94 EX A/C problem
06-19-2006, 01:06 PM
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94 EX A/C problem
When I hit the A/C button the compressor does not come on.
I brought it to a local shop and they said it was a relay, when they jumped it everything worked fine. But they could not locate the relay and said to take it to the dealer.
The dealer told me its the right front wheel fender harness thats causing everything, and they want over 400 dollars to replace it! I asked them if they could rig a way to make it stay on, and of course they cant do that. I dont see how the fender harness could cause everything, the relay sounds feasable though.
How could I check the relay myself? And how could the fender harness cause the problem?
I brought it to a local shop and they said it was a relay, when they jumped it everything worked fine. But they could not locate the relay and said to take it to the dealer.
The dealer told me its the right front wheel fender harness thats causing everything, and they want over 400 dollars to replace it! I asked them if they could rig a way to make it stay on, and of course they cant do that. I dont see how the fender harness could cause everything, the relay sounds feasable though.
How could I check the relay myself? And how could the fender harness cause the problem?
06-19-2006, 01:44 PM
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Re: 94 EX A/C problem (silverbluevtec)
I thought I had this same exact problem last night & almost tore my entire car apart to find the source, but before I did, I went to a local shop & had them check if the ac was charged. If it is not charged properly, the compresor will not turn on. Turns out my ac system wasnt charged because I forgot to turn off the ac when I gunned it one day & uberdata doesnt know to turn the compressor off under heavy acceleration... 
& all the freon purged out.
Standard cost at a shop for a freon recharge/check is about $40-$50 well worth it in my case..
If you find that this is not the problem, post up again & I will show you a pic of the relay.
& all the freon purged out. Standard cost at a shop for a freon recharge/check is about $40-$50 well worth it in my case..
If you find that this is not the problem, post up again & I will show you a pic of the relay.
06-19-2006, 02:23 PM
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Re: 94 EX A/C problem (Intense2.2)
i dont think that not having ur ac charged would affect the compressor from engaing. I had the same problem with 95 lx and it turned out 2 be the relay. I jumped the relay.i aplied dirrect battery voltage to the red wire on th ecompressor and it worked. The relay should be located right on the corner of the radiator. If its not there look around the power steering resevoir thats where mine was it was broken because the dumbasses that changed my radiator just ripped it off
06-19-2006, 03:19 PM
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Re: 94 EX A/C problem (loup05)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by loup05 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i dont think that not having ur ac charged would affect the compressor from engaing. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Not enough pressure in the a/c system & the compressor will not turn on. That is a fact. Jumping a relay is not a good idea either, there is a reason the relay is there. I hope you dont fry your ecu.
Not enough pressure in the a/c system & the compressor will not turn on. That is a fact. Jumping a relay is not a good idea either, there is a reason the relay is there. I hope you dont fry your ecu.
06-20-2006, 01:09 AM
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Re: 94 EX A/C problem (Intense2.2)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Intense2.2 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Not enough pressure in the a/c system & the compressor will not turn on. That is a fact. Jumping a relay is not a good idea either, there is a reason the relay is there. I hope you dont fry your ecu. </TD></TR></TABLE>
amen, there's a big **** post in the GDD about this also.
it's the idiot-proof way to safe your system from blowing up, well i guess you can't stop all idiot from monkeying the car
Not enough pressure in the a/c system & the compressor will not turn on. That is a fact. Jumping a relay is not a good idea either, there is a reason the relay is there. I hope you dont fry your ecu.
</TD></TR></TABLE>amen, there's a big **** post in the GDD about this also.
it's the idiot-proof way to safe your system from blowing up, well i guess you can't stop all idiot from monkeying the car
06-20-2006, 02:21 PM
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Thanks for your replies. I will bring it to a shop and get a recharge.
How could I tell if the relay is bad though? Since they originally told me one of them is bad.
How could I tell if the relay is bad though? Since they originally told me one of them is bad.
06-21-2006, 04:04 AM
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Wait up. A lot of mis information in this thread.
Even if your a/c is empty, the compressor will still turn on and after a second or two turn off when the low pressure switch cuts it off due to lack of pressure caused by lack of r12 or 134a depending upon the year of car in question. The compressor will continue to cycle on and off as the ECU tells it to turn on and the pressure switch cuts it off as long as the A/C button is in the ON position.
If your compressor is not turning on at all it is acceptable to bypass the relay by going straight to battery voltage to see if the compressor engages. This will not harm your ECU in anyway uless you do something wrong.
