-up the clutch safety switch and it works fine. but this past weekend i parked it in the garage, and later in the hot afternoon, the car wouldn't start. however, it started again fine tht night, when the temperature died down. this led me to start thinking of the fuel main relay. the next day it starts up fine, but when i was coming home from lunch, it wouldn't start on the first try; i had to frantically turn the key a few times until it finally started right up.

I've swapped the main fuel relay back and forth with my donor car with no effect, taken the starter to Autozone to make sure it's working, check the wires and battery cables. I DO hear a single click from the engnie bay (starer?) as well as a click felt in the main fuel relay when the key's turned and clutch is down, and NO click when key's turned and clutch is up, so i know the clutch safety switch is working.

I was told to check out the ignition switch or even the main relay under the dash, behind the cruise control box. do i really have to contort myself in that position again?

YeuEmMaiMai

starter relay?

hondamark35

have you concidered or checked the battery yet?

ttcheung97

The battery is fine, it lights up everything and the headlights are strong.
Where would the starter relay be? I know I should be going to town with a multimeter at this point, but just wanted some guidance before I started.

Sungsu

exactly how is yours not starting though? is is cranking? or does it not crank at all?

213374U

Seems to be the response of the day for me, but check your grounds man. 9 times out of 10, my no start problem has been fixed this way.

ttcheung97

doesn't crank, you just hear a click from the engine bay. no buzzing you'd hear when the battery's dead.

i was too fed up with putting the starter back in after the trip to autozone, so i'll have to be more meticulous when i put it back in this afternoon.

P_Adams

try jumping it from a known good car, but THIS time try it this way:

Positive jumper cable:
Battery Positive Post (jump(er)) to Battery Positive post (Jump(ee)).
Negative jumper cable:
Battery negative Post (jump(er)) to Steel Engine Bracket (Jump(ee)).

This effectively takes your battery, your negative Battery cable and the engine grounds out of the equation.
If your starter starts lighting off from this, you'll know where to start looking.

P

213374U

X2, definitely a ground if P's jump method works. Give it a go and let us know.

ttcheung97

engine bracket as in engine mount? the one in the front?

Could you explain how jumping it in this way would eliminate what you listed out?

P_Adams

Any substantial piece of steel/iron which attaches to the engine.

P

uberEFtuner

BAD distributor, check for spark.

TOAB

It's not cranking, the dizzy isn't going to do anything until the engine turns.

mclovinF22

Bad or loose ground..... if your car is getting power but not turning over its more then likely a loose or bad ground.... if it isn't that then it could be your ignition

ttcheung97

thanks for all the input guys. i went ahead and started putting things back in, and took a look at the grounds. I remember having to contort one of the lower gauge ground wires onto the transmission, and by doing so a lot of the wire got pulled out of the crimping. Therefore I think the remaining wire that WAS grounded wasn't able to handle the substantial current. Therefore I wrapped a bunch of electrical tap and made sure the crimp was getting all of the ground wire. bolted everything back up and ka-ching!, started right now. went out to dinner with the family and had confident starting it up as well.

I think the "click" noise was the starter gear extracting itself and coming into contact with the flywheel teeth. however since there wasn't enough current to flow through the wire, all the starter could do was extract the gear out.

i'm not sure if wrapping the electrical tape is a long term solution, but i noticed there was previously tape on there that was becoming loose. Since I didn't have a crimping tool, I just wrapped it a few layers and hoped there won't be too much heat to melt the tape when i start the car.

thanks again guys.

213374U

Like I said, first thing to check in a "No Start" situation. Congrats

ttcheung97

would electrical tape around the crimping suffice? here's the ground i was talking about.

213374U

Just go to Autozone and pick up another crimp that size, shouldn't be more than a buck or two. Cut the old one off, crimp the new one on and no more problem. With the electrical tape, it might work but it'll always be "just one of those things" that's wrong with your car.

Do it right the first time

P_Adams

That's a pretty substantial crimp for a set of hand held crimps.
A more viable option (if he can reinsert the cable) is to have it soldered. If he can find some room; a propane powered Weller Portasol soldering pen or a 100watt soldering iron will do the trick.

P

ttcheung97

update: i took the ground cable from my donor car (i had performed an auto-to-manual swap), and then cleaned off the old junk on the wire, bolted it and down, and with a cold engine, the starter cranked it up.

HOWEVER, i turned off the engine, waited a few minutes, and then tried starting the car, and it wouldn't start. Therefore I have two options, push start, OR, something that i've noticed, I push the car slightly, pop the clutch so the engine will rotate a stroke or two, and then the starter will THEN be able to start-up the engine. I'm thinking the engine rotating to a non-compression stroke reduces the amount of power necessary on the starter.

I've ALSO noticed that there's like an EXTREMELY brief delay between the ignition at "start" and the actual starter starting. Just now, I did the "hot-start" and noticed the "click" i mentioned, immediately followed by the starter cranking the engine.

I'm starting to wonder if it IS the starter, since it seems like it's reluctant to crank after having successfully cranked previously. Autozone make it spin, but it didn't check for resistance or output or such. I could also be doing too much wishful thinking here. Your help's much appreciated.

TOAB

Electrical stuff thats on its way south usually doesn't work too well after it gets warmed up... got a spare starter laying around?

P_Adams

I'm thinking starter. Either the starter solenoid has a bad (burnt) spot on the contact plate or the armature brushes are worn and have lost spring tension. Either way, the starter replaces as an assembly.

Deathzone can't test the starter's draw (since it has nothing to 'work' against) while on the bench.

P

ttcheung97

deathzone, nice one. the rep at the autozone even gave me a "dislclaimer," along the lines of, "yeah man, i also read in the forums that people shouldn't take stuff to get tested at autozone. but i mean, i work here, and i've been using that machine (the tester for my starter) and it's always been good, i mean, yeah, i read the forums too, so yeah dude."

hahahaha....

when the car was automatic, it always started fine, even in hot weather. My family and i recently went around town on the city's annual garage sale, strictly city driving, stopping every 15 minutes. not a problem. therefore i'd just like to get a bit more support on the starter being the culprit since it's $80 with a core and i wouldn't want to look like fool push starting after replacing the unit.

I have a spare starter, unfortunately it's an automatic starter. Doh.

213374U

Pull the starter. Grab a set of jumper cables and hook em up. Now with the positive side, connect that to the starter. Take your ground and bump it against the body of the starter, it should engage.

Just a quick way to make sure the starter's good/bad.

ttcheung97

the car's been sitting in the garage all day, and i nthe afternoon it started up fine, no hesitation or anything. i even started four more times afterwards, not a problem. so now it's basking on the driveway; hoping that'll make the starter NOT work. hahaha...