Dunc

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by earl &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I don't want to give out the power but it was way above the 600 level. After the race, the motor was making noise. We tore it down and everything looked perfect except there was a funny wear pattern on the piston skirts on 2 of the pistons. There were no signs of detonation on the pistons and the bearings looked perfect. That is when we noticed that the rods did not look straight.
I think the Carillos would be fine for an allmotor application. I would rather run Eagles than Carillos in a boosted situation, however. I will take the blame for choosing the Carillos as I fell for the hype without doing enough research. The engine is now living fine with Pauters. I was just extremely disappointed in the lack of customer support and information coming from Carillo. I'm not telling anyone not to run them, just sharing my experience. This happend several months ago and I have held back on posting this until my emotions were under control on the situation. Everyone should make their own choices.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well what do they rate the rods at either through calling them or in a spec catalog?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93LSivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Way to go ahead and try to wreak another companies image Whats funny, is in the Carrillo catalog it says plain as day that you shouldn't use these in anything more than a mild all motor build. 50hp a hole to be exact. I would blame myself for the poor choice of rod useage.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Dude, don't get your panties all up in a bunch. If you actually think about it, H-T.com is not really that big or influential in the world marketplace. There is only a small percentage of honda owners....and a even smaller percentage of boosted owners that actually come on here and read threads. So to say that Earl just wrecked the company's sale figures is assnine and quite simply ignorant (not to sound mean, but it's true and you know it). He knows his stuff mechanically and in theory from everything I see, but the one thing he is not is an economic tide turning honda god. At the end of the day, H-T.com is just yet another car forum that only a few people out of the entire population will visit and it's not going to make any difference all to anything.


Modified by Dunc at 1:41 PM 2/13/2006

Justin Olson

Download the PDF catalog here:

http://www.carrilloind.com/05bro4.pdf

Read page 15:

PRO H VS. PRO A BEAM


Why are Pro-A rods less expensive than the H-Beam rods?

The difference lies in our manufacturing process. All Carrillo Connecting rods are manufactured in our facility in San Clemente, California. Both parts start out with the same forging; a proprietary chrome/nickel/vanadium alloy, denoted specifically as Carrilloloy, a steel mixture. The difference is that an A-Beam requires approximately 1/5th less machine time. Furthermore, we manufacture Pro-A only in large quantities to make it more cost effective. Since Carrillo Pro-A Connecting rods are offered only in limited part numbers with stock dimensions and H-bolts, labor costs are reduced as well.


Are Carrillo Pro-A rods as strong as Carrillo H-Beam rods?

We make the strongest H-Beam connecting rod for high performance applications on
the market. The Carrillo Pro-A rod is designed for less demanding and more economically oriented applications.


Why does Carrillo only offer the WMC (H-11) fastener in the
Pro-A Series of connecting rods?

In concert with the lesser-stressed applications the WMC fastener equates with the
design and application of the Pro-A connecting rod.


Does the Pro-A rod replace the H-Beam rod?

No, it is an addition to our product line. With the introduction of the Pro-A rod, Carrillo’s focus is to reach our customers who want the best connecting rod available for their particular requirements.

Unsivil_audio

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by earl &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">This happend several months ago and I have held back on posting this until my emotions were under control on the situation.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Good call. All fact no fiction. That sucks about the rods though its too bad about their customer service considering how good of a reputation they had.

93LSivic

To DUNC and 95GSRTT......

Im just calling it as I see it fella's. If he knew the A rods were designed for a different application Im sure he would have not used them, since he doesnt sell Carrillo (obviously) he didnt make the proper call or research before he installed them. **** happens.
Me and Earl dont see eye to eye on a lot of things and we have our own thoughts on certain things (wow, 2 guys who think for themselves....who would have ever thought), we are too much alike in some respects to be honest now that I think about it. But I think he knows what he is doing and would have never consciously made a mistake like that.

wade

iTrader: (1)

lets all go to the bar and have some drinks over this tonight? i assume they would have to be e-beer's, lol

Dulluthkid_19

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Justin Olson &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Download the PDF catalog here:

http://www.carrilloind.com/05bro4.pdf

Read page 15:

PRO H VS. PRO A BEAM


Why are Pro-A rods less expensive than the H-Beam rods?

