bergenholtzracing

I figured I would ask everyone what they think of the GM/Rouch camp participating in Sport Compact Drag Racing and its effect on:

1. Fans
2. Competitiors in PROFWD and especially HotROd.
3. Growth of competitors in Hot Rod and ProFWD

The reason why I put this topic at hand because it has been of bitter debate whether or not is is deemed FAIR competition to have this TYPE of team with their caliber and resources compete against the little guy. You have a NASCAR caliber team competing against all us little guys in the sport. Bergenholtz Racing's standpoint is one where we dont really give a sh*t. It is difficult but what are you gonna do but say "Never say die". Competitors in the Hotrod class and PROFWD have complained about this discrepency. Individuals in Hotrod have said they would like to race where GM is not, another reason why NOPI Hot Rod class is flourishing. They don't have to deal with the dollars of GM. GM does not attend Nopi races. Could it possibly be that GM has killed any type of hope of Hot rod cars being built to compete in that class. "How am I gonna compete against that GM Sunfire and all that money?" (Nameless Hotrod competitor.)

I remeber when the class was soooo big, sometimes 16 or more cars big. Then GM came in with that Sunfire and presently the Hotrod class has diminished. Why????

This is just something that has been of talk for quite some time but has not been brought to a public attention.

Tell me what you guys think????????????

bomber

I think this was talked about a lot in this thread:

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=837442

Suprdave

In Hot Rod, alot of teams will be bridging the gap...by next season I think. There was already a big money\small money discrepency even before GM.

Seriously tho, you say you guys don't give a ****...so why are you trying to stir **** up?

GOLDMEMBER

GM and Mopar are old news. they need to move them somewhere else than Hot Rod , they are stinking up the class

THCk20eg

imagine if honda had a race team like that. it would be over for sure. its like gm being microsoft, and us being everything else. **** bill gates, **** gm. haha

TyCooley

GO to nopi then. most of the time gm or mopar aren't there. just $0.02

N2O

We are the little guys also. No money just trying to work things out and go racing. You say that Nopi Hot Rod is Flourishing. I disagree we just got home from the Gateway race and there was only 11 Pro4 cars.

I can give my opinion on how I feel about big money being in these classes but it is not going to change anything. They are here and I do not see them going anywhere.

X-Mazda 3 Racer

Ron, This has been covered on a few different places, all with the same result. Here is my take, the answer is if you can't take the heat, go to Nopi. Granted, NOPI has very, very fast cars also, but no GM. What if some independent guy started taking over the class. Would you deem it unfair to have him in there because he doesn't have to deal with the corporate **** like GM does? We all have to evolve here and make the step to the next level. If we CHOOSE ( and I say choose because no-body is making you stay in whatever class you are participating in ) Again, If we CHOOSE to stay in the class deemed a "PRO" class, then we have to expect some actual Professionals like the GM team to step in. We cannot discriminate the big teams. After all, with their introduction, they have the ability to draw in new $$$ for other teams that can compete. Also, alot of us want to be treated like "Pro's", so we need to suck it up and act like them. A professional race team is more than a few friends that get together on race day and try to win. Testing, Testing, Testing, Breaking parts to find the weak link and spending alot of $ to do so, planning, dedication, craziness, sleeplessness.....all of these things and more can be yours if you want to run a professional team.

I may have gotten a bit off course, but my point is this. Alot of the people bitching about the big $ teams are running in a Pro class. EXPECT THE PRO'S TO JOIN THE RACE!!!!! I know that our team is very capable of being one of the top competitors in our class. If we all could quit our jobs, work full time on the car and get paid for it, YES, we could be one of the top, but until that day comes we have to strive to get to every race and hope that an act of God happens to allow one of us to win a race. We cannot push these big teams out. We have to give them their credit where it is due. The GM team knew NOTHING ( and I mean nothing ) about drag racing before the beginning of the year. They went through it all with a little help from the former GM team members and such. If they can do it, anyone can. If money is the deciding factor in drag racing for you, then maybe you shouldn't be doing it!!?!?!! Racing is not a poor mans sport. It can make a rich man poor, but that is the sacrifice for the hobby we all have grown to love.

I say that the big money teams give all of us something to shoot for. Being able to have big money PRO racing comes with a price....................

My .02

MrParks

well i do have some issues with them but you know you were playing in there home turf you just got to go with what you got even if its nothing at all, were all here to compete in the class of choice in nhra sportcompact its just how well your going to do in THERE series, and yes they are big guys in the ''NHRA''sportcompact drag world but just remember who yoou are, and what you did for the sport,and soon youll break'm off some of that import ****, but tilll then you got to be on your game.dont worry about them. see, there doing there thing, DO YOURS AND DONT WORRY ABOUT THEM ,THINGS HAPPEN FOR A REASON , IT MAY JUST PUSH YOU THAT MUCH MORE...

bergenholtzracing

I just had some opinions from other teams voicing how they feel to me soooooo I figured I would bring it up in this forum. In any case a lot of good feedback from all of you for others to see and bring hope to the classes. As far as my standpoint is concerned the same position goes, i don't give a sh*t. And as far as starting sh*t with GM .........................everyone know at the races that I always start shiznit with them all of the time and in their faces straight up.