On r134a systems there is a high pressure cut off switch that can cause the system to cut in and out
If your system is properly charged and by passing the relay causes it to work, test to see if the relay is getting a signal from the ECU. If it is, replace relay. If it is not, check wiring to ECU and if there is no signal present at ECU repair or replace ecu. If there is a signal present, repair wiring.
ALso, a broken high or low pressure switch will cause the A/C not to work as well
Even if your a/c is empty, the compressor will still turn on and after a second or two turn off when the low pressure switch cuts it off due to lack of pressure caused by lack of r12 or 134a depending upon the year of car in question. The compressor will continue to cycle on and off as the ECU tells it to turn on and the pressure switch cuts it off as long as the A/C button is in the ON position.
If your compressor is not turning on at all it is acceptable to bypass the relay by going straight to battery voltage to see if the compressor engages. This will not harm your ECU in anyway uless you do something wrong.
On r134a systems there is a high pressure cut off switch that can cause the system to cut in and out
If your system is properly charged and by passing the relay causes it to work, test to see if the relay is getting a signal from the ECU. If it is, replace relay. If it is not, check wiring to ECU and if there is no signal present at ECU repair or replace ecu. If there is a signal present, repair wiring.
ALso, a broken high or low pressure switch will cause the A/C not to work as well
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06-21-2006, 09:47 AM
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Re: (YeuEmMaiMai)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by YeuEmMaiMai »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Wait up. A lot of mis information in this thread.
Even if your a/c is empty, the compressor will still turn on and after a second or two turn off when the low pressure switch cuts it off due to lack of pressure caused by lack of r12 or 134a depending upon the year of car in question. The compressor will continue to cycle on and off as the ECU tells it to turn on and the pressure switch cuts it off as long as the A/C button is in the ON position.
If your compressor is not turning on at all it is acceptable to bypass the relay by going straight to battery voltage to see if the compressor engages. This will not harm your ECU in anyway uless you do something wrong.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Talk about bad info... The compresor WILL NOT turn on at all if there is insufficient pressure. As far as giving the compressor 12v to see if it engages, nothing will happen if you have the car off. Just check to see if the clutch kicks, but as far as jumping the relay to use the ac constantly... not a good idea. If you look at a wiring diagram, you will see that there is a strong possibility thet you will fry your ecu should anything happen, hence the reason for the relay.
Even if your a/c is empty, the compressor will still turn on and after a second or two turn off when the low pressure switch cuts it off due to lack of pressure caused by lack of r12 or 134a depending upon the year of car in question. The compressor will continue to cycle on and off as the ECU tells it to turn on and the pressure switch cuts it off as long as the A/C button is in the ON position.
If your compressor is not turning on at all it is acceptable to bypass the relay by going straight to battery voltage to see if the compressor engages. This will not harm your ECU in anyway uless you do something wrong.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Talk about bad info... The compresor WILL NOT turn on at all if there is insufficient pressure. As far as giving the compressor 12v to see if it engages, nothing will happen if you have the car off. Just check to see if the clutch kicks, but as far as jumping the relay to use the ac constantly... not a good idea. If you look at a wiring diagram, you will see that there is a strong possibility thet you will fry your ecu should anything happen, hence the reason for the relay.
06-21-2006, 05:45 PM
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Re: (Intense2.2)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Intense2.2 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Talk about bad info... The compresor WILL NOT turn on at all if there is insufficient pressure. As far as giving the compressor 12v to see if it engages, nothing will happen if you have the car off. Just check to see if the clutch kicks, but as far as jumping the relay to use the ac constantly... not a good idea. If you look at a wiring diagram, you will see that there is a strong possibility thet you will fry your ecu should anything happen, hence the reason for the relay. </TD></TR></TABLE>
You figure it out. how can you sense low pressure if the compressor does not run? The compressor HAS TO ENGAGE FOR A SHORT TIME SO THE SYSTEM CAN DETECT pressure within the system. If it does not, it cuts the compressor but since the A/C is engaged via the relay, the compressor just continues to cycle on and off
Putting +12 straight to the clutch will cause it to engage car on or off since you are coming straight from battery. Try again
Talk about bad info... The compresor WILL NOT turn on at all if there is insufficient pressure. As far as giving the compressor 12v to see if it engages, nothing will happen if you have the car off. Just check to see if the clutch kicks, but as far as jumping the relay to use the ac constantly... not a good idea. If you look at a wiring diagram, you will see that there is a strong possibility thet you will fry your ecu should anything happen, hence the reason for the relay. </TD></TR></TABLE>
You figure it out. how can you sense low pressure if the compressor does not run? The compressor HAS TO ENGAGE FOR A SHORT TIME SO THE SYSTEM CAN DETECT pressure within the system. If it does not, it cuts the compressor but since the A/C is engaged via the relay, the compressor just continues to cycle on and off
Putting +12 straight to the clutch will cause it to engage car on or off since you are coming straight from battery. Try again
06-21-2006, 07:33 PM
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Re: (YeuEmMaiMai)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by YeuEmMaiMai »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
You figure it out. how can you sense low pressure if the compressor does not run? The compressor HAS TO ENGAGE FOR A SHORT TIME SO THE SYSTEM CAN DETECT pressure within the system. If it does not, it cuts the compressor but since the A/C is engaged via the relay, the compressor just continues to cycle on and off
Putting +12 straight to the clutch will cause it to engage car on or off since you are coming straight from battery. Try again</TD></TR></TABLE>
When I said "nothing will happen when you put 12v directly to it" I meant that there was no danger involved in seeing if the clutch would click. I did not mean that nothing would happen if the car was off.
