vectorsolid

Hi guys, I did some quick searching and couldn't find the answer, so here I am.

Assuming I'm quite ruthless about what gets removed on a 1989 civic, how much weight can be removed by going to a fiberglass front end?

Also who makes the cool molded lexan windows?

Also, I found Franks, but am unable to find MB products online. Anybody with a link?

Many thanks.
-Vector

DaveF

what are you building the car for?

imo, you might as well leave the stock sheetmetal/windows/interior, and start.... no need to "start" with a full out race car.

vectorsolid

Dave, appreciate the comments.

Car is for drag racing only. No dual purpose.

Long time domestic drag racer, looking to do something out of the ordinary and get my feet wet with a Civic. I have a full on fabrication shop, and half the fun for me personally is doing all the fab work that scares everybody else. Really, I'm looking forward to the fun of putting a cage in it, sheet metal work, and building window stuff and hanging the nose, etc. Also, I have an 18 year old son that is showing some interest now that we're talking import, so would be a nice father son project. In fact, I like the fab work more than the track time. Son can drive this car, I just want to build it.

I know what we can do, and with what budget on a V8 car, and I've never been all that worried about weight with a 12 second bracket car. Just start it and go. I have noticed that to get any kind of power to weight ratio in sport compact, you need to think through the lightening process or lighten your wallet in the engine bay. ...lol...

I also have realistic expectations on this finished project. If we can run (dependable) high 13's, (or low 9's high 8's in the 1/8th) I'll be tickled pink (1800' elevation). I want to have something that needs to be run through the water box. I don't want to drive around it.

If I can get this to around a power to weight ratio of 9-10:1 I'll be content for now. 2000# car with say 200-230hp. And that seems pretty fair based on what I read here and elsewhere. B16 with some bolt ons and a few "bolt-ins". No NOS, normally aspirated. I want a simple, clean engine bay, with as little wiring and extraneous items as possible.

Right now, I'm accumulating parts (and knowledge).

Talk is cheap, we'll see where I am in a month. Went down today and looked at a 1989 civic dx a mile from here, and have talked to another dude that has one with the b16a conversion already done. Save a little time.


Modified by vectorsolid at 4:14 PM 9/27/2007


Modified by vectorsolid at 4:24 PM 9/27/2007

Gravy

That is awesome. I wish my pops was into racing.

0Golden Eagle

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by vectorsolid &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Dave, appreciate the comments.

Car is for drag racing only. No dual purpose.

Long time domestic drag racer, looking to do something out of the ordinary and get my feet wet with a Civic. I have a full on fabrication shop, and half the fun for me personally is doing all the fab work that scares everybody else. Really, I'm looking forward to the fun of putting a cage in it, sheet metal work, and building window stuff and hanging the nose, etc. Also, I have an 18 year old son that is showing some interest now that we're talking import, so would be a nice father son project. In fact, I like the fab work more than the track time. Son can drive this car, I just want to build it.

I know what we can do, and with what budget on a V8 car, and I've never been all that worried about weight with a 12 second bracket car. Just start it and go. I have noticed that to get any kind of power to weight ratio in sport compact, you need to think through the lightening process or lighten your wallet in the engine bay. ...lol...

I also have realistic expectations on this finished project. If we can run (dependable) high 13's, (or low 9's high 8's in the 1/8th) I'll be tickled pink (1800' elevation). I want to have something that needs to be run through the water box. I don't want to drive around it.

If I can get this to around a power to weight ratio of 9-10:1 I'll be content for now. 2000# car with say 200-230hp. And that seems pretty fair based on what I read here and elsewhere. B16 with some bolt ons and a few "bolt-ins". No NOS, normally aspirated. I want a simple, clean engine bay, with as little wiring and extraneous items as possible.

Right now, I'm accumulating parts (and knowledge).

Talk is cheap, we'll see where I am in a month. Went down today and looked at a 1989 civic dx a mile from here, and have talked to another dude that has one with the b16a conversion already done. Save a little time.


Modified by vectorsolid at 4:14 PM 9/27/2007


Modified by vectorsolid at 4:24 PM 9/27/2007</TD></TR></TABLE> for a good dad

DaveF

i highly recomend buying a 92 or newer chassis to start off with. the older cars have no engine bay room, and are just a pita to work on.

vectorsolid

Thanks guys for the kind words. Boy is 18, won't be around the house forever, got to savor whatever time I have before he goes off and does his own thing. *sigh* he's excited about it, that's a good start for a parent.