The difference lies in our manufacturing process. All Carrillo Connecting rods are manufactured in our facility in San Clemente, California. Both parts start out with the same forging; a proprietary chrome/nickel/vanadium alloy, denoted specifically as Carrilloloy, a steel mixture. The difference is that an A-Beam requires approximately 1/5th less machine time. Furthermore, we manufacture Pro-A only in large quantities to make it more cost effective. Since Carrillo Pro-A Connecting rods are offered only in limited part numbers with stock dimensions and H-bolts, labor costs are reduced as well.


Are Carrillo Pro-A rods as strong as Carrillo H-Beam rods?

We make the strongest H-Beam connecting rod for high performance applications on
the market. The Carrillo Pro-A rod is designed for less demanding and more economically oriented applications.


Why does Carrillo only offer the WMC (H-11) fastener in the
Pro-A Series of connecting rods?

In concert with the lesser-stressed applications the WMC fastener equates with the
design and application of the Pro-A connecting rod.


Does the Pro-A rod replace the H-Beam rod?

No, it is an addition to our product line. With the introduction of the Pro-A rod, Carrillo’s focus is to reach our customers who want the best connecting rod available for their particular requirements. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks for the info...So I see earl make a mistake in picking those rods for his "way over 600whp" motor...Wow, I think that actually speaks IN FAVOR of the Carillo brand and their strength...Wouldn't you think so?
Time to get Carillo H-beam rods - or are you still considering never buying Carillo any time soon? I bet Carillo Cust. Service peeps almost had a heart attack when you told them you were using these rods with how much power you're making.

Dunc

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93LSivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">To DUNC and 95GSRTT......

Im just calling it as I see it fella's. If he knew the A rods were designed for a different application Im sure he would have not used them, since he doesnt sell Carrillo (obviously) he didnt make the proper call or research before he installed them. **** happens.
Me and Earl dont see eye to eye on a lot of things and we have our own thoughts on certain things (wow, 2 guys who think for themselves....who would have ever thought), we are too much alike in some respects to be honest now that I think about it. But I think he knows what he is doing and would have never consciously made a mistake like that. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I agree with you here Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to "swing from the nuts" of Earl (I was the first to question why this happened ). I'd agree though, after seeing the PDF file....I probably would have steered away from them myself too, but **** does happen. We learn from mistakes haha.

Also, I definitely agree that thinking for yourself is a great thing. Questioning things is the only way to learn and prove that something is correct

wade: Sounds good to me, when and where? haha

PRELUDE-GT35R

I know what I should do for my next motor Again...THANKS EARL

dpetro1

nothin a couple pints of guiness cant take care of.

wade

iTrader: (1)

DUNC: i am like 70 mins away from cincy IF that, lol, see you halfway on i-71. Meet me in sparta, KY

i was in cincy 4 weeks ago to raceline to buy some ish from my ppl there.

im down, but im waiting for any minute when my cams seals arrive cuz they took a **** on me today on my way home from UofL.

GO CARDS!

earl

The high end Carillo rods look identical to Eagles and cost something like $1300. Why buy something that looks like an Eagle when you can get a Pauter for a little more than half the price.

All I did was post the truth of my experience and my opinion on a product. For doing this, I always get kicked in the face by the haters and second guessers. Now you see why a waited 3 months to post this. Maybe I should just let everyone make their own mistakes.

Boosted Chemist

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by earl &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">.

All I did was post the truth of my experience and my opinion on a product. For doing this, I always get kicked in the face by the haters and second guessers. Now you see why a waited 3 months to post this. Maybe I should just let everyone make their own mistakes. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Alot of people, me included, look to you for advice on parts and building, and post like these despite the haters are very important. Like your post on the obx diff, sure it would get the job done, but after seeing the machining i knew it was quiafe or nothing. Keep em coming

B18CXr

Now you see why a waited 3 months to post this. Maybe I should just let everyone make their own mistakes.


Nah, F the internet tunerz, the select few of us that do this day in and day out are the soul of forums like this one. The members who read and learn and appreciate from our experience are the customers you want to do business with, the rest usually get thown to the weeds sooner or later.

EBP.EM1

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Boosted Chemist &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Alot of people, me included, look to you for advice on parts and building, and post like these despite the haters are very important. Like your post on the obx diff, sure it would get the job done, but after seeing the machining i knew it was quiafe or nothing. Keep em coming </TD></TR></TABLE>

Tony the Tiger

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93LSivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Way to go ahead and try to wreak another companies image Whats funny, is in the Carrillo catalog it says plain as day that you shouldn't use these in anything more than a mild all motor build. 50hp a hole to be exact. I would blame myself for the poor choice of rod useage.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Where did Carillo state those HP figures for the Pro A rods?