Keep in mind that im not saying that there is nothing wrong with the relay or wiring, but before tearing the car apart & spending alot of money on a relay, it would be best to have a shop check the pressure in the lines.
Now you can argue with me till your blue in the face about the compressor turning on without enough pressure, but your making an *** out of yourself everytime you say that. So do us all a favor & know what the hell your talking about before you give misleading information.
You figure it out. how can you sense low pressure if the compressor does not run? The compressor HAS TO ENGAGE FOR A SHORT TIME SO THE SYSTEM CAN DETECT pressure within the system. If it does not, it cuts the compressor but since the A/C is engaged via the relay, the compressor just continues to cycle on and off
Putting +12 straight to the clutch will cause it to engage car on or off since you are coming straight from battery. Try again</TD></TR></TABLE>
When I said "nothing will happen when you put 12v directly to it" I meant that there was no danger involved in seeing if the clutch would click. I did not mean that nothing would happen if the car was off.
Keep in mind that im not saying that there is nothing wrong with the relay or wiring, but before tearing the car apart & spending alot of money on a relay, it would be best to have a shop check the pressure in the lines.
Now you can argue with me till your blue in the face about the compressor turning on without enough pressure, but your making an *** out of yourself everytime you say that. So do us all a favor & know what the hell your talking about before you give misleading information.
06-22-2006, 05:24 AM
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Re: (Intense2.2)
OK you asked for it
I didn't want to do this but since you think you are mr know it all so I thought I would educate your ingorance. start by reading this.
http://www.carcare.org/Climate...shtml
"Maintenance Tips/Suggestions: Symptoms of a low refrigerant charge include poor cooling and frequent engagement and disengagement of the A/C compressor. This may also be accompanied by an engine that changes speed with the cycling of the A/C clutch and compressor. "
http://reviews.ebay.com/A-C-Di...46036
"Symptoms of low refrigerant include rapid cycling of the compressor clutch, or clutch will not engage, little or no cooling, very oily spots on A/C components."
HOnda cars DO cycle the compressor.....how do I know you ask? well because I have TWO OF THEM
If you need more links Google it
I didn't want to do this but since you think you are mr know it all so I thought I would educate your ingorance. start by reading this.
http://www.carcare.org/Climate...shtml
"Maintenance Tips/Suggestions: Symptoms of a low refrigerant charge include poor cooling and frequent engagement and disengagement of the A/C compressor. This may also be accompanied by an engine that changes speed with the cycling of the A/C clutch and compressor. "
http://reviews.ebay.com/A-C-Di...46036
"Symptoms of low refrigerant include rapid cycling of the compressor clutch, or clutch will not engage, little or no cooling, very oily spots on A/C components."
HOnda cars DO cycle the compressor.....how do I know you ask? well because I have TWO OF THEM
If you need more links Google it
06-22-2006, 05:25 AM
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Re: (sj993)
usually they are located on the receiver/dryer (low pressure) and on the discharge side of the compressor in the line (high pressre)
06-22-2006, 11:36 PM
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Re: 94 EX A/C problem (silverbluevtec)
well here's what I do.. First things first, does the clutch engage. No, disconnect the connector before the thermo protector and jump power to it. If the thermo protector works still, the clutch should engage. If not, try jumping power to the clutch after the thermo protector.
As for pressure, you'll have to consult the manual, it tells you at what psi each of the pressure switches turns on/off at. but if you want to make things easy, I usually just disconnect the switches and use a jumper wire to jump the switch.
As for pressure, you'll have to consult the manual, it tells you at what psi each of the pressure switches turns on/off at. but if you want to make things easy, I usually just disconnect the switches and use a jumper wire to jump the switch.
