calvinPGMFI

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nowtype &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

At least half of that was already done and sits in pgmfi's sourceforge account. So you reverse engineered half of everything maybe. Even then I'm sure if I asked you what was occurring at 10 different memory locations on the ROM, a good percentage of the time it would be a very convoluted gray area answer.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You know what? Start your on stuff(everything is on pgmfi right?). I did everything from scratch on the assembly ****. Because of dick heads like you.
You don't know me, you don't know what i do so leave it like this.

And at least nate tried to do something. I haven't seen any of your work... Probably you did none.

And if you are unhappy.. So let it be... I'm happy and other are...

I don't like bitching.

nowtype

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by calvinPGMFI &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

You know what? Start your on stuff(everything is on pgmfi right?). I did everything from scratch on the assembly ****. Because of dick heads like you.
You don't know me, you don't know what i do so leave it like this.

And at least nate tried to do something. I haven't seen any of your work... Probably you did none.

And if you are unhappy.. So let it be... I'm happy and other are...

I don't like bitching. </TD></TR></TABLE>

No one here believes you did everything yourself. Not a single soul. If you believe that, you are retarded. So say what you want, but not a single soul should buy it.

As for development, I've done my fair share of stuff. I'm terrible at machine coding, so I've done extremely limited amount of it, but I've done a decent amount of scripting work for Crome and primarily Gooberdata.

The bottom line is, you are not giving credit where credit is due. Its the same reason I openly bash Crome. Give credit where credit is due, and you won't have to deal with me bashing your immoral actions. Until then, I plan to just pick out every claim that I feel is invalid and say it is.

calvinPGMFI

be my guest

You should be rewarded.. You did everything

nowtype

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by calvinPGMFI &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">be my guest

You should be rewarded.. You did everything</TD></TR></TABLE>

This is a typical response of a 5 year old. I don't want credit. I didn't do anything. But there are people that did, and they deserve credit. Without someone like lets say, Doc, you would have had to work 5x harder. Are you tossing him some change for his contributions? Are you saying anything about how much information he has provided? Nope, and thats a problem. People really need to understand even though they put in a lot of work, they should still give credit where credit is due. Hopefully this way of thought will catch up to you sooner than later.

locash

If YOU didn't do anything, then shut the hell up and let people speak for themselves.

Are you saying that these other people did work for Hondata and Neptune also?

nowtype

Hondata have followed pgmfi for a while. Everyone knows it. But they were ahead of the curve. Most recognize that their original product was their work. They really revolutionized editing the stock Honda ROM.

As for Neptune, I called James out when his product came out too. Again, he was more ahead of the curve than others, but I still stated that his involvement with pgmfi and the fact he definitely got assistance on some level or another from pgmfi should have been noted. I'm sure if you look back on those threads, you will see comments saying similar things, probably from a different name. That was me. I'm pretty consistent.

Calvin has been associated with pgmfi in a more active way than James. I know he's done work and looked at the commenting on the disassembled ROMs. He, like John Cui, have used pgmfi more as a source than the other two people, and they should just come out and say it. Because of their actions, I don't get to read posts by guys like Doc anymore, and that bothers me. The problem is, when you take free, detailed information, and turn it into a profit without even giving a bit of credit to the source, you are an immoral person. I have a personal problem with that and will say so. If you have a problem with that, I'm sorry you feel that way.

Unsivil_audio

Dude, please just drop it. I mean ****, your bitchin about a product that hasnt even come out yet.

So what if he did base his off previous code. I'm sure isn't the first and I'm sure he wont be the last. Point being, the people that developed the code aren't bitching, so why are you?

You should be happy there is yet another EMS out there. Simply because when EMS' compete everybody wins, both price and quality wise. It really just raises the bar for the whole honda community and that my friend is what its all about, advancement.

mar778c

iTrader: (1)

I hear what you are trying to say but it does not really make sense.

According to your logic, everytime something a new product is designed, you have to acknowledge the original author. That would be like acknowledging von karman every time a new plane or rocket is designed and built.