Arturbo

Good for the sport. If we didnt have someone to chase we'd be slower than you are now. GM is willing to help out the sport more than people realize. Most people are not behind the scenes to know how much they are willing to help, they only see from one point of view.

We dont say mazda has hurt the sport, but they have helped more than anything. Know what I am saying?? Maybe not and I dont expect most people to see that.

art

Hispeed

So if gm peeks there head into NOPI, will compact car racing go away? I hope not! but considering nopi probably has more attendies, it wouldn't surprise me that hey would do just that. After all, they are in the sport to market their products. I think it's a good thing they are in the sport. It makes people strive harder and push the limits that would of taken alot longer had they not joined. Sure Gm is winning most races but few others are not far behind. As far as money is concerned, that is true for any sport. There will always be someone with more money than the other. I am sure Rado is not gripping about GM's money. Another thing that I noticed is that even though I drive a honda, I must say that they are very very helpful and are a pleasure to talk to. In short, I think they are truely an asset to the sport of compact car racing. My 2 cents.

Chuck P

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GoldenEagleMfg.com &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Ron, This has been covered on a few different places, all with the same result. Here is my take, the answer is if you can't take the heat, go to Nopi. Granted, NOPI has very, very fast cars also, but no GM. What if some independent guy started taking over the class. Would you deem it unfair to have him in there because he doesn't have to deal with the corporate **** like GM does? We all have to evolve here and make the step to the next level. If we CHOOSE ( and I say choose because no-body is making you stay in whatever class you are participating in ) Again, If we CHOOSE to stay in the class deemed a "PRO" class, then we have to expect some actual Professionals like the GM team to step in. We cannot discriminate the big teams. After all, with their introduction, they have the ability to draw in new $$$ for other teams that can compete. Also, alot of us want to be treated like "Pro's", so we need to suck it up and act like them. A professional race team is more than a few friends that get together on race day and try to win. Testing, Testing, Testing, Breaking parts to find the weak link and spending alot of $ to do so, planning, dedication, craziness, sleeplessness.....all of these things and more can be yours if you want to run a professional team.

I may have gotten a bit off course, but my point is this. Alot of the people bitching about the big $ teams are running in a Pro class. EXPECT THE PRO'S TO JOIN THE RACE!!!!! I know that our team is very capable of being one of the top competitors in our class. If we all could quit our jobs, work full time on the car and get paid for it, YES, we could be one of the top, but until that day comes we have to strive to get to every race and hope that an act of God happens to allow one of us to win a race. We cannot push these big teams out. We have to give them their credit where it is due. The GM team knew NOTHING ( and I mean nothing ) about drag racing before the beginning of the year. They went through it all with a little help from the former GM team members and such. If they can do it, anyone can. If money is the deciding factor in drag racing for you, then maybe you shouldn't be doing it!!?!?!! Racing is not a poor mans sport. It can make a rich man poor, but that is the sacrifice for the hobby we all have grown to love.

I say that the big money teams give all of us something to shoot for. Being able to have big money PRO racing comes with a price....................

My .02</TD></TR></TABLE>
I couldn't have said it better myself

Mr. Bergenholtz, why do you single out GM? is it because their on top? If Gardella was on top would the same questions be raised? I've also been reading the boards for a while now and I've noticed that you are in the middle of some kind of drama frequently..whether it's Gm,Rado,Tran and other what nots!


Modified by Sexual Chocolate at 2:47 AM 7/27/2004

bergenholtzracing

I would like to stress that this issue regarding GM is not the position of Bergenholtz Racing BUT is something that has been complained about by other teams and I had just figured to bring it out to a forum for something to be discussed about.

Other than that, I like the positive opinion being brought about the subject matter. The people who voice their opinions to me, will be able to see this positive feedback in this forum to think otherwise when lining up against companies such as GM.

GM is truly a top notch team and I have the utmost repect for them. They helped us at the Las Vegas event by leaps and bound and are helping us in information at the Ennis event. Nelson and crew are nothing but top notch guys and share and open door policy. As far as trash talking is concerned they know I am kidding around with them.

nos3tc

JUST MY 2 CENTS IS THAT MOST PEAPLE IN THIS SPORT ARE KIDS JUST GETTING THIER LICENSES TO ABOUT THE AGE 30 AND THE OLDER GUYS ARE THE VETERANS THAT BEEN HERE FROM THE BEGGING!ALOT OF US JUST WERK FOR OUR CARS AND WANT TO GO OUT AND RACE BUT WHEN U HAVE ONE BIG CORPRATE TEAM THAT COMS OUT ON MILLIONS OF DOLLORS FOR A BUDGET KILLS ALL OF US THAT JUST WERK TO GET OUT THERE I JUST WISH THIS SPORT CAN GO BACK WHERE IT WAS 5 YEARS AGO

TyCooley

I know that Ladwig has been running very good with the sunfire in the hotrodd class. but Gardella is right with him. And Kubo with Hoyos. Both ladwig and gardella are both in the same range of 8.2x's-8.0x's. All that can be said is that the GM team gets great backing. This sport needs as many racers and race cars that it can get at events to keep this sport growing which i think is the goal for everyone. How boring would the Pro FWD class be without Hoyos. Lol PRO FWD would consist of Kubo running single runs the whole weekend and collecting on sunday afternoon the check. I am in no favor of GM, heck I can't wait for Rado to get out there and kick some GM *** with all of the other Pro FWD's. But take it how you want. they have made cars and are running them and most likely WON'T STOP anytime soon if they are making an impression

$0.02

ModenaTwinTurbo

general motors is doing here what they are doing in formula one with ferrari... they are winning... this is just the GM era... it happens every so many years with different auto makers... in the early 90's durring the turbocharged f1 era it was honda's domminating the field... and now its ferrari.... they are just the better team right now... i am not saying that they are better mechanics or better engineers percee... but what i am saying is that as a look at the 'BIG PICTURE' they are the better team, better marketing to maintain a healthy and flexible budget that allows for essential R&D and competition cappabilities... they are just the better team in profwd and hotrod "FOR NOW"...


Ed-

ProstockH22crx

[QUOTE=bergenholtzracing]. Could it possibly be that GM has killed any type of hope of Hot rod cars being built to compete in that class. "How am I gonna compete against that GM Sunfire and all that money?" (Nameless Hotrod competitor.)QUOTE] Oh my god, you read my mind... I've noticed tons of unfinished racecars being sold. Like Arturbo said, there's always someone to chase right ? GM is good for the sport, they give the little guy something to shoot for. Specially when they tell you "Go sell that POS Honda and buy a Cavalier "

motecnate

There definitely needs to be parity amongst each class to maintain competitve atmosphere. For example, name any true professional motorsports that allows a single team to be so far ahead in competition without being penalized. NHRA needs to be more active in weight penalites to create fair competition.

GM will destroy the Pro FWD and Hotrod classes period. And it is NHRA's fault for not enforcing parity amongst these clases. Lets think about this.. What would happen if Greg Andeson ran a 6.2 and the rest of the field is running 6.7 in NHRA domestic? I know that there would be some serious penalites going on.

Then why the hell won't they add weight in GM's cars? We won't even talk about trying to make it so that other competitors can afford to get into these classes. Revision of rules need to be addressed. Damn soon you are going to need to have the a trillion dollars to compete against them... Oh my bad you already do....

Goood luck with trying to salvage these two classes next year! We will see who is going to be left in NHRA SC.

TyCooley

boycotte NHRA SUMMIT! Go Nopi where Mopar comes once in a while

Whitfield Inc.

My thoughts are that the teams in question are NEEDED to help us other players in the industry push harder and dig deeper. Mopar, GM and others help out everyone at the track and the ones I have meet are the coolest people out there. With out big timers coming to lay down some tire we would have less of a fan base at the events. Sure someone like me who plans to run a HotRod car next year would love to cry enouph to get the fastest cars removed so I might do better.......but the fact remains and has been said here, with out the pushing the envelope who would ( money being the factor ) ? Plus when the small guy beats the "big guy" it says something for the little guy doesn't it ???

Ron, Ed look at ALLLL that you guys have done in the past 10+ years with mostly HARD work and YOUR money ------- you guys pave the way

Jason

Captn. Save A Hoe

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSRev &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So if gm peeks there head into NOPI, will compact car racing go away? I hope not! but considering nopi probably has more attendies, it wouldn't surprise me that hey would do just that. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Thats crazy talk, GM isnt leaving NHRA..Come on now, GM leaving NHRA is like tshaq leaving L...ERRR wrong theory, but really though they wont ever leave.. Like everyone else said, the cars probably wouldnt be going this fast if it wasnt for GM. GM has made the likes of gardella, rado, etc.. strive to go faster.

I got gardella's back, even if i catch on fire and fall out a window and get hit by a bus i got your back dawg Haha what im trying to say, if you guys out there are all anti GM, build your own **** go bust that *** like gary's doing, its not like gary's robbing banks to get money, hes busting his ***. Ron, you guys shouldnt be too far behind GM, keep doing what you guys are doing and **** will fall in place.

Chris

p.s. if you think about it, GM has inspired ALLOT of teams, i mean not too long ago i heard earl and mike laskey ( a privately funded team) building a car to go "GM HUNTING".. Now stuff like that wouldnt happen if it wasnt for GM

TyCooley

GM is the team that you want to hate but want to thank for getting us this far.

fast is fun

no ****. mopar don't have the money that gm <TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GOLDMEMBER &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">GM and Mopar are old news. they need to move them somewhere else than Hot Rod , they are stinking up the class </TD></TR></TABLE>

fast is fun

honda has there head up f1's *** so maybe we shoud go with gm cars or mopar