06-23-2006, 12:53 PM
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Re: (YeuEmMaiMai)
Wrong, Wrong, and more Wrong!!!
On Honda vehicles, the ECU will try to cycle the compressor but compressor will not even engage if there is a low charge of system. The pressure switch is only a full on or full off switch and either provides a complete circuit to the relay (when a full charge exists) or opens the circuit to the relay( when an insufficient charge exists) keeping the relay from powering the compressor. This keeps the compressor from engaging to save the compressor from getting hot and possibly locking up.
Instead of jumping the relay ( A big no-no in my book) the safer method is to jumper the pressure switch connector and see if the compressor engages. This will "kill 2 diagnostic birds with one stone" so to speak. You'll be able to tell of you have a low charge by whether or not the compressor cycles on, it'll also tell you if the relay is operating as well as if the fans operate when compressor comes on (which they should).
There have been a few issues of the harness at the relays (on the drivers side of the radiator/condenser can shroud) getting chaffed and causing a short or open. It sounds as if you had it diagnosed before and this it what they found. If so, you need to isolate the broken or chaffed wires, repair them and add some corrugated tubing (wire loom) to the harness. This should repair the harness and repair the A/C issues as well as make a lasting repair for the harness and not let this happen again.
There does happen to be a lot if misinformation on this forum at times so heed caution when taking advice here....
On Honda vehicles, the ECU will try to cycle the compressor but compressor will not even engage if there is a low charge of system. The pressure switch is only a full on or full off switch and either provides a complete circuit to the relay (when a full charge exists) or opens the circuit to the relay( when an insufficient charge exists) keeping the relay from powering the compressor. This keeps the compressor from engaging to save the compressor from getting hot and possibly locking up.
Instead of jumping the relay ( A big no-no in my book) the safer method is to jumper the pressure switch connector and see if the compressor engages. This will "kill 2 diagnostic birds with one stone" so to speak. You'll be able to tell of you have a low charge by whether or not the compressor cycles on, it'll also tell you if the relay is operating as well as if the fans operate when compressor comes on (which they should).
There have been a few issues of the harness at the relays (on the drivers side of the radiator/condenser can shroud) getting chaffed and causing a short or open. It sounds as if you had it diagnosed before and this it what they found. If so, you need to isolate the broken or chaffed wires, repair them and add some corrugated tubing (wire loom) to the harness. This should repair the harness and repair the A/C issues as well as make a lasting repair for the harness and not let this happen again.
There does happen to be a lot if misinformation on this forum at times so heed caution when taking advice here....
06-23-2006, 01:16 PM
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Re: (hondatim)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hondatim »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Wrong, Wrong, and more Wrong!!!
On Honda vehicles, the ECU will try to cycle the compressor but compressor will not even engage if there is a low charge of system. The pressure switch is only a full on or full off switch and either provides a complete circuit to the relay (when a full charge exists) or opens the circuit to the relay( when an insufficient charge exists) keeping the relay from powering the compressor. This keeps the compressor from engaging to save the compressor from getting hot and possibly locking up.
Instead of jumping the relay ( A big no-no in my book) the safer method is to jumper the pressure switch connector and see if the compressor engages. This will "kill 2 diagnostic birds with one stone" so to speak. You'll be able to tell of you have a low charge by whether or not the compressor cycles on, it'll also tell you if the relay is operating as well as if the fans operate when compressor comes on (which they should).
There have been a few issues of the harness at the relays (on the drivers side of the radiator/condenser can shroud) getting chaffed and causing a short or open. It sounds as if you had it diagnosed before and this it what they found. If so, you need to isolate the broken or chaffed wires, repair them and add some corrugated tubing (wire loom) to the harness. This should repair the harness and repair the A/C issues as well as make a lasting repair for the harness and not let this happen again.
There does happen to be a lot if misinformation on this forum at times so heed caution when taking advice here.... </TD></TR></TABLE>
THANK YOU!
On Honda vehicles, the ECU will try to cycle the compressor but compressor will not even engage if there is a low charge of system. The pressure switch is only a full on or full off switch and either provides a complete circuit to the relay (when a full charge exists) or opens the circuit to the relay( when an insufficient charge exists) keeping the relay from powering the compressor. This keeps the compressor from engaging to save the compressor from getting hot and possibly locking up.
Instead of jumping the relay ( A big no-no in my book) the safer method is to jumper the pressure switch connector and see if the compressor engages. This will "kill 2 diagnostic birds with one stone" so to speak. You'll be able to tell of you have a low charge by whether or not the compressor cycles on, it'll also tell you if the relay is operating as well as if the fans operate when compressor comes on (which they should).