The Crow

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18CXr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Now you see why a waited 3 months to post this. Maybe I should just let everyone make their own mistakes.


Nah, F the internet tunerz, the select few of us that do this day in and day out are the soul of forums like this one. The members who read and learn and appreciate from our experience are the customers you want to do business with, the rest usually get thown to the weeds sooner or later.</TD></TR></TABLE>

93preludes

very few people have the opportunity to find the limits of a part... i personally appreciate that you bring your findings to a public forum for discussion. good or bad, its always good to debate this sort of thing...

hindsight is 2020, i'm sure alot of peoples budgets appreciate the experience you're providing with this thread.

Project-D

I was going to put aq set in my 500hp Miata and the guy at Carillo told me that they were not designed for 500hp/450ish tq. I ended up buying Pauters and sold them to a friend who is running 300hp on them.

D@nnY

well over 600 hp on 250 hp rods is pushing it...

but then again so is 600 hp on stock sleeves...if nobody pushes the limits of stuff nothing will ever improve.

Turbocivic94

wtf is the point of buying a rod that can only handle 250whp. You might as well stick with stock ones.

Good post earl

Rory Breaker

All the guy was saying was that the thread is a bit misleading and that maybe the issue wasnt Carillo having a bad product (which the bloodthirsty sharks on HT will most likely interpret it as), but an overlooked application mistake, which happens.

Looks like rods that weren't designed for big power didnt hold up to big power. Earl wants to show what happened for anyone thinking of trying the same. Dan wants to make sure people dont read this and jump to conclusions about Carillo making a bad product, that this is related to application error. Nothing wrong here...

Rory Breaker

Also, before we start spreading it...

who says the a-beams are only good to 250hp? We're talking 2 extremes here...one well over 600whp and the other 250whp. What does Carillo claim these rods are capable of handling? I would have to think its neither of the above 2 figures.

Suprdave

OMG, I can't believe you used All-Motor Carillo Rods in a turbo engine making 600whp.

I looked in my Carillo Catalog and it specifically says for the Pro-A, "These Parts
are designed for applications that function at levels of approx. 50hp per cylinder"

So...maybe you owe an apology Earl?

PocketRockets Racing

quote from the carrillo Catalogue on their website, for those who read and inform themselves before using certain products,

"In addition to our uncompromised , tried and trued CArrillo H beam connecting rods, Carrillo is proud to introduce our newly designd "pro-A" configuration for those applications that require a lighter duty component. This is a stocking part that is produced in larger quantities and is limited to our more popular demsensions and part numbers"

Translation....Earl, the A beam was and is designed for allmotor and very light boost levels.
you used the wrong rod for your all out boosted applications.

The Carrillo H beam rod has been used in the 2jz and honda motors with 300 whp/cyl....1800 whp and 1200 whp respectively.

If you are going for 55 psi of boost and 1350 whp, tell Carrillo you want a rod to withstand that......and do Pauter is you want too, don't matter, the Carrillo rod will be lighter, as a result of their alloy strength and forging process.

Carrillo has proven for decades that their alloy, forging process is the strongest per gram of any steel rod. They do not catalogue a "heavy" rod like Pauter....

using a product and basically do destruction testing ( Carillo already knows and markets the A beam as a light duty rod) and posting results publicly and basically smearing a company is not proper ethics in my books.

earl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Suprdave &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">OMG, I can't believe you used All-Motor Carillo Rods in a turbo engine making 600whp.

I looked in my Carillo Catalog and it specifically says for the Pro-A, "These Parts
are designed for applications that function at levels of approx. 50hp per cylinder"

So...maybe you owe an apology Earl?</TD></TR></TABLE>Yes Dave, you are right, I owe an apology.

I hereby apoligize for thinking that a $650 Carillo rod would hold more horsepower that a $300 Eagle rod. I apoligize that a rod "created from the same material" as their $1300 half way decent rod could only be suited for the same horsepower as an OEM shot peened rod used in an allmotor car. If I had been doing my job properly, I would have chosen one of those $200 Eagle clone rods out there on the internet.

I hope this makes everyone happy, especially all the guys in the mid west that claim over 600whp daily driven on Eagles.
BTW, I exchanged the Carillos for Pauters at no charge for the customer.
I had the Carillos straightened and am now taking bids...