For instance, euler-bernoulli equations completely describe fluid behavior so for the next hyper sonic plane should they be given credit?

Basically, if it is in the public domain then it is free for any use.

nowtype

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mar778c &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I hear what you are trying to say but it does not really make sense.

According to your logic, everytime something a new product is designed, you have to acknowledge the original author. That would be like acknowledging von karman every time a new plane or rocket is designed and built.

For instance, euler-bernoulli equations completely describe fluid behavior so for the next hyper sonic plane should they be given credit?

Basically, if it is in the public domain then it is free for any use.</TD></TR></TABLE>

They do have to give credit when they design new things. Ever read an academic article? You have to cite where you gathered your information from. Same thing with patents. Its a complicated process which requires you to document where you got your resources. The only time you don't need to is if its an original idea or if its common knowledge(definitions/equations basically, but even with equations the person will say, "Using _____'s equation...."). Its also call profession courtesy to thank or simply acknowledge someone that helped along the way. Calvin is suggesting he did it all himself, and it's just such a load of ****.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Unsivil_audio &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Dude, please just drop it. I mean ****, your bitchin about a product that hasnt even come out yet.

So what if he did base his off previous code. I'm sure isn't the first and I'm sure he wont be the last. Point being, the people that developed the code aren't bitching, so why are you?

You should be happy there is yet another EMS out there. Simply because when EMS' compete everybody wins, both price and quality wise. It really just raises the bar for the whole honda community and that my friend is what its all about, advancement.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I don't give a **** about the Honda community. I don't care if this software costs $.99. It wouldn't change my life in the least. I like open source development. When you take a free trade of ideas, then ****** them up, repackage them, and sell them off you are a douche bag. Sorry for not liking people who are douche bags. You're a consumer, so you don't care as long as you get the best product for the best price. I'm not consuming anything so I have a far different perspective of importance. Neither is right or wrong, just different.

mar778c

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nowtype &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

They do have to give credit when they design new things. Ever read an academic article? </TD></TR></TABLE>

Not exactly, designing a new product is not the same writing a article.
I working for 15 yrs as a engineer designing new products. Not once have I ever had to give credit to Newton, Helmholtz, etc. for a product were we used equations which describe electromagnetic or mechanics. You can't mix academic articles with commerical products. Like I said, if the information is in the public domain then it is free for any use commerical or otherwise, unless they have a patent or copy right restriction.

Yes, I've read many academic articles and when I used that information to write a paper of course you cite the author.


Modified by mar778c at 12:47 PM 4/26/2007

nowtype

All I'm suggesting is that credit be given to who it should be. They are acting like they did everything, and its clearly not the case. Since, as you said, it is free information, they don't owe them any money. They should have some respect for the person that helped them. Again, it comes down to that professional courtesy. If some guy in the office you worked with designed something you found very useful for your project, would you simply ignore the fact he indirectly helped you a great deal? If you did, you'd be a douche bag.

dpaton

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nowtype &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">All I'm suggesting is that credit be given to who it should be.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Why don't you wait until the program is actually released to bitch and complain, instead of guessing about something that very few have seen, and is at this point, still incomplete on some level?

Oh, and since this is an information thread about the function and capability of ECTune, I suggest less threadjacking regarding conjecture about the work done, the credit due, and whatever other crap you choose to post about.

Unsivil_audio

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nowtype &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I don't give a **** about the Honda community. I don't care if this software costs $.99. It wouldn't change my life in the least. I like open source development. When you take a free trade of ideas, then ****** them up, repackage them, and sell them off you are a douche bag. Sorry for not liking people who are douche bags. You're a consumer, so you don't care as long as you get the best product for the best price. I'm not consuming anything so I have a far different perspective of importance. Neither is right or wrong, just different.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Makes sense, guess I just see it differently than you.

gaskleppie

nowtype, If we must thank anyone it will be Honda him self! The basecode is P72, all the other coding is done by Calvin.