There have been a few issues of the harness at the relays (on the drivers side of the radiator/condenser can shroud) getting chaffed and causing a short or open. It sounds as if you had it diagnosed before and this it what they found. If so, you need to isolate the broken or chaffed wires, repair them and add some corrugated tubing (wire loom) to the harness. This should repair the harness and repair the A/C issues as well as make a lasting repair for the harness and not let this happen again.
There does happen to be a lot if misinformation on this forum at times so heed caution when taking advice here.... </TD></TR></TABLE>
THANK YOU!
06-23-2006, 02:45 PM
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Re: (Intense2.2)
I think that the main misunderstanding here is over the fact that the compressor will cycle on and off with a low charge but that is not because the ECU is cycling through a wait and see / try again type scenario.
When the system is off, the pressure between the high side and the low side equalizes and may very well be high enough on the low side with this boost to allow the compressor to start. Once running the pressure drops on the low side to a value lower than the pressure switch cutout and the compressor clutch releases. The pressures begin to equalize again, the switch gets made and the clutch grabs hold.
Now if there is a total loss of charge, there will be no cycling.
hondatim is correct.
When the system is off, the pressure between the high side and the low side equalizes and may very well be high enough on the low side with this boost to allow the compressor to start. Once running the pressure drops on the low side to a value lower than the pressure switch cutout and the compressor clutch releases. The pressures begin to equalize again, the switch gets made and the clutch grabs hold.
Now if there is a total loss of charge, there will be no cycling.
hondatim is correct.
06-23-2006, 03:19 PM
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Re: (hondatim)
uhh you want to go check out a 5th gen and come back?
I have a 94 honda that came to me with a low charge and it CONSTANTLY cycled the compressor on and off. replacing the leaking line and recharging the system resolved the issue. Now 4 years later it still works.
And I never said jump the relay, I said apply +12 from the battery to the clutch. The only way to propery do that is to UNPLUG the relay and apply +12 directly to the clutch
I have a 94 honda that came to me with a low charge and it CONSTANTLY cycled the compressor on and off. replacing the leaking line and recharging the system resolved the issue. Now 4 years later it still works.
And I never said jump the relay, I said apply +12 from the battery to the clutch. The only way to propery do that is to UNPLUG the relay and apply +12 directly to the clutch
06-23-2006, 11:09 PM
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Re: 94 EX A/C problem (silverbluevtec)
ahy ahy ahy..........you talk about a mess holy cow........
If someone jumped the relay and the system worked..
you got electrical issues.. wether it is a bad relay or wiring leading to the relay and not energizing it...
this is what you do,,,,,start from the top ,,,first off chk the fuses..
underdash fuse # 8 ,,7.5 amps ,, and underhood fuse # 34 20 amps.
now the relay is located on top rt side of radiator. it has 4 wires going to it
black/yellow... white... red/blue.... red...
turn the ign switch on,, get a test lite and chk for power at the white and blak/yellow wires.... chk for ground at the red/blue wire...
if you get no power at either the white or black/yellow wire and the fuse was ok,, you got a wiring issue from the fuse box to the relay....
if you got power on both,,
you need to have ground on the red/blue wire to energize the relay and power to go to the red wire which in turn powers the compressor
if you get no ground let me know i will help you diagnose further... cause ground supply goes throuh the ecu,,
try these tests and post the results..
If someone jumped the relay and the system worked..
you got electrical issues.. wether it is a bad relay or wiring leading to the relay and not energizing it...
this is what you do,,,,,start from the top ,,,first off chk the fuses..
underdash fuse # 8 ,,7.5 amps ,, and underhood fuse # 34 20 amps.
now the relay is located on top rt side of radiator. it has 4 wires going to it
black/yellow... white... red/blue.... red...
turn the ign switch on,, get a test lite and chk for power at the white and blak/yellow wires.... chk for ground at the red/blue wire...
if you get no power at either the white or black/yellow wire and the fuse was ok,, you got a wiring issue from the fuse box to the relay....
if you got power on both,,
you need to have ground on the red/blue wire to energize the relay and power to go to the red wire which in turn powers the compressor
if you get no ground let me know i will help you diagnose further... cause ground supply goes throuh the ecu,,
try these tests and post the results..
07-17-2006, 10:31 AM
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I took my car to a shop and they did a A/C recharge and it didnt work. They tried for hours and said it was something electrical and they couldnt figure it out.
The dealer wants to charge me 350.00 to put in a new fender wiring harness, which they claim is the cause of it not working.
The dealer wants to charge me 350.00 to put in a new fender wiring harness, which they claim is the cause of it not working.
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