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Old 05-09-2012, 02:20 PM   #1
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Icon7 NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

In development since 2008, Traction Control for your s300, KPro or FlashPro will be available soon. Hondata Traction Control works by monitoring the ABS wheel speed sensors and reducing engine output when excessive wheel-spin is detected. A dash mountable switch allows the selection of different target slip rates, and software allows the system to be tuned for your specific vehicle setup. More details will be available shortly.

Price and availability: TBA

FAQ
How does it work?
Simply put, the Traction Control commands the ECU to reduce power when the driven wheels are going faster than the un-driven wheels. On-the-fly adjustment of the target slip rate can be performed using a dash mounted switch.

Will this work on my vehicle?
If you have ABS, then the ABS sensors can be utilized. If your vehicle does not have ABS but is a model which supports ABS, then only the wheel speed sensors need to be installed. If you don't have ABS and no factory vehicle has wheel speed sensors, then you will need to add your own ABS wheel speed sensors.

Is this only for race cars?
No, it works very well on street cars.

Will this work on both front and rear wheel drive vehicles?
Yes, the principle behind the wheel slip calculation is exactly the same for front and rear wheel drive.

Does the Traction Control affect the ABS operation?
The Traction Control module has high impedance capacitively coupled wheel speed inputs which do not alter the signal to the ABS computer. However, if the ABS error light illuminates, or any the ABS operation changes in any way, the vehicle should not be driven until the issue is identified and fixed.

Do I need an ABS computer, or just the wheel speed sensors?
Only the wheel speed sensors.

Do I need four wheel speed sensors?
Traction control will work with just one front and one rear speed sensor, but operation is better with four wheel speed sensors.

Will hall effect sensors work?
Yes, tie the negative side of the wheel speed sensor input to ground.

My car lifts one rear (FWD) / front (RWD) wheel off the ground when cornering. Will the traction control cope with this?
Yes, just set the speed determination method that that axle to 'fastest wheel'.
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Old 05-09-2012, 02:33 PM   #2
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Shh.
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Old 05-09-2012, 02:52 PM   #3
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

More info? How does it reduce power? Is it a closed loop system where power reduction is based on rate of slip? If closed loop, I assume full control of P, I, and D parameters?
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:15 PM   #4
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Tony.. Theres really only one smooth and effective way to pull power on a non DBW car.. I doubt its PID controlled considering that the ECU is already being taxed hard core as it is and I doubt theres enough PROC time left for PID calcs. Its probably a target slip error vs retard table. Its pretty much exactly what I was working on with JR.. I actually had the hardware done for my version a couple years ago but all the prototypes I sent out never got tested and even recently I still had issues with the reliability of testers.. Oh well. Either way, Great Job Hondata!! Can't wait to try it out..
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:20 PM   #5
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

You can only retard so far with a distributor and since ignition retard causes EGT to increase, with an open loop boost control setup you pull timing to gain traction, which causes EGT's and boost to increase. It's not the most effective way to do things on a turbo application, especially a very overpowered FWD application that likely needs a lot of help. I've always had better luck with an ignition cut vs an ignition retard.
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:21 PM   #6
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

In for more info
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:23 PM   #7
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

The best way is with retard + fuel cut/ignition cut.. Once you go a certain amount over your max error threshold, you pretty much need to start loosing cylinders or TC won't be effective.. Either way if your that far over powered you need to dial in your boost tables a little closer..

TC should only be used as a last case scenario or a final CLIP.. Its not meant to be a solution to poor power management.
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:25 PM   #8
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

I wonder if hondata is taking notes . .. lol
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:33 PM   #9
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

The fact that most FWD cars with more than 250whp have way too much power for first gear means people will try to really put TC to use. The good news is it's very easy for Hondata to impose limits and past that you need bigger tires.
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:39 PM   #10
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Is it safe to say Hondata will not let you go high and to the left with TC?
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:42 PM   #11
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by tony1 View Post
The fact that most FWD cars with more than 250whp have way too much power for first gear means people will try to really put TC to use. The good news is it's very easy for Hondata to impose limits and past that you need bigger tires.
Haha, agreed!!
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Old 05-09-2012, 07:51 PM   #12
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

'bout time. Can't wait.
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Old 05-10-2012, 12:04 AM   #13
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bugermass View Post
Tony.. Theres really only one smooth and effective way to pull power on a non DBW car.. I doubt its PID controlled considering that the ECU is already being taxed hard core as it is and I doubt theres enough PROC time left for PID calcs. Its probably a target slip error vs retard table. Its pretty much exactly what I was working on with JR.. I actually had the hardware done for my version a couple years ago but all the prototypes I sent out never got tested and even recently I still had issues with the reliability of testers.. Oh well. Either way, Great Job Hondata!! Can't wait to try it out..
if you want help testing, let me know. I've been using a crude, basic, homemade traction control for awhile.
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Old 05-10-2012, 11:48 AM   #14
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Do I need four wheel speed sensors?
Traction control will work with just one front and one rear speed sensor, but operation is better with four wheel speed sensors.

so i would have to add a front sensor? it wont just use one plus the vss?
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Old 05-10-2012, 01:01 PM   #15
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

I believe you would have to add the sensor. The traction control unit is its own box/wiring harness.
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Old 05-10-2012, 01:03 PM   #16
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Interesting. As I said in another thread, curious to see how long until actual product comes to be.
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Old 05-10-2012, 06:05 PM   #17
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

i guess ill wait for more clarification on how the sensor options will REALLY be.
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Old 05-10-2012, 08:33 PM   #18
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Everyones gonna be haulin *** !!!
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:27 PM   #19
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

in for more info!!!!
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:41 PM   #20
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Cars without ABS from factory will need ABS wheel sensor and axle/hub with ring gear.
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Old 05-11-2012, 02:13 AM   #21
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Can wait to try that on my cheap s300
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Old 05-11-2012, 04:29 AM   #22
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Quote:
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Cars without ABS from factory will need ABS wheel sensor and axle/hub with ring gear.
it said you could use a hall sensor. People are selling kits for those, im sure the kits will follow suit.
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Old 05-11-2012, 06:30 AM   #23
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

very cool hondata.. glad to see you guys keep improving an already great product..

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Old 05-11-2012, 12:28 PM   #24
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by tony1 View Post
The fact that most FWD cars with more than 250whp have way too much power for first gear means people will try to really put TC to use. The good news is it's very easy for Hondata to impose limits and past that you need bigger tires.
LOL.. I think this is funny.
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Old 05-16-2012, 02:24 AM   #25
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Default Re: NEWS: HONDATA Will Be Offering Traction Control for S300, K-Pro & FlashPro!!!!!

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