How do I know? I am the first eCtune tester because Calvin is 1 of my best personal friends. I tested eCtune from the first bit. I saw it grow and develop. I heard Calvin about how the "others" did made there software and why he did it different to get better results. So, yes! He have seen the coding of the "other" brands, but no, he didn't use it!

So basically he has NOT USED any code from the "others". The basecode is original Honda, the rest is programmed by Calvin.


I suggest you change your name in "iritype" and shut up! You know nothing and you're only suggesting what you are thinking.

I don't have to thank anyone but Honda and Calvin!

MindEracer

iTrader: (1)

As a small time developer on PGMFI.org.. YES, I have contributed in the past to pgmfi.org, mainly to the developement of CROME plugins.. I developed code/plugins for myself and my friends.. I originally shared them because I wanted give back to the community as best I could. I have no problem with Calvin's product..

Calvin deserves alot of credit for what he has developed.. He has spent countless hours testing and developing code, that I KNOW calvin wrote himself.. He completely rewrote the dataloging code that is used by the freeware programs(Correct me if I'm wrong, Calvin).. and how the ecu communicates with the external logger.. He found all of the memory locations and routines that have not been shared on PGMFI.org or even discovered by some of the other commercial tuning solutions.

Calvin, re-wrote countless routines of the stock assembly code that were inefficient for our extreme tuning purposes. This is very evident if you have any knowledge of what going on in the honda code.

Have you looked at the screen shots. The tuning interface is beautiful. Oh, yeah he developed that too Developing the the tuning interface isn't easy

Have you looked at the features list? It's obvious that he DID some extreme developement that NO ONE else has done on PGMFI.org..
Here..
Let me Highlight them for you..

************************************************** ********************

Main Rom Features:

* High and low cam tables with size 24x20
* High and low load vtec window(tps based)
* Secondary maps(second set of high / low cam maps)
* High and low cam rev limiter with fuel cut/ ignition cut/ fuel and ignition cut
* Electronic boost controller(gear or rpm dependent)
* Manual dual/tri/quad stage boost controller
* Cold, hot and cut on MIL boost cut protection
* 3-Step launch control with anti-lag and tps activation
* Gear depended shift light(MIL/check engine)
* 3 General purpose outputs with fuel/ignition adjustments(or ability to switch to secondary maps)
* Injector calibration with fuel offset, overall fuel trim and battery compensation table
* Fuel trims: injector, overall, o2, tps tip-in, crank, postfuel.
* Gear based ignition and fuel corrections
* Target idle with IACV adjuster
* Closeloop(with use of wideband 0-5v signal)
* Support of different kinds of mapsensors
* Table load selectable: map sensor/ tps sensor/ alpha-n
* Selectable gearbox
* User adjustable fuel cut settings
* Use any input for Service Check Connector or use KOEO TPS(key on engine off & tps&gt;50%)
* Ac cut and ac idle recovery
* Disable Ignition correction above X mBar
* Starter signal disable
* Fuel pump control
* Alternator disable
* Control radiator fan with any output

Main Software Features:

* Datalogging:
o Fast datalogging of 80 parameters
o Live Tuner graphs( time vs AFR, rpm vs AFR/Boost)
o Save logs for later analyzing, view in Grap mode
o Export to CSV
o Custom Data display
o Warning range for most parameters
o Graph templates for different type analyzing
* Realtime Updating
o Fast updating of the rom
o Upload a calibration only(less then 1 seconds)
o Upload the base code(less then 4 seconds)
* Easy to use interface
o Lots of options and data still organized
* Basemap creator
o Selectable Ecu's
o Selectable Basemaps for different engines
o Adjust mapsensor during creation
o Adjust injectors during creation
o Select amount of columns, boost fuel, boost retard
* View and clear error codes
* Automatic software updates
* Table editing
o Easy table editing
o Auto Adjust selection based on wideband reading and target afr
o Interpolate Row and Columns
o Smooth Map or Smooth Selection
* Table Graphs
o 2d presentation of data
o 3d presentation of data
o Advance visual editing of tables
* Map trails feature; You can see where the ecu read during a run, combined with rpm vs Afr/Boost you have powerful tool(see help file)
* Tuner Graphs(Live plots)
o live Time vs AFR
o live rpm vs Afr/Boost
o rpm vs Accel(in development)
* Read or write chips
* eCtune uses universal calibrations which are rombase version independent
* Snapshot manager
o Make snapshots during tuning. Roll back an old calibration fast.
* Export/Import tables only
* 3 user configurable analog inputs
* 3 inputs for wideband logging
* Different predefined widebands or use custom volt to afr table
* Tools for Injector Calibration, Tps Calibration, Timing Sync, Boost Tables and Killing Injectors
* Auto detects all hardware connected. Never again you need to know what comm port is what

Yeah, Very NICE... It's not even done being developed..

************************************************** *********************

After I posted the list, I realize how many of the features are not publicly developed or released on pgmfi.org.. and that's all of them. These are all his own. And the ones that are on pgmfi.org, Calvin already had developed before they were released or he helped develop them..


Relax, dude enjoy the NEW option you have to tune your car.. Stop bashing, eCtune is for the good of the Honda Community...

For future and accurate info with out the bashing look here.. http://www.ectune.com/ .. There is a nice forum to discuss the features and interact with people that are actually using the software


Modified by MindEracer at 11:10 AM 4/27/2007

1CamSol

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gaskleppie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I saw it grow and develop. I heard Calvin about how the "others" did made there software and why he did it different to get better results. So, yes! He have seen the coding of the "other" brands, but no, he didn't use it!

So basically he has NOT USED any code from the "others". The basecode is original Honda, the rest is programmed by Calvin.
</TD></TR></TABLE>


O of course. Who would have guessed. I'm sure it didn't just end there either. You guys really like to twist stuff around and make yourself sound so righteous and innocent. I'm sure your program is amazing, mostly because of the so many excellent resources you have to work from.

MindEracer

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2CamKilla &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">O of course. Who would have guessed. I'm sure it didn't just end there either. You guys really like to twist stuff around and make yourself sound so righteous and innocent. I'm sure your program is amazing, mostly because of the so many excellent resources you have to work from.</TD></TR></TABLE>

???????? You have No idea, what you are talking about... Why did you post?

blundar

I'm in Rochester airport right now and can't write a more detailed response.

If I see any more bitching and public nonsense, there will be larger repercussions than just some bruised egos on honda-tech.

1CamSol

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MindEracer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

???????? You have No idea, what you are talking about... Why did you post?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I didn't have time to write a short story to be more clear I guess and I held back what I really wanted to say cause I didn't feel like starting a argument. And I posted it cause I felt like it.

WHITFIELD-TUNED

I AM going to reply to this thread later on because I'm on my sidekick right now but I just wanted to say one thing

I read in one of your posts where you said that calvin did not give credit or "props" to those who have helped along the way, and you also stated the same reguarding john c. Developer of crome . Well I will tell you this 1st off calvin has helped me over the past year or so with issues that I have had with other software (even though he did not have a vested interest in these softwares) and now he has helped me with eCtune. PERIOD as for JOHN C. Not giving thanks to pgmfi.org, people... then can you explain to me why there is a toggle button on the main screen of crome that allows users to donate money to pgmfi...??? That sounds like giving back... to me .... just my opinion though....... but guess what I QAM ENTITLED to it

gaskleppie

And now some better news!

RedR

more pics of the girl

calvinPGMFI

boy boys boys

brains

Damn that's a lot of reading......but i still have one question for nowtype:

If there are others who should be thanked/credited by CalvinPGMFI why aren't they replying themselves?
All I keep reading is that YOU say that a lot of people are not given enough credit.

alphajesse

Regardless of what they feel, they probably don't want to get involved... at least publicly.