Dave, Appreciate the info, and that's good to know for later. I ended up swinging the deal tonight for the 89 with b16 swap. Guy did a good job with it so far. Let's see where I can take it.

I don't mind cutting the front off the car and running all tubes up there. That'll give me some room. especially with the one piece front.

Here's what the car has now. I didn't pay a lot for this car, but it's a good start though, and we were both happy with the deal.

(From the ad)
1989 Honda Civic DX w/ B16A.
Runs and drives good.
Street legal.
Rust free and garage kept.
DC Sport headers with full mandrel bent exhaust.
LSD
weight reduction (most interior stripped).
17" bronze racing harts with polished lips. (perfect condition)
Si seats.
Place racing motor mounts.
GSR front brakes and suspension.
Lowered 2" with Eibach Springs,Tokico blue struts, strut bars.
Momo Tornado steering wheel.
Skunk2 short shifter.

paulzy

iTrader: (1)

the fiberglass front ends aren't that light, at least in my opinion. I used to think they were super duper light as well until I tried picking one up. It's wasn't drastically heavy but it was more than I thought. The only real benefit I can see for using a one piece front end is aerodynamically and it allows you to cut the front off of the car allowing more room for a big turbo or whatever you want to cram up front.

You mentioned to want to stay N/A. If I were building an N/A car, I'd just leave the front end and take the weight off else where in the car, like a lighter suspension (single axle rear), cut out the rear floor pan and tin it, sheetmetal dash, and yadda yadda. The stock bumper(aside from the metal beam, and fenders are pretty light as it is. If anything, get a fiberglass or carbon hood skin, get a few hood pins, and you'd be set.

ExospeedAMcrx

I would think twice on the front end modification before you do anything. I'd say learn with the stock chassis and front end setup first before you start cutting away.

The reason is once you dont have a stock front end, it might limit the class you may want to run in the future, just in case you get into it more and want to compete in the major racing series'.

As far as weight savings, you wont really save much with the front end. The do have a bit of weight on them still and the savings isnt like 75% less weight. I would think it would be more just a 1/3 in weight savings.

Regarding the MB Products front ends. They are no longer making the front ends at all. From the last 3 times I've been there and discussed this with them, their business has turned to a different direction and focusing on other products unrelated to SC drag racing. We are in negotiations in purchasing their molds and planning to reproduce the front ends in limited quantities in the near future if there looks to be a market for them.

vectorsolid

Paulzy, thanks for the note. Single axle rear, got a link to a site or article? Sounds good.

ExospeedAMcrx, thanks for the note. 4 tracks near me, all will ET bracket race. and by "near", I mean about 275-300 miles one way. No plans or time to do anything other than some local entertainment on a weekend when the family isn't busy , and I have other cars to take to the strip as well, so we're spread thin.

Heck, last time we went racing (last Sunday), I even con'd my wife into running 1/8th mile in her 2004 turbo Beetle (look, we're already here, why not run the grocery getter?). She'd always watched from the pits, never behind the wheel. She ended up with a 10.969@66.8mph, sadly that was on a 11.12 dial... she broke out pretty good... ...lol... my bad on the dial, don't tell her.

Anywho, whatever happens with the car happens. I've been racing as long as the next guy, and my ego is pretty firmly in check. If I end up in the wrong class, I end up in the wrong class, but not at any of the race tracks we attend. Set your dial and give'er hell!!!! Proudly show your $20 bowling trophy to your buddies.

I still want the one piece nose. I just think it's cool, and adds some style to the car. And if it lightens it up 20 pounds, that would be great. Got to be easier to work on stuff with that though. And that "easier to work on" stuff is always nice. We're all pressed for time.


Modified by vectorsolid at 10:07 PM 9/27/2007

1 2 NV

solid rear axle for weight savings? 40lbs at the cost of 1500+
i say go for fiberglass doors now theres some weight savings. cost around 500.
wheels are a pretty cheap weight savings too. lexan

DaveF

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1 2 NV &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">solid rear axle for weight savings? 40lbs at the cost of 1500+
i say go for fiberglass doors now theres some weight savings. cost around 500.
wheels are a pretty cheap weight savings too. lexan </TD></TR></TABLE>

he could just build tubular arms with the stock spindle/hub/brakes, and that should shave some weight. and would not cost 1500 in material

i agree with paulzy about the fiberglass front not being all that light, honestly i wouldnt be suprised if all the oem front end weighs less than some of the glass stuff ive seen out there. the front on our hotrod coupe weighs 50lbs !

1 2 NV

when i went from a stripped street car to a full blown race car i dropped 300lbs. that was cut front core support, 1 piece front end, lexan, doors, tailgate, interior. all that was remaining was a gutted dash, driver and passenger seats.

SpeedSceneScott

I got a '91 CRX that I am working on. Did the K24 swap. Went with a glass front end, doors, and glass rear hatch as well as the lexan windows. I am not sure how much weight was saved with the front end since the stock stuff is real light. It does look cool and gives the car a real "racecar" look. But I kind of wished I stuck with the stock stuff so as to fit the SFWD class. Thats a real cool class and lots of cars are racing it.
You can check out my car at speedsceneracing.com and visit the racecar project page. I took it apart, did some chassis work, and am painting it now. Will assemble it and get ready to go racing.
Like you, part of the fun is doing the stuff yourself so I am doing almost all the work myself. Sure, the paint job my not be perfect, but I did it myself at home for $100.00 bucks.
If part of the fun is cutting and welding on the car, Do it!
Have fun and support Sport Compact racing.
(BTW, I got the MB stuff off a guy on ebay. I think the MB guys may not make that stuff anymore. They are located in Bakersfield california and I think they are doing VW stuff now.)

2fastGSR

You stated you wanted the car to weigh around 2000lbs? Shouldnt be too hard, definitely focus on putting some power in that b16 in my opinion!

for a cool dad-

My pops runs a NHRA Comp Elim car and when we can pry him away from that long enough to work on our stuff its a fun night !!!

paulzy

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2fastGSR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
You stated you wanted the car to weigh around 2000lbs? Shouldnt be too hard, definitely focus on putting some power in that b16 in my opinion!

for a cool dad-

My pops runs a NHRA Comp Elim car and when we can pry him away from that long enough to work on our stuff its a fun night !!!</TD></TR></TABLE>

true. What are the 89 hatchbacks rated at for factory curb weight? Like 2100 something?

STREETWERKZ

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by vectorsolid &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I also have realistic expectations on this finished project. If we can run (dependable) high 13's, (or low 9's high 8's in the 1/8th) I'll be tickled pink (1800' elevation). </TD></TR></TABLE>


no need to lighten it at all for those times. work on the engine a little, add slicks. easy.

h22chilton

i have got almost, if not right at 300 lbs. out of sedan as well, i only lack the front end, which is why i wish some one could answer the actual wieght differences
mine will always be driven on the street, regardless.





for the op, i would start w/ the basic strip, or as we said in 1998, a stage 2 wieght reduction, lol. dry ice all the sound deadening material out, strip the fire wall etc. and DIY is always an option.

boosted94cx

stage 2???

lol......waste time playing video games much?

h22chilton

joke ha ha lol expletivetard

jdm_dc_fan

iTrader: (1)

your hatch is already light as it is,
so cf hood
no bumper sopport,
lenso slicks and skinnies
gutted interior
fiberglass bucket seat
fiberglass doors
lexan window
shold get u inder 2k pounds

heres a link you wanted. they are kind of expensive considering people make then themselves with homedepot parts for alot less.

http://www.flex-a-lite.com/aut....html

aimmotorsports

you can build a rear axle for fairly cheap. i think i have about $100 into mine. espicaly if you have some scrap laying around...

jjspec

My one piece front end weighs 38 lbs.

h22chilton

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by aimmotorsports &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you can build a rear axle for fairly cheap. i think i have about $100 into mine. espicaly if you have some scrap laying around...</TD></TR></TABLE>

pics??

Garage 808 Hatch

the weight savings really do not come from the fibergalss unit, IMO, its all the crap you can remove when you use it. core support, all lights, tons of sheet metal etc. and with the solid rear, yea, you save weight by removing the factory trailing arms etc, as well as getting rid of all the crap on the bottom of the spare